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What if Jacksonville suddenly woke up?

Some say, Jacksonville is a diamond that wants to remain coal. What would it be like if Jacksonville were a city that didn't hate itself... led by people who acknowledged its achievements?

Published February 15, 2010 in Opinion      211 Comments    Open printer friendly version of this article Print Article


feature

Here are a few things that possibly would have happened in New York, Rome, London Paris, Seattle, or San Francisco if the leaders that made them into Great Cities had been given our city and history.


The George Washington Hotel on Adams Street, would be the premier boutique hotel in downtown, instead of the surface parking lot it is today.

The Southern Music Hall of Fame would be open and full to capacity somewhere in downtown. Molly Hatchet, Lynyrd Skynyrd and The Allman Brothers would have exhibits there and all the music aficionados would know a history of the Southernmusic and the Jacksonville music scene.

A statue of Ray Charles would stand in the perfectly preserved and popular bar where he first played soul piano and blues in the South.

There would be another museum of Black Film commemorating the achievements of black filmmakers here in Jacksonville.

Peterbrookes, The Loop Pizza and the Chicken Coop would all have gigantic headquarters in the center of town that rivaled the marooned Cruise Ship of a Building that Preston Haskell's company erected to itself on Riverside Avenue. There would be standing lines for tours of Sally Industry.

Blaire Woolverton would have her own cable show and Jake Godbold would have a cookbook.


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211 Comments

billy

July 03, 2008, 06:31:51 AM
We would be more like Boston than Birmingham.
We would have culture out the wazoo and still be a great working seaport.
We would have a massive convention center on the river,
a clean river.
You don't need an aquarium when you  protect your river and ocean.
You could send your kid to the neighborhood school,
and know that the most ambitious students will go to the Ivy League if they want,
or to a Florida university for free, but any graduate will be able to earn a living wage and raise a family, and stay.
We would produce and attract the same caliber music and performers as Nashville, Atlanta, Athens or Seattle.
 Heartbreak Hotel , Lift Every Voice and Sing, and Gimme Three Steps
were written in Jacksonville, or by people from here.
The train terminal would be a beautiful multimodal station.
You could kayak up Hogan's Creek.
Your children could walk to Sunday school downtown from Springfield without fear,
you could impress  your friends visiting from Barcelona or Brooklyn,and  you could
go hunting or throw a cast net if you wanted.
It would not matter if you were materially rich or poor, there is no other place you would want to live.

 

JoeMerchant

July 03, 2008, 07:21:50 AM
I think it could possibly do what's in the following video...

http://www.contentdg.com/blog/?p=138

tufsu1

July 03, 2008, 07:58:38 AM
I did not know that Jacksonville was a city that "hated" itsellf...

This is very odd to me, because most of the people I talk to who live here seem to think its a pretty nice place!

David

July 03, 2008, 09:06:18 AM
Meh, it's getting better in recent years with the urban renewal momentum that's building, even if it does sputters at times. The inferiority  complex is felt mostly by the natives who are incredibly defensive over our city. Especially those who have traveled a good bit to other places and have seen how simple things can make a city great. I never felt the insecurity complex more than the week leading up to the 2005 superbowl. I’m sitting on the sidewalk outside of London Bridge and Philly & Patriots fan are constantly stopping by and asking “where’s some cool clubs? Where can I get food, how do I get around without a car?" This was before Bay St had anything, before even Burrito gallery, Café 331 and the new clubs at the landing were open and the northbank riverwalk hadn't been finished yet. So when you look at it that way, that’s not bad for  3 years time. As for getting around without a car, yea that's a ways off for now. We still need more late dining options downtown though, and something to pull more people in towards the river.




second_pancake

July 03, 2008, 09:13:14 AM
I did not know that Jacksonville was a city that "hated" itsellf...

This is very odd to me, because most of the people I talk to who live here seem to think its a pretty nice place!

Do any of these people live in urban areas or do they all live in the suburbs...St. John's county perhaps?  Jacksonville will always appear to be a "nice place" when you shut yourself out from the reality of what it is and what it has the potential to become (good and bad).  For the majority of residents of suburban Jacksonville, you could transport them in their sleep to any other suburban destination in any other state and when they woke up they'd have no idea they ever left Jacksonville.  Is that how you want to live, in a cookie-cutter world completely devoid of passion and culture?

What the author was speaking about (correct me if I'm wrong) is a sense of pride in our roots and pride in our city, the original city, downtown, of which, the powers-that-be who determine what course of action is going to be taken regarding the best interests of our city, have none.

In my opinion, it truely is unfortunate that so many of our communities which are so far disconnected from the urban core, are considered to be, Jacksonville.  It's an injustice to what could be done for and in those smaller communities as well as what could be done for downtown.  Orange Park is over 30 minutes away from downtown Jacksonville by highway, the intercoastal communites and the beaches are even further.  People who live in those areas have a tendancy to stay in those areas because they have no reason to venture into downtown for anything other than a couple of games or shows and then they're out and back home.

So, again, depending on where you live in 'Jacksonville' and how much you choose to see/learn, it's either going to be "nice" or it will resemble a teenage girl with self-esteem issues, looking at fashion mags and trying to emulate Gisele Bundchen.

Eazy E

July 03, 2008, 10:16:21 AM
The Southern Music Hall of Fame would be open and full to capacity somewhere in downtown. Molly Hatchet, Lynyrd Skynyrd and The Allman Brothers would have exhibits there and all the music aficionados would know a history of the Southern music and the Jacksonville music scene


well, maybe Jacksonville having incompetent leadership isn't such a bad thing after all...

thelakelander

July 03, 2008, 10:31:38 AM
A Southern Music Hall of Fame would also have to include Ray Charles, James Weldon Johnson and Blind Blake, the King Of Ragtime Guitar.

tufsu1

July 03, 2008, 10:33:56 AM
I did not know that Jacksonville was a city that "hated" itsellf...

This is very odd to me, because most of the people I talk to who live here seem to think its a pretty nice place!

Do any of these people live in urban areas or do they all live in the suburbs...St. John's county perhaps?  Jacksonville will always appear to be a "nice place" when you shut yourself out from the reality of what it is and what it has the potential to become (good and bad). 

Some people live in the suburbs...others in established neighborhoods like Riverside and Springfield....I, for one, live downtown....and, yes, I agree there is much potential that has often been squandered....but its still a pretty nice place to live!

If you don't like it, you can always move!

stephendare

July 03, 2008, 10:48:44 AM
tufsu!  read the whole article instead of just the blurb.

thebrokenforum

July 03, 2008, 10:49:41 AM
Quote
If you don't like it, you can always move!

You shouldn't get offended. I don't think that's the point of the article. A lot of people here do have an inferiority complex - just bring up the topic of the Jags moving or Tony Kornhieser to see examples. The major point of this article is, I think, the diamond in the coal analogy, which is so very true. Jax has some great things - if it didn't none of us would be here. But it could have some really cool stuff if it tried - if we had leaders who were progressive thinking and trying to get more investors, and if the media didn't try so hard to freak everyone out every evening.

Excellent article. Stories like these are why I continue coming here. This one, the Dixieland Park and the 30's Days stories are all excellent stuff and deserves to be in the front page spotlight. I wish the rest of the city could read this stuff because, agree or disagree, it gets people talking and that's almost always a good thing.    

David

July 03, 2008, 11:30:28 AM
i'm sure all of us at one point in time pulled the "you can move" line on people. It's a natural reaction when you listen to the type of people that bitch about how it's so much better where they're from (not saying anyone's doing that here)

but seriously, with all the transplants who brag about how much better their city is up north or outwest, it can be a drain on you as a local. One of the best lines I heard from a defensive local yokal in response to typical jacksonville smack talk was "you know, 95 is open all year round. Here's what you do, take the 95 north exit and just...drive...for ohhhhh about 15 hours and there you go! You'll be back in outragerous realestate land in no time!"

Thankfully most transplants are happy to be here, and bring some of their culture along with them.

stephendare

July 03, 2008, 11:36:15 AM
Again, thats the point of the article.  I think TUFSU just didnt read the actual story.

Add to the list a Pullman Fellows Museum to honor A Phillip Randolph.
We had an absolutely fascinating discussion the other night tying in the African American Railmen, and the Negro Baseball League and A Phillip Randolph.  I had no idea that he was such a pivotal character.

thelakelander

July 03, 2008, 11:49:48 AM
Advocates in Chicago saw the need to open a museum showcasing the works of the Civil Rights leader that grew up in Jacksonville.

Quote
The A. Philip Randolph Pullman Porter Museum was founded in 1995 by Lyn Hughes, its current director. The facility is located in the Historic Pullman District in Chicago. The facility is named after men who made history - Asa Philip Randolph and Pullman Porters who made up the membership of the Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters (BSCP) union. Randolph was the chief organizer and founder of the BSCP, the first African-American labor union in the country to win a collective bargaining agreement. With the help of Randolph, the Pullman Porters fought a valiant battle for employment equality with the corporate giant, the Pullman Rail Car Company.

These pioneering efforts created the first bona fied union for the African American worker. This victorious struggle in America’s early labor movement was also the doorway through which many civil rights gains were made.

The A. Philip Randolph Museum is locally recognized as a historic site and is a unique addition to the tourism sites of the Pullman community of Chicago, Illinois. The Museum is also nationally recognized as a valuable and unique African-American museum. The A. Philip Randolph museum pays tribute to one of the most influential African-American leaders in history. A. Philip Randolph redefined American labor, American democracy, and American society. During a time when it was unsafe and unpopular, Randolph demanded that African-American people be fully and equally included in American society. A. Philip Randolph was an intelligent and fair leader who devoted decades of his life to his vision of a more moral and civilized American society. A Philip Randolph was a great man, a great humanitarian, and a great American.

http://aphiliprandolphmuseum.com/


About the life of Philip Randolph
Quote
A. Philip Randolph was born April 15,1889 in Crescent City, Florida. He was one of two sons. His parent's names were Reverend James Williams and Elizabeth Robinson Randolph, who were both dependents of slaves.
 
He and his family moved to Jacksonville in 1891. This was the place where he and his brother attended school. They both excelled by being the top in their classes at the Cookman Institute. After school, he was reduced to menial work. In the spring of 1911, he traveled to New York with a friend, secretly hoping to become an actor. He took classes at City College, and bowing to his parents objections to an acting career, switched from drama to politics and economics, soon joining the socialist party. During this time Randolph met his future wife, Lucille Green, a 31 year old widow from Christianburg, Virginia.

Randolph soon met another friend from North Carolina. His name was Chandler Owen. He was studying sociology and political science at Columbia University. They both shared the same ideas and would soon become soap box orators and establish THE MESSENGER, a radical Harlem magazine, in 1917.

He organized The Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters which was considered the first serious effort of unionizing the Pullman company. The Pullman company was the most powerful business organization in the country, and it viciously resisted efforts to unionize.

full story: http://www.phila.k12.pa.us/schools/randolph/A_P_Randolph.html

xian1118

July 03, 2008, 12:14:35 PM
Quality article SD. For all the talk of liking and disliking Jacksonville, more people need to step up and show the pride they have for the city.  As a life-long resident and self-proclaimed "ambassador" for the city, it's important that every single one of us take responsibility to transform the city into the exceptional place we all know it has the potential to be...instead of bitching about all the things that hold us back. It will be a fine day when the participants of this website and other young inspired voices take the next step to hold City Council seats and realize these dreams.

BridgeTroll

July 03, 2008, 12:21:06 PM
Quote
I wish the rest of the city could read this stuff because, agree or disagree, it gets people talking and that's almost always a good thing.   

Absolutely!

stephendare

July 03, 2008, 12:59:46 PM
Quality article SD. For all the talk of liking and disliking Jacksonville, more people need to step up and show the pride they have for the city.  As a life-long resident and self-proclaimed "ambassador" for the city, it's important that every single one of us take responsibility to transform the city into the exceptional place we all know it has the potential to be...instead of bitching about all the things that hold us back. It will be a fine day when the participants of this website and other young inspired voices take the next step to hold City Council seats and realize these dreams.

Thanks xian!  Its from the heart.

Lake or Ock. what was the connection with the Negroe Baseball League?

thelakelander

July 03, 2008, 01:32:36 PM



Jacksonville's Negro League baseball team was known as the Jacksonville Redcaps before relocating to Cleveland in 1939.  A large segment of Jacksonville's early African-American population worked with the railroads.  Many black men worked as "RedCaps" or "Porters" (men who helped passengers with their baggage and supplies).  Randolph organized the Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters

Quote
Randolph had some experience in labor organization, having organized a union of elevator operators in New York City in 1917. He was a member of Phi Beta Sigma Fraternity Inc. In 1925, Randolph organized the Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters. This was the first serious effort to form a labor institution for the employees of the Pullman Company, which was a major employer of African-Americans. With amendments to the Railway Labor Act in 1934, porters were granted rights under federal law, and membership in the Brotherhood jumped to more than 7,000. After years of bitter struggle, the Pullman Company finally began to negotiate with the Brotherhood in 1935, and agreed to a contract with them in 1937, winning $2,000,000 in pay increases for employees, a shorter workweek, and overtime pay.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A._Philip_Randolph

There's also a movie called 10,000 Black Men Named George about the Brotherhood, that comes on TV from time to time.

More about Randolph:

Quote
Philip Randolph brought the gospel of trade unionism to millions of African American households. Randolph led a 10-year drive to organize the Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters (BSCP) and served as the organization's first president. Randolph directed the March on Washington movement to end employment discrimination in the defense industry and a national civil disobedience campaign to ban segregation in the armed forces. The nonviolent protest and mass action effort inspired the civil rights movement of the 1950s and 1960s.

Asa Philip Randolph was born April 15, 1889, in Crescent City, Fla., the second son of the Rev. James William Randolph, a tailor and ordained minister in the African Methodist Episcopal (AME) Church, and Elizabeth Robinson Randolph, a skilled seamstress. In 1891, the family moved to Jacksonville, which had a thriving, well-established African American community. From his father, Randolph learned that color was less important than a person's character and conduct. From his mother, he learned the importance of education and of defending oneself physically, if necessary. Randolph remembered vividly the night his mother sat in the front room of their house with a loaded shotgun across her lap, while his father tucked a pistol under his coat and went off to prevent a mob from lynching a man in the local county jail.

Asa and his brother, James, were superior students. The Randolph brothers attended the Cookman Institute in East Jacksonville, for years the only academic high school for African Americans in Florida. Asa excelled in literature, drama and public speaking; starred on the school's baseball team; sang solos with its choir; and was valedictorian of the 1907 graduating class.

After graduation, Randolph worked odd jobs and devoted his time to singing, acting and reading. W.E.B. Du Bois' The Souls of Black Folk convinced him that the fight for social equality was more important than almost anything else. He moved to New York City in 1911 to become an actor but gave up after failing to win his parents' approval.
Columbia University student Chandler Owen shared Randolph's intellectual interests and became his close collaborators.

In 1914, Randolph courted and married Mrs. Lucille E. Green, a widow, Howard University graduate and entrepreneur who shared his socialist politics and earned enough money to support them both. The couple had no children.

Randolph joined the Socialist Party and began to harangue the crowds at Harlem's soapbox corner (135th Street and Lenox Avenue) about socialism and the importance of militant class-consciousness. In January 1917, William White, president of the Headwaiters and Sidewaiters Society of Greater New York, asked them to edit a monthly magazine for the society, Hotel Messenger. Randolph and Owen dropped "Hotel" from the masthead and in November 1917 published the first issue of the Messenger, which soon became known as "one of the most brilliantly edited magazines in the history of American Negro journalism."

Their magazine provided an outlet for those who, like Randolph and Owen, were opposed to both the cautious elitism of the NAACP and the utopian populism of Marcus Garvey's United Negro Improvement Association. By now established figures in the Socialist Party in New York, Randolph and Owen embarked on a nationwide anti-war speaking tour in 1918 that brought them to the attention of the U.S. Department of Justice and almost got them arrested.

In June 1925, a group of Pullman porters, the all-black service staff of the Pullman sleeping cars, approached Randolph and asked him to lead their new organization, the Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters. Randolph agreed. Besides his abiding interest in and knowledge of unions, Randolph's primary qualification for the job was his reputation for incorruptibility and the fact that he was not a Pullman Company employee—meaning the company could not fire him or buy him off. For the next 10 years, Randolph led an arduous campaign to organize the Pullman porters, which resulted in the certification of the BSCP as the exclusive collective bargaining agent of the Pullman porters in 1935. Randolph called it the "first victory of Negro workers over a great industrial corporation."

Randolph became the most widely known spokesperson for black working-class interests in the country. In December 1940, with President Franklin Roosevelt refusing to issue an executive order banning discrimination against black workers in the defense industry, Randolph called for "10,000 loyal Negro American citizens" to march on Washington, D.C. Support grew so quickly that soon he was calling for 100,000 marchers to converge on the capital. Pressed to take action, President Roosevelt issued an executive order on June 25, 1941, six days before the march was to occur, declaring "there shall be no discrimination in the employment of workers in defense industries or government because of race, creed, color, or national origin." Roosevelt also set up the Fair Employment Practices Commission to oversee the order.

Six years later, after the passage of the Selective Service Act of 1947, Randolph demanded that the government integrate the armed forces. He founded the League for Nonviolent Civil Disobedience Against Military Segregation and urged young men, both black and white, to "refuse to cooperate with a Jim Crow conscription service." Threatened with widespread civil disobedience and needing the black vote in his 1948 re-election campaign, President Harry Truman on July 26, 1948, ordered an end to military discrimination "as quickly as possible."

The March on Washington movement and Randolph's call for civil disobedience to end segregation in the armed forces helped convince the next generation of civil rights activists that nonviolent protests and mass demonstrations were the best way to mobilize public pressure. Randolph was, in this sense, the true "father of the civil rights movement" in the United States. The movement recognized his role by naming him the chair of the 1963 March on Washington, at which Martin Luther King Jr. gave his famous "I Have a Dream" speech, and by heeding his advice to cooperate in keeping the march nonviolent.
Randolph was elected a vice president of the newly merged AFL-CIO in 1955. He used his position to push for desegregation and respect for civil rights inside the labor movement as well as outside. He was one of the founders of the Negro American Labor Council and served as its president from 1960 to 1966. In 1964 he was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by President Lyndon Johnson.

Retiring as president of the BSCP in 1968, Randolph was named the president of the recently formed A. Philip Randolph Institute, established to promote trade unionism in the black community. He continued to serve on the AFL-CIO Executive Council until 1974. He died in New York City on May 16, 1979.

www.aflcio.org/aboutus/history/history/randolph.cfm

thelakelander

July 03, 2008, 01:38:15 PM
Btw, the Cookman Institute (where many of Jacksonville's early black students attended school) would later merge with another school to become Bethune Cookman College (now Bethune Cookman University) in Daytona Beach.



So the recent FSU Medical School we lost out on when they picked Daytona instead, is not the first school to do so.

tufsu1

July 03, 2008, 02:01:02 PM
tufsu!  read the whole article instead of just the blurb.


I did Stephen...and its very interesting....but blanket statements at the beginning turn some people off....and then they stop reading!

stephendare

July 03, 2008, 02:02:00 PM
tufsu!  read the whole article instead of just the blurb.


I did Stephen...and its very interesting....but blanket statements at the beginning turn some people off....and then they stop reading!

I find this very true, and thanks for the compliment.

I don't retreat from the statement though.  As a seventh generation native, It seems to me that the city must hate itself NOT to celebrate its past and its achievements past and present.

Wayne Wood's books and their popularity, I think are a great step in the right direction.

second_pancake

July 03, 2008, 03:12:47 PM
I did not know that Jacksonville was a city that "hated" itsellf...

This is very odd to me, because most of the people I talk to who live here seem to think its a pretty nice place!

Do any of these people live in urban areas or do they all live in the suburbs...St. John's county perhaps?  Jacksonville will always appear to be a "nice place" when you shut yourself out from the reality of what it is and what it has the potential to become (good and bad). 

Some people live in the suburbs...others in established neighborhoods like Riverside and Springfield....I, for one, live downtown....and, yes, I agree there is much potential that has often been squandered....but its still a pretty nice place to live!

If you don't like it, you can always move!

I am moving...to TX.  Hopefully, when I come back to visit friends, I'll see Jacksonville making changes for the better instead of watching it continue to disenegrate around me.

RiversideGator

July 03, 2008, 04:20:20 PM
Are passages which include filthy language really necessary?

I know you hate Craig van Horne but this is really overboard:

Quote
Ray Mason would have an Institute where international finance and Arabic trade principles were taught, studied and debated. People would know who Raymond Mason was, and have no fucking clue who Craig Van Horn was.

stephendare

July 03, 2008, 04:34:51 PM
Are passages which include filthy language really necessary?

I know you hate Craig van Horne but this is really overboard:

Quote
Ray Mason would have an Institute where international finance and Arabic trade principles were taught, studied and debated. People would know who Raymond Mason was, and have no fucking clue who Craig Van Horn was.

River.  Stop being such a prissy old woman.

Im an adult, This isnt a childrens novel and I actually don't appreciate your remonstrances.

You make it into a much bigger deal than it is when you do this.

I can see taking offense at 'bad' words when they are directed AT someone, but this essay was actually written two years ago and not really directed at anyone.

Ray Mason should be a household name. I think that we spend way too much time on vulgar real estate developers, not limited to the present example and pay no attention to the really important lasting contributions of the sons and daughters of this city.

Mason was the architect of modern business relations between the Arabs and the West.  His contribution literally cannot be overestimated, yet NO ONE knows a damn thing about him.

heights unknown

July 03, 2008, 04:46:15 PM
I don't think Jacksonville is a city that hates itself, but I do think it is a city that is being held back by short sighted people and leaders now and in the past that have been in power, and Jax just has not realized it's full unlimited potential.

Jax, up until about 1960 was the City that could rather than the City that couldn't after 1960 and beyond.  Florida cities emulated Jax up until about that point; now it is the opposite, Jax doesn't have an identity or know its identity so it looks to other cities within Florida and around the nation to emulate.  We need to find out our own identity and realize our own self worth and who we are.

Until that happens, Jax will flounder, be uncertain and unsure of itself, thus holding its full potential back or even snuffing it out.

My opinion.

Heights Unknown

thebrokenforum

July 03, 2008, 04:53:01 PM
Quote
I do think it is a city that is being held back by short sighted people and leaders now and in the past that have been in power

Exactly!

Just curious...would starting a petition to get a maritime museum, an aquarium etc. etc. do any good if enough people were interested?

stephendare

July 03, 2008, 05:13:46 PM
One of the Mayors Administrators just called with a very touching acknowledgement of todays article.

They noticed and forwarded the essay to others in the administration and thanked us for leaving an inspirational guide of things to think about on the holiday weekend.

This town has good people in it, and not all of them are dead yet.

rjp2008

July 03, 2008, 05:18:50 PM
One thing I really notice about Jacksonville is that there is a strong core of people who really care about it's development and community. You don't see that in big metro areas, and that's really something.
There is a stronger identity of "we" here than in other areas and that's a huge plus.

RiversideGator

July 03, 2008, 06:51:54 PM
I am neither prissy, old nor a woman.  However, do you think that foul language (1) enhances your message and its general appeal or (2) takes away from it and causes many people to stop reading it and/or discount many of the valid points contained in it?  Just something to consider if you want to be taken seriously and make a difference.

pwhitford

July 03, 2008, 07:53:27 PM
Stephen - congratulations on a beautiful piece of work.  The scope of the article is epic and the information you provide could fill volumes, if followed up on – and it should be!  Great thought provoking article.  Now let’s see what kind of action it produces.

As a transplanted northerner (and from that modern day Gomorrah, New York City, to boot!) as well as one of those dreaded Orange Park-to-Downtown commuters, I think this town has incredible potential, so much so that I don't think most people can even begin to grasp the possibilities (most participants in this site excepted, of course).  And I am not even a little interested in moving back, but I can understand a native's  reaction to what he/she hears so often.

You want identity – look to your river; you want character, look to the incredible history of this place (the music, the artists, the personalities, the commerce (maritime and overland).  The frustration really comes from seeing how close this town is to being great, a true regional leader, and how often it is ruthlessly used by shameless and callow men for their own immediate gain.

I recommend this site to just about everyone I speak to, so keep up the good work.  And I believe the word is spreading and people are "waking up".  Witness: the effect you are having on the JTA and the very real possibility of commuter and light rail transit here in Jacksonville.  This wouldn’t even be on the table for discussion if the powers that be had been left to their own devices.  This was the result, at least in part, of the work you all do at this site.  Thanks, for this article and everything else.

JaguarReign

July 03, 2008, 08:03:04 PM
I think there were many good points in the article and I agree with a lot of it. Optimistically speaking, I think things are starting to look up. I remember 7 years ago when I last living in the area before I returned a few months ago, there was about half of the stuff to do than there is now. Plus, I think the jaguars have really done wonders for this city. Ever since the jags got here Jacksonville has grown as a city exponentially and given us a national identitiy. I think with them in tow, Jacksonville is turning around for the better. 

Ocklawaha

July 04, 2008, 01:13:18 AM
Certainly a "Smart City" would have gone with St. Elmo Acosta's plan to convert the FEC RY line from Southbank - (via Beach Blvd alignment) - Jax Beach - Mayport, into an electric interurban that would be with us today. Many other "Median Strip" car lines of Jacksonville Traction, not unlike those in New Orleans would have stayed in place as well...if we only had a brain.

On Mr. Phillip Randolph of Pullman fame, here are a couple of fill in bits that will let the rest of you in on my little secret:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
William D'Alton Mann (1839-1920)

career as civil engineer cut short by Civil War

organized the Fifth Michigan Cavalry and later the Seventh

Commanded latter at Gettysberg

during war invented and poatented various improvements to soldiers' equipment and made a fdortune on their sale to federal government

after war settled in Mobile, Al

acquired and edited Mobile Register (newspaper) and took interest in politics

9 Jan 1872 received patent on sleeping car divided by transverse partitions into compartments
USPat 122,622: doors in side like in europe/ small toilet each compart, seats convertible to beds running crosswise to direction of travel

spent next 10 yrs intro to Continent Europe

8 Jan 1878 invented corridor car & car vestibule used on train built in England for use in Russia
USPat 198,991 / car had corridor length of car, communal restrooms, one sex each end
vestibules were closed -- forerunner of present-day (1957) compartment cars

On ret to US organized MBCC to build & operate cars

The Mann Boudoir Car Company was chartered in the state of New York 23 March 1883. It operated at a loss for its first 5 years.

cars used on Springfield line betw Boston & NY 1883

became popular w/ public but not RR because of limited capacity

The December 1888 issue of the Official Railway Guide startled the railroad world (and most of all George M. Pullman) with this announcement: "Union Palace Car Co.... will commence operating SLEEPING AND PARLOR CARS on about 15,000 miles of railroad in January 1889." Union had been incorporated 24 September 1888 in New Jersey by Job H. Jackson of Jackson & Sharp to secure control of the Mann Boudoir Car Company and the Woodruff Sleeping & Parlor Coach Company. The two companies operated a total of 34 cars on about 5,000 miles of railroads in the East, South, and Midwest. Pullman lost no time. Two months later Union Palace was purchased by Pullmans Palace Car Company for $2.5 million. Some parts of Union seem to have survived, because it was not finally dissolved until 1899.

The whole PULLMAN and carpet bagger era hits close to home, Jacksonville was HUGE in both worlds.
While a relation of "Ocklawaha" the majority of my family was on the other side in the War of Yankee Aggression, therefore, had I been alive... Perhaps Col Mann wouldn't have! Viva Quantrail!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Society for the Prevention of Calling Sleeping Car Porters "George"
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A Pullman sleeping car porter.The Society for the Prevention of Calling Sleeping Car Porters "George" (SPCSCPG) was an association composed largely of railway sleeping car porters in the United States to promote the elimination of the degrading and racist practice of referring to all porters by the name "George" regardless of their actual name. The name refers to George Pullman, of the Pullman Company, which at one time manufactured and operated a large proportion of all the sleeping cars in North America. Porters were overwhelmingly African American, and the practice presumably derived from the old custom of naming slaves after their masters, in this case porters being regarded as servants of George Pullman. The society was initiated by white railway employees actually named George, who were either annoyed by the practice, or thought that founding the society would be an amusing joke.

At its peak, the society had 31,000 members, including King George V of the United Kingdom, American baseball player George Herman "Babe" Ruth, and French politician Georges Clemenceau.[1]

Phillip Randolph formed the first African American Labor Union and became active in the Civil Rights struggle.
He organized the Brotherhood of Pullman Porters in 1925, but they were refused collective bargaining until the Socialist Party put pressure on the Pullman. Finally about 1937 they won a contract. Today the sons of Pullman Porters and onboard train crews are often represented by the Brotherhood of Railway and Airline Clerks, or the UTU.


Ocklawaha

Coolyfett

July 04, 2008, 10:42:24 AM
I did not know that Jacksonville was a city that "hated" itsellf...

This is very odd to me, because most of the people I talk to who live here seem to think its a pretty nice place!

Thats interesting. I think you may want to talk to more people outside of the immediate circle. Hate is a bit strong, I wouldn't say HATE is word to use in that sentence. Maybe "lack of pride" or 'lack of interest" from many of the citizens. 

Sentence should read...Why does Jacksonville ignore itself?

Coolyfett

July 04, 2008, 10:49:34 AM
I did not know that Jacksonville was a city that "hated" itsellf...

This is very odd to me, because most of the people I talk to who live here seem to think its a pretty nice place!

Do any of these people live in urban areas or do they all live in the suburbs...St. John's county perhaps?  Jacksonville will always appear to be a "nice place" when you shut yourself out from the reality of what it is and what it has the potential to become (good and bad).  For the majority of residents of suburban Jacksonville, you could transport them in their sleep to any other suburban destination in any other state and when they woke up they'd have no idea they ever left Jacksonville.  Is that how you want to live, in a cookie-cutter world completely devoid of passion and culture?

What the author was speaking about (correct me if I'm wrong) is a sense of pride in our roots and pride in our city, the original city, downtown, of which, the powers-that-be who determine what course of action is going to be taken regarding the best interests of our city, have none.

In my opinion, it truely is unfortunate that so many of our communities which are so far disconnected from the urban core, are considered to be, Jacksonville.  It's an injustice to what could be done for and in those smaller communities as well as what could be done for downtown.  Orange Park is over 30 minutes away from downtown Jacksonville by highway, the intercoastal communites and the beaches are even further.  People who live in those areas have a tendancy to stay in those areas because they have no reason to venture into downtown for anything other than a couple of games or shows and then they're out and back home.

So, again, depending on where you live in 'Jacksonville' and how much you choose to see/learn, it's either going to be "nice" or it will resemble a teenage girl with self-esteem issues, looking at fashion mags and trying to emulate Gisele Bundchen.

:D I think this is what I was trying to say.

Coolyfett

July 04, 2008, 11:06:26 AM
I do think it is a city that is being held back by , and Jax just has not realized it's full unlimited potential.

Rest your fingers mate. The word "TURTLES" works just fine.

Turtles - short sighted people and leaders now and in the past that have been in power.

stephendare

July 04, 2008, 11:56:40 AM
Its a self loathing city.

I think because we are so uninformed about our own heritage that most people assume that if you dig very deep at all, it must be a calumny of racist rednecks etc.

To be sure, we had our share of those, like any other city, but our actual heritage and history is awesome.

The difference between us and other cities is that they celebrate themselves.

We hide it.

Even in this thread weve had a comment about maybe it would be better if out Southern Fried Rock superstars werent spotlighted.

Self hatred pure and simple.

We have been in thrall too long to the consultants who think we should be more like philly or columbus.

We certainly can learn some infrastructure and techniques from those cities. 

But we take the 'being more like' thing too far.   

Ocklawaha

July 04, 2008, 03:02:09 PM
Daughter Trilby just had a brain storm worth mention here...

"Dad, why don't you push the MJ guys to draw the Riverwalk like those beautiful sidewalks in South America (something posted on another thread recently if I recall). Then get the city to put our own walk of fame into the walk. Big Hollywood Stars! Names like Oliver Hardy, Allonso Mitchell, Tom Mix, Ray Charles, Phillip Randolph. I mean, we were the original Hollywood right? So why should they have a lock on it. Then over in by the railing, add a history marker, or a lifesize bronze..."

Damn Girl! Hum? What do y'all think of that one? Imagine getting ones photo taken with a lifesize Oliver Hardy as he leans on the rail looking out over the river? His own star illuminated behind him? DAMN!


Ocklawaha

thelakelander

July 04, 2008, 03:08:27 PM
Humm.  A Jacksonville Walk of Fame?  The idea definately has a lot a merit.  What would be the best location for something like this?

A. Friendship Fountain area

B. Proposed Shipyards Pier

C. Northbank Riverwalk - between Landing and TU Center or CSX

D. Northbank Riverwalk - near the Hyatt

E. Southbank Riverwalk

F. Other

ProjectMaximus

July 04, 2008, 05:08:10 PM
Daughter Trilby just had a brain storm worth mention here...

"Dad, why don't you push the MJ guys to draw the Riverwalk like those beautiful sidewalks in South America (something posted on another thread recently if I recall). Then get the city to put our own walk of fame into the walk. Big Hollywood Stars! Names like Oliver Hardy, Allonso Mitchell, Tom Mix, Ray Charles, Phillip Randolph. I mean, we were the original Hollywood right? So why should they have a lock on it. Then over in by the railing, add a history marker, or a lifesize bronze..."

Damn Girl! Hum? What do y'all think of that one? Imagine getting ones photo taken with a lifesize Oliver Hardy as he leans on the rail looking out over the river? His own star illuminated behind him? DAMN!


Ocklawaha

I think this is a very logical first step in demonstrating civic pride to outsiders. Simple, minor, yet very effective.

Trilby

July 04, 2008, 05:33:15 PM
"Hey everybody! its ocks daughter. ive met some of you, and some of you just know me from my dad and his love to speak. =] {about everything!} My home is florida however. born and halfway raised in orlando. the other half raised in oklahoma. which no offense to you okies but for me its the closest to hell i could get. I love my florida, and i think this is a great way to voice our opinions on what needs to be done...and what DOESNT need to be done. so now you have another big mouth on here. like father like daughter!"

Im happy someone looked at my idea! i had an idea of calling it "the jacksonvilles stars" i have heard stories from my father how jacksonville would have been the first hollywood. and its such a shame...and possibly a good thing that  it didnt happen!  however...so many early films were done here. and so many famous people have come out of this city, that i believe they deserve some recognition. being a myspace junkie. and facebook. i love to take cool pictures downtown and outside and post them for everyone too see. and i could just see it now. all the young people going downtown to take pictures next to their FAVORITE "jacksonville" star. its a way to reach out to people young and old...teach them some history. but make it fun..and interesting. so the word "history" doesnt scare them away. ;D
 

<3
Trilby

stephendare

July 05, 2008, 10:10:29 AM
This is a partial listing of the musical celebrities from or associated with Jacksonville.

Are you f*@#ing kidding me that we don't have some sort of public hall or museum or conservatory that celebrates this?

For God's sake.  This is the city that invented an entire genre of Music:  Southern Fried Rock.   We own it.

lynyrd skynyrd




molly hatchet




allman brothers





38 special




Blackfoot




Brian Leisegang, Filter, Nine Inch Nails




Limp Bizkit




Yellowcard





Black Kids




Ray Charles




stephendare

July 05, 2008, 10:13:33 AM
links and more people.


Quote
lynyrd skynyrd  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynyrd_Skynyrd

38 special  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.38_Special_%28band%29

allman brothers  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Allman_Brothers_Band

molly hatchet  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molly_Hatchet

Blackfoot  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackfoot_%28band%29

Rossington Collins Band  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rossington-Collins_Band

Yellow Card  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellowcard

Brian Liesegang Filter, 9 Inch Nails Veruca Salt  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Liesegang

Todd Eberle  http://www.artic.edu/aic/exhibitions/exhibition/eberle

Wakefield Poole  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wakefield_Poole  (the Godfather of Gay Porn.  believe it or not, our gentle wakefield was really the first person to do it and show it at theatres)

Michael Emerson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Emerson

Ronnie Land  http://rlandart.com/

Fred Durst  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Durst

Limp Bizkit  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limp_Bizkit

Cold  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_(band)

Rena Greek Mero (Sable from WWE) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rena_Mero

Black Kids  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Kids

stephendare

July 05, 2008, 10:26:17 AM
Creature from the Black Lagoon




Oliver Hardy




Bill Pickett the Norman Studio's Cowboy






stephendare

July 05, 2008, 10:37:07 AM
Daytime's Connie Fletcher from Jax Beach and Aaron Staten from Beauty and The Beast


stephendare

July 05, 2008, 10:40:42 AM
Michael Emerson

Charles Hunter

July 05, 2008, 10:41:35 AM
Pat Boone: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Boone

Dennis Yost and the Classics IV: http://www.crystalhorizon.com/Classics_IV/Home_Main.htm

And, although not born here, Rita Coolidge graduated from Andrew Jackson HS: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rita_Coolidge#Personal_life

OK, a bit before Southern Rock, but still from Jacksonville.

stephendare

July 05, 2008, 10:47:33 AM
Zora Neal Hurston



stephendare

July 05, 2008, 10:50:26 AM
Rita Coolidge

stephendare

July 05, 2008, 10:58:28 AM
Slim Whitman




Pat Boone

blizz01

July 05, 2008, 06:49:08 PM
SHINEDOWN
EVERGREEN TERRACE
RED JUMPSUIT APPARATUS
95 SOUTH

downtownparks

July 05, 2008, 08:54:19 PM
Yellowcard
Limp Bizkit

stephendare

July 07, 2008, 12:36:36 PM
Yellowcard
Limp Bizkit

great additions dtp.   But they were already included in the previous pages.

Ocklawaha

July 07, 2008, 12:43:31 PM
Is it possible to get back to design concepts here? I'm wondering if illuminated Stars could be done. Should we add to the lonely jogger full size bronzes of some famous ones? What about historic markers telling their story? On the rail or on the Star? Maybe around the Star? Hey, if the Mayor likes this idea, then lets give them a COMPLETE IDEA.

Ocklawaha

downtownparks

July 07, 2008, 12:45:29 PM
Yellowcard
Limp Bizkit

great additions dtp.   But they were already included in the previous pages.

Clearly I should be beaten with a whip until bloody.

stephendare

July 07, 2008, 12:46:58 PM
brilliant Ock.

I wonder if we could sponsor a sidewalk art contest to paint stars along the riverwalk.  Highlight the street artists, limit it to chalks and acrylics....

Historic Markers. 

Maybe a meeting with the Art in Public Places Committee in order to propose the statues of the film stars (including The Creature)

Ocklawaha

July 07, 2008, 11:09:10 PM
Oh yeah, the creature HAS TO BE THERE! He should be next to a fine restaurant coming over the wall. For those too young to remember, the diver did that while filming in Jacksonville. There was a seafood place and suddenly this "THING" came up alongside all these film crews. Well, needless to say, he got instant panic and fame in the fragile minds of the 1950/60 era. It should be remembered, if you haven't see the flick, he wasn't a "bad monster" just a love struck BIGFOOT with scales.

Ocklawaha

stephendare

July 09, 2008, 03:49:20 PM
Quote
The Southern Music Hall of Fame would be open and full to capacity somewhere in downtown. Molly Hatchet, Lynyrd Skynyrd and The Allman Brothers would have exhibits there and all the music aficionados would know a history of the Southern music and the Jacksonville music scene.

A statue of Ray Charles would stand in the perfectly preserved and popular bar where he first played soul piano and blues in the South.

There would be another museum of Black Film commemorating the achievements of black filmmakers here in Jacksonville.

Peterbrookes, The Loop Pizza and the Chicken Coop would all have gigantic headquarters in the center of town that rivaled the marooned Cruise Ship of a Building that Preston Haskell's company erected to itself on Riverside Avenue. There would be standing lines for tours of Sally Industry.

Blaire Woolverton would have her own cable show and Jake Godbold would have a cookbook.

Ray Mason would have an Institute where international finance and Arabic trade principles were taught, studied and debated. People would know who Raymond Mason was, and have no fucking clue who Craig Van Horn was.

When the Jacksonville Film Festival opened every year, Josh Skierski and Chad Hendricks would be the Emcees and Rita Manyette would be the Gala Hostess.

Mandarin would have a trolley tour of the famous writers who lived there over the past century. And even white people would know that Zora Neal Hurston lived here.

People would know who Zora Neal Hurston was.

There would be tours of the Confederate monuments and rubbings over the gravestones at the Confederate Graveyard in the Old City Cemetery.

People would be patriotic about Maxwell House. It would have a string of successful cafes all over town.

Jacksonville Tars and the Negro League’s Jacksonville Redcap’s throwback jerseys, would be available at any given local sporting goods store.

Matt Carlucci would have been Mayor and John Peyton would be president of the Chamber of Commerce.

There would be a Maritime Museum on the riverfront celebrating the many nautical elements of Jacksonville's History.

Old Stanton would be a Music Conservatory which offered a scholarship in the name of the writer of "Lift every Voice and Sing" The River City Band would be housed there.

The Jewish Center and graveyard would have signs on the bridges and highways to point out the gigantic and culturing effect that Jewish people had on Jacksonville, an unexpectedly tolerant and welcoming home in a time and country that met them everywhere else with fear and loathing.

Brochures would direct people to the bohemian district in Five Points, the Gay Mecca at Park and King and the real cracker cooking in the nationally rated southern restaurants of the Northside.


Noel Freidline would be a rich man with a big Jazz Club that he owned somewhere on the Riverwalk.

Marabanong would be a famously discussed historical feature on the Jacksonville tour.

Someone would have said "Thanks" to John Currington for resurrecting San Marco.

Or Lex Hester.

There would be a monument and perhaps a college marking the Landing of Protestant French Huguenots, and you could buy well-researched books about their history here.

There would be reenactments of pirate clipper attacks on the Ortega River, and the locals would brag about which French or English pirate they were descended from.

The Great Black Way would have curio shops and little plastic bubbles with glitter in them swirling round Duke Ellington and Billy Holiday performing at the Ritz, and Klutho's Balustrade would be lit at night so that lovers could walk past the moonlit canal along Hogan's Creek.

There would be bronze statues of the Creature from the Black Lagoon, Bill Pickett (the famous black cowboy from Norman Studios in Arlington), Tom Mix and Oliver Hardy (of Laurel and Hardy) on the Riverwalk instead of the goofy jogger?

There would be a big Barbeque festival on Main Street every year and people would come from miles around to check out a hundred million recipes for ribs and collard greens.

It would create an interesting and colorful course that teaches our history and the cities issues and require that it be taught to all 7th graders.

The architecture wouldn’t have to be studied from old postcards and books with crossed out black and white photos with the word "demolished" stamped across them.

The urban population would have increased faster adding to the corporate scrapers due to the less restrictive city policy and would make Jacksonville the premier city in Florida if not the southeast.

The sports venues would have been built into the urban fabric allowing neighboring establishments to feed off of the activity.

We would have an iconic courthouse and a bustling government district.

We would have a multi-use convention center producing activity 24-7.

The surrounding neighborhoods would all be connected to the core via a comprehensive network of commuter, light rail or skyway lines.

Visitors to the city would have a multitude of way finding signs leading to attractions, parking, and districts.

Tourist visiting the area wouldn't leave town without making a trip over to the energetic and cultural diverse Jacksonville Farmer's Market District, which connects downtown with historic Durkeeville.



There would be a permanent exhibit of Joe La Rose's shoes at the City hall or perhaps the LaVilla School of the Arts and students would host John Fluevog competitions for shoe design every year.

Downtown would be full of Paparazzi following the exploits of Jacksonville's unbelievably accomplished Spoken Word Royalty.

Al Letson, Liz Straight, David Pugh Allan Justiss, Jon Reich, Valerie Anthony, Christina Wagner, Lee Harvey, and Iain Mairs would be household names. The Mayor would know them all, and they would be able to make a living with speaking engagements.

But we don't have those things.

They are too 'low class', too 'black' and too 'southern'.

Instead we have consultants telling us how to appear more like Indianapolis or Louisville.

If we wanted to be Indianapolis or some other place...

But we don't have a "Jacksonville".

add to this list, that there would be statues to the two little ladies that preserved the book collection of the 'black' library, and thereby saved a heritage.

That the colorful history of Napoleon Bonaparte Broward, a direct descendant of Napoleon who was both mayor of the city and Governor of Florida.

RiversideGator

July 09, 2008, 06:17:32 PM
Broward was not a direct descendant of Napoleon.  He was just named for Napoleon.   :D

Napoleon had just one legitimate child and he died without issue.  Also, I have never heard this about Broward and can turn up nothing to substantiate it.

stephendare

July 09, 2008, 06:23:38 PM
Napoleon Bonapartes court fell apart only to be reassembled under Louise Napoleon.

After Louise Napoleon's regime fell apart, the House of Bonaparte was tossed to the wind.

Interestingly, at some point between the empires, one of the branches relocated to Tallahassee Florida, where the family head became the Postmaster.

I will be glad to find the reference for you.  Its listed in the bibliographic notes of a historical novel called "Tom Doyle" which you can find yourself in print version, but Im uncertain at this minute whether the reference is available online.

However, the family affiliation was told to me personally by both his granddaughter, Dorcas, while she was still alive at her Springfield home of 2nd Street, as well as his great grand daughter Jo Drake (Dorcas' daughter).

I will see if I can find a web reference.

stephendare

July 09, 2008, 06:29:18 PM
Here is a listing for the Floridian Bonapartes.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Achille_Murat

stephendare

July 09, 2008, 07:00:09 PM
in reading the family history of the Murats, it appears very likely that the family connection was most likely on an infamous side of the sheets.  Even for a lesser cousin of Achilles, it seems unlikely that Catherine would have allowed a legitimate product of the Bloodline to have waited tables at St. Simons.

gregbeere

July 09, 2008, 08:59:26 PM
Why don't we try leading instead of being followers?
What is best for Jacksonville and its citizens?
What are we going to do?  Not our government, WE. 
Can we push the envelope......a little?
Why does the new Transportation Center look like every other building in town? Who cares if it is compatible with the existing historic architecture in the area around the project?

"Architect Ethan Loubriel, associate vice president of DMJM Harris, said his firm worked closely with state and local historic preservation agencies to ensure the design of the JTC would be compatible with the existing historic architecture in the area around the project."

It is a new building for goodness sake. Old buildings should be cherished and preserved. New buildings, especially those that serve the community should be well designed and yes, maybe push the envelope.  Has anyone seen the Seattle Library by the Office for Metropolitan Architecture a.k.a. Rem Koolhaas?  Check it's attendance against the Jacksonville Downtown public library.

Bradford is the fifth largest city in the UK with less than half of our population........
This video was very inspiring to me, but if I am the only one, maybe I am in the wrong city.
Take a look........
If nothing else, the video is cool.

"http://www.youtube.com/v/nr2ZzLWcb48&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0&color1=0x234900&color2=0x4e9e00"
></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed

This is a link to Bradford's redevelopment site.
http://www.bradfordnewcity.com/

thelakelander

July 09, 2008, 09:21:48 PM
Boston


Louisville


Indianapolis


Charlotte


Toronto




Jacksonville




It is weird how we are so conservative with our architectural design to blend in with the old, yet we as a community, have no problem tearing down the 100 year old buildings we continue to try to copy.  100 years ago, Jacksonville was a very progressive community.  We need to find a way to get our mojo back.

Driven1

July 09, 2008, 09:26:51 PM
lol Lake...that is hilarious.   i LOVE the Toronto buildings though.  Boston tower is beautiful too.

RiversideGator

July 09, 2008, 10:51:29 PM
in reading the family history of the Murats, it appears very likely that the family connection was most likely on an infamous side of the sheets.  Even for a lesser cousin of Achilles, it seems unlikely that Catherine would have allowed a legitimate product of the Bloodline to have waited tables at St. Simons.

Murat was Napoleon's nephew and he also had no children:

Quote
In 1826, Murat met and married on July 12 at Tallahassee, Florida Catherine Daingerfield Willis, without issue. Gray was the great-grandniece of George Washington. Murat and his wife moved to New Orleans for several years, where he worked as a lawyer.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Achille_Murat

Additionally, Louis Napoleon (aka Napoleon III) was Napoleon I's nephew and was emperor of France until 1870, probably around the time Broward was born.  His one child was killed in his 20s and was without issue.  The legitimate Napoleonic line died with him.  So, that wasnt the connection either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon_III_of_France

While Napoleon I did have illegitimate children, there is no evidence any of them are related to the Browards.  I think this is either a false family legend or an incorrect memory on your part.

stephendare

July 09, 2008, 11:00:05 PM
Well its certainly not an incorrect memory on my part.

Although, like yourself, at the time I thought it was merely a family fancy.

It wasnt until 15 years later that I came across the footnote in Tom Doyle that verified the tallahassee cousin connection exactly as Dorcas had explained.

And I had not actually read the murat entry in wikipedia until tonight.

Because of the obscurity of the information, it seems unlikely that the family would have all that detail without it being true.

So I would tend to assume a bastard connection.  But I can see the basis for any skepticism.

JaxNative68

July 14, 2008, 02:51:43 PM
First somebody has to wake up Jacksonville's City leaders, or should I say the good ole boy network that is still alive and starting another generation, and make them stop tearing down the true historical architecture of our city in order to build new visions of a past this city didn't have.  The new public library is a perfect example of this.

Ocklawaha

July 14, 2008, 03:16:03 PM
Imagine! A Jacksonville political connection to Napoleon...

Well historians?

Well?

That sure explains Waterloo!


Ocklawaha

RiversideGator

July 14, 2008, 04:19:31 PM
First somebody has to wake up Jacksonville's City leaders, or should I say the good ole boy network that is still alive and starting another generation, and make them stop tearing down the true historical architecture of our city in order to build new visions of a past this city didn't have.  The new public library is a perfect example of this.

What past did we not have?  And what is the new public library a perfect example of?  We certainly had a large number (and still do) of neoclassical structures in Jacksonville and this style (postmodern) was an obvious reference to that fact.

stephendare

July 14, 2008, 04:38:01 PM
First somebody has to wake up Jacksonville's City leaders, or should I say the good ole boy network that is still alive and starting another generation, and make them stop tearing down the true historical architecture of our city in order to build new visions of a past this city didn't have.  The new public library is a perfect example of this.

What past did we not have?  And what is the new public library a perfect example of?  We certainly had a large number (and still do) of neoclassical structures in Jacksonville and this style (postmodern) was an obvious reference to that fact.

huh?

hogwash.

The sacrilege perpetrated against the historical fabric of this city by the construction of the library is EXACTLY what Jaxnative is talking about.

to think that they tore down the last Jazz Age skyscraper in the state of Florida to build it is sad enough.  However to rip the details of the buildings that were actually on the site and then elmer's glue them into place on the unrelenting brick walls of Duval is obscene.

and ghoulish.

JoeMerchant

July 14, 2008, 05:03:07 PM
First somebody has to wake up Jacksonville's City leaders, or should I say the good ole boy network that is still alive and starting another generation, and make them stop tearing down the true historical architecture of our city in order to build new visions of a past this city didn't have.  The new public library is a perfect example of this.

What past did we not have?  And what is the new public library a perfect example of?  We certainly had a large number (and still do) of neoclassical structures in Jacksonville and this style (postmodern) was an obvious reference to that fact.

That library is a total joke.  I can post a series of images of new libraries in similar cities that have actually tried to bring their cities architecture forward.  Our library totally ignores the pedestrian at street level, although it does have that lovely rooftop garden, which the last time I was there was filled with weeds.

It's a reference of bad design, and I love how it ties back in to the surrounding historical building that had been torn down by super gluing some of the leftover architectural artifacts to the north side of the building, on stucco placeholders.

And don't even get me started about "postmodern" architecture...

Seattle's public library:



Our city jewel:

RiversideGator

July 14, 2008, 05:06:52 PM
First somebody has to wake up Jacksonville's City leaders, or should I say the good ole boy network that is still alive and starting another generation, and make them stop tearing down the true historical architecture of our city in order to build new visions of a past this city didn't have.  The new public library is a perfect example of this.

What past did we not have?  And what is the new public library a perfect example of?  We certainly had a large number (and still do) of neoclassical structures in Jacksonville and this style (postmodern) was an obvious reference to that fact.

huh?

What dont you understand?

Quote
The sacrilege perpetrated against the historical fabric of this city by the construction of the library is EXACTLY what Jaxnative is talking about.

to think that they tore down the last Jazz Age skyscraper in the state of Florida to build it is sad enough.  However to rip the details of the buildings that were actually on the site and then elmer's glue them into place on the unrelenting brick walls of Duval is obscene.

and ghoulish.

I was not in favor of demolishing the buildings to make way for the new library either.  I was discussing the design of the new library in isolation.  Perhaps you should not put words into my mouth.   ;)

BTW, they did not tear down the "last Jazz Age skyscraper in the state of Florida" to make way for it.  The Rhodes Furniture Bldg should not have come down but the Laura Street trio are of similar vintage.

RiversideGator

July 14, 2008, 05:10:27 PM
First somebody has to wake up Jacksonville's City leaders, or should I say the good ole boy network that is still alive and starting another generation, and make them stop tearing down the true historical architecture of our city in order to build new visions of a past this city didn't have.  The new public library is a perfect example of this.

What past did we not have?  And what is the new public library a perfect example of?  We certainly had a large number (and still do) of neoclassical structures in Jacksonville and this style (postmodern) was an obvious reference to that fact.

That library is a total joke.  I can post a series of images of new libraries in similar cities that have actually tried to bring their cities architecture forward.  Our library totally ignores the pedestrian at street level, although it does have that lovely rooftop garden, which the last time I was there was filled with weeds.

It's a reference of bad design, and I love how it ties back in to the surrounding historical building that had been torn down by super gluing some of the leftover architectural artifacts to the north side of the building, on stucco placeholders.

And don't even get me started about "postmodern" architecture...

Seattle's public library:



Our city jewel:



Agreed.  The library design is marginal.  It could have been a lot better.  But, it could have been a lot worse too.

JoeMerchant

July 14, 2008, 05:13:44 PM
First somebody has to wake up Jacksonville's City leaders, or should I say the good ole boy network that is still alive and starting another generation, and make them stop tearing down the true historical architecture of our city in order to build new visions of a past this city didn't have.  The new public library is a perfect example of this.

What past did we not have?  And what is the new public library a perfect example of?  We certainly had a large number (and still do) of neoclassical structures in Jacksonville and this style (postmodern) was an obvious reference to that fact.

That library is a total joke.  I can post a series of images of new libraries in similar cities that have actually tried to bring their cities architecture forward.  Our library totally ignores the pedestrian at street level, although it does have that lovely rooftop garden, which the last time I was there was filled with weeds.

It's a reference of bad design, and I love how it ties back in to the surrounding historical building that had been torn down by super gluing some of the leftover architectural artifacts to the north side of the building, on stucco placeholders.

And don't even get me started about "postmodern" architecture...

Seattle's public library:



Our city jewel:



Agreed.  The library design is marginal.  It could have been a lot better.  But, it could have been a lot worse too.

Well. that's one excuse I'm tired of hearing though.  Of course it could have been done worse, but who cares about that.  Instead of aiming at mediocrity at the beginning, why not use the imagination and try to aim for the stars at the beginning, and then maybe have to make some changes and value engineer from there. 

Don't start at the middle of the pack and then go down from there...

thelakelander

July 14, 2008, 05:15:18 PM
I believe the Laura Street Trio buildings are from an earlier decade and era.  The Rhodes Building may have been the last highrise built before the Great Depression and while the Barnett, Carling and others are from the same time period, the Rhodes was probably Jacksonville's best example of Chicago School highrise architecture.

Nevertheless, as far as the new library goes, the bad part of the design is that every elevation of the building, other than the front, was evidently an afterthought.  The design has rendered the retail spaces across the Monroe and Duval Street as dead zones.  A good traditional or contemporary design would have found a way to work with those streets as well.  

My dream scenerio would have been a project that keep the old buildings on that block and placed the library on surface parking lot block, like the one the pocket park and Salvation Army occupy.

stephendare

July 14, 2008, 08:41:10 PM
I believe the Laura Street Trio buildings are from an earlier decade and era.  The Rhodes Building may have been the last highrise built before the Great Depression and while the Barnett, Carling and others are from the same time period, the Rhodes was probably Jacksonville's best example of Chicago School highrise architecture.

Nevertheless, as far as the new library goes, the bad part of the design is that every elevation of the building, other than the front, was evidently an afterthought.  The design has rendered the retail spaces across the Monroe and Duval Street as dead zones.  A good traditional or contemporary design would have found a way to work with those streets as well. 

My dream scenerio would have been a project that keep the old buildings on that block and placed the library on surface parking lot block, like the one the pocket park and Salvation Army occupy.

exactly lake.

it was also the last Florida Land Boom Building
http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/072501/met_history.html

stephendare

July 25, 2008, 01:54:39 PM
We would be more like Boston than Birmingham.
We would have culture out the wazoo and still be a great working seaport.
We would have a massive convention center on the river,
a clean river.
You don't need an aquarium when you  protect your river and ocean.
You could send your kid to the neighborhood school,
and know that the most ambitious students will go to the Ivy League if they want,
or to a Florida university for free, but any graduate will be able to earn a living wage and raise a family, and stay.
We would produce and attract the same caliber music and performers as Nashville, Atlanta, Athens or Seattle.
 Heartbreak Hotel , Lift Every Voice and Sing, and Gimme Three Steps
were written in Jacksonville, or by people from here.
The train terminal would be a beautiful multimodal station.
You could kayak up Hogan's Creek.
Your children could walk to Sunday school downtown from Springfield without fear,
you could impress  your friends visiting from Barcelona or Brooklyn,and  you could
go hunting or throw a cast net if you wanted.
It would not matter if you were materially rich or poor, there is no other place you would want to live.

 


These are such awesome additions

thelakelander

July 25, 2008, 02:49:14 PM
Quote
We would be more like Boston than Birmingham.

We could be more like Birmingham too.  They're getting ready to spend $33 million to construct a starter streetcar line that will connect all of their inner city attractions and downtown neighborhoods together.

stephendare

July 28, 2008, 11:48:24 AM
Then by all means lets get started doing the same thing.

What does it take?  Petitions?

Referendums?

Ocklawaha

July 28, 2008, 12:12:44 PM
Quote
will connect all of their inner city attractions and downtown neighborhoods together.

I'm afraid unless someone bellys up to to the bar, the above statement answers it for Jacksonville... "inner city attractions". Okay, NAME 10 that would make you pull off the freeway. We simply have to put the boot to the hind quarters of certain people in City Hall. The AIA plans for Randolph sound fantastic, but I didn't see a soul there willing to ante-up. I bet the TOD thing is all Socialism Crap that somehow got mixed up with TOD ONLY IN THE PEOPLES DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF JACKSONVILLE! The Transit Authority doesn't buy and build TOD's, that is the private sectors job, thus DEVELOPMENT as in tax money, income, jobs, returns. All this BRT hype about tearing down old shopping centers for a bus station with a laundry mat and news stand is pure BULL. Real transit will bring about real TOD. Likewise, something very cool would get folks out of their cars and downtown. A few we've mentioned...

Negro League HOME Phillip Randolph-Pullman Porter-Red Cap Museum
Heritage Streetcar Line WITH museum (see I put it number 3)
New Landing
Bay Street Station
Southern Fried Rock Hall of fame
giant fish tank
maritime museum
Seminole game center

Which of the above are active?


OCKLAWAHA

stephendare

July 28, 2008, 12:22:48 PM
Well now Ock, we do have some really cool things in our inner city.

1.  The Jacksonville Symphony Orchestra.
2.  Jennifer Johnson and Preston Haskell's awesome private collections on loan to the Museum of Contemporary Art.
3.  One of the six repositories of the finest document collection in the world, The Karpeles Museum.
4. The Friday Musicale Music Hall in Riverside.
5.  The Veteran's Arena
6.  The Stadium which is also the home playing field of and NFL franchise team, the Jaguars.
7.  The Five Points Bohemian District.
8.  The Riverwalk, especially during fireworks displays.
9.  The Pavillion at Metropolitan Park, especially during performances and festivals.
10.  The Florida Theatre and its programming of vintage films and Concerts.

Charleston native

July 28, 2008, 01:32:40 PM
Stephen, thank you for posting some positive things about the city. At times, it can be discouraging for me to read some of these posts as I hope to live down there.

Ocklawaha

July 28, 2008, 02:01:02 PM
THanks Stephen, you've just named 10 great reasons to build my streetcar line as the neck-piece on this string of pearls. I hope JTA is watching, and Mr. Peyton? How about you? With the Skyway and the Streetcar we would be the only city in the world where Buck Rogers Transit, meets Mr. Hardy and Mr. Tom Mix.


Ocklawaha

jrtmom

July 28, 2008, 07:08:43 PM
And we have a number of great parks too!  In my neck of the woods we have Confederate - with the beautiful Women of the South sculpture and the rose arbor...not to mention the Springfield Dog Park!  And Klutho, with the bandstand, the ball field, the fountain....and those two are just a small part of the near-downtown parks.  What about the Treaty Oak??  Lots of cool stuff all walkable. 

downtownparks

July 28, 2008, 08:34:44 PM
Your right JRT. Another great park that is vastly underused is A Phillip Randolph Park. It was done well, but spends much of its time locked up, or being used as a social services handout point.

With the nice little performing area, how about free-form jazz fridays, or big brother big sister weekly gatherings to use the playgorunds.

Sadly Oakland park and Liberty Park have been pretty well destroyed at this point, but if we could get some positivity back in the parks, it would be huge. In fact, if you were to focus much of the at risk youth efforts in the parks, you would probably reach a far greater number of kids earlier.

stephendare

July 28, 2008, 08:59:48 PM

I'm afraid unless someone bellys up to to the bar, the above statement answers it for Jacksonville... "inner city attractions". Okay, NAME 10 that would make you pull off the freeway.

stephendare

October 21, 2008, 03:57:52 PM
Some say, "Jacksonville is a diamond that wants to remain coal". What would it be like if Jacksonville were a city that didn’t hate itself... led by people who acknowledged its achievements?
Here are a few things that possibly would have happened in New York, Rome, London Paris, Seattle, or San Francisco if the leaders that made them into Great Cities had been given our city and history.

The George Washington Hotel on Adams Street, would be the premier boutique hotel in downtown, instead of the surface parking lot it is today.

The Southern Music Hall of Fame would be open and full to capacity somewhere in downtown. Molly Hatchet, Lynyrd Skynyrd and The Allman Brothers would have exhibits there and all the music aficionados would know a history of the Southern music and the Jacksonville music scene.

A statue of Ray Charles would stand in the perfectly preserved and popular bar where he first played soul piano and blues in the South.

There would be another museum of Black Film commemorating the achievements of black filmmakers here in Jacksonville.

Peterbrookes, The Loop Pizza and the Chicken Coop would all have gigantic headquarters in the center of town that rivaled the marooned Cruise Ship of a Building that Preston Haskell's company erected to itself on Riverside Avenue. There would be standing lines for tours of Sally Industry.

Blaire Woolverton would have her own cable show and Jake Godbold would have a cookbook.

Ray Mason would have an Institute where international finance and Arabic trade principles were taught, studied and debated. People would know who Raymond Mason was, and have no fucking clue who Craig Van Horn was.

When the Jacksonville Film Festival opened every year, Josh Skierski and Chad Hendricks would be the Emcees and Rita Manyette would be the Gala Hostess.

Mandarin would have a trolley tour of the famous writers who lived there over the past century. And even white people would know that Zora Neal Hurston lived here.

People would know who Zora Neal Hurston was.

There would be tours of the Confederate monuments and rubbings over the gravestones at the Confederate Graveyard in the Old City Cemetery.

People would be patriotic about Maxwell House. It would have a string of successful cafes all over town.

Jacksonville Tars and the Negro League’s Jacksonville Redcap’s throwback jerseys, would be available at any given local sporting goods store.

Matt Carlucci would have been Mayor and John Peyton would be president of the Chamber of Commerce.

There would be a Maritime Museum on the riverfront celebrating the many nautical elements of Jacksonville's History.

Old Stanton would be a Music Conservatory which offered a scholarship in the name of the writer of "Lift every Voice and Sing" The River City Band would be housed there.

The Jewish Center and graveyard would have signs on the bridges and highways to point out the gigantic and culturing effect that Jewish people had on Jacksonville, an unexpectedly tolerant and welcoming home in a time and country that met them everywhere else with fear and loathing.

 



Brochures would direct people to the bohemian district in Five Points, the Gay Mecca at Park and King and the real cracker cooking in the nationally rated southern restaurants of the Northside.


Noel Freidline would be a rich man with a big Jazz Club that he owned somewhere on the Riverwalk.

Marabanong would be a famously discussed historical feature on the Jacksonville tour.

Someone would have said "Thanks" to John Currington for resurrecting San Marco.

Or Lex Hester.

There would be a monument and perhaps a college marking the Landing of Protestant French Huguenots, and you could buy well-researched books about their history here.

There would be reenactments of pirate clipper attacks on the Ortega River, and the locals would brag about which French or English pirate they were descended from.

The Great Black Way would have curio shops and little plastic bubbles with glitter in them swirling round Duke Ellington and Billy Holiday performing at the Ritz, and Klutho's Balustrade would be lit at night so that lovers could walk past the moonlit canal along Hogan's Creek.

There would be bronze statues of the Creature from the Black Lagoon, Bill Pickett (the famous black cowboy from Norman Studios in Arlington), Tom Mix and Oliver Hardy (of Laurel and Hardy) on the Riverwalk instead of the goofy jogger?

There would be a big Barbeque festival on Main Street every year and people would come from miles around to check out a hundred million recipes for ribs and collard greens.

It would create an interesting and colorful course that teaches our history and the cities issues and require that it be taught to all 7th graders.

The architecture wouldn’t have to be studied from old postcards and books with crossed out black and white photos with the word "demolished" stamped across them.

The urban population would have increased faster adding to the corporate scrapers due to the less restrictive city policy and would make Jacksonville the premier city in Florida if not the southeast.

The sports venues would have been built into the urban fabric allowing neighboring establishments to feed off of the activity.

We would have an iconic courthouse and a bustling government district.

We would have a multi-use convention center producing activity 24-7.

The surrounding neighborhoods would all be connected to the core via a comprehensive network of commuter, light rail or skyway lines.

Visitors to the city would have a multitude of way finding signs leading to attractions, parking, and districts.

Tourist visiting the area wouldn't leave town without making a trip over to the energetic and cultural diverse Jacksonville Farmer's Market District, which connects downtown with historic Durkeeville.



There would be a permanent exhibit of Joe La Rose's shoes at the City hall or perhaps the LaVilla School of the Arts and students would host John Fluevog competitions for shoe design every year.

Downtown would be full of Paparazzi following the exploits of Jacksonville's unbelievably accomplished Spoken Word Royalty.

Al Letson, Liz Straight, David Pugh Allan Justiss, Jon Reich, Valerie Anthony, Christina Wagner, Lee Harvey, and Iain Mairs would be household names. The Mayor would know them all, and they would be able to make a living with speaking engagements.

But we don't have those things.

They are too 'low class', too 'black' and too 'southern'.

Instead we have consultants telling us how to appear more like Indianapolis or Louisville.

If we wanted to be Indianapolis or some other place...

But we don't have a "Jacksonville".

stephendare

October 22, 2008, 01:39:37 PM
There would also be a tribute to A Phillip Randolph and a connection to the Pullman company.

Ocklawaha

October 22, 2008, 02:47:46 PM
Quote
There would also be a tribute to A Phillip Randolph and a connection to the Pullman company.

Correction if I may friend Stephendare.

There would also be a Civil Rights Museum, a tribute to A. Phillip Randolph, tied to a Pullman themed railroad museum which leads to the Porters and the RED CAPS, which directs our visitors on to watch our new RED CAPS play ball in the Baseball Gounds of Jacksonville, "BIRTHPLACE OF THE NEGRO LEAGUES".

Oh and our Huguenot arch would span a freeway and not unlike Welthauptstadt Germania, it would be an arch more than twice the size of the Arc de Triomphe


OCKLAWAHA

stephendare

November 05, 2008, 10:03:06 AM
thanks ock!

globatron

December 25, 2008, 09:03:48 AM
Great work Stephen.  This was a pleasure to read.  The commentary off this article alone is award winning. 
I'm amazed by how much back and forth this site generates.  What about the arts in Jacksonville?  What would they be if you had your druthers?  I'd love to hear that vision.  You painted a great picture from an overall cultural perspective, but I didn't see any mention of contemporary art and where it would be if we had good leadership.  I have my own vision, but I'd love to hear yours.  Happy Holidays by the way. 

globatron

December 25, 2008, 09:10:53 AM
Oh also,

You might find this interesting for the Southern Rock museum. 
http://www.globatron.org/uncategorized/update-on-sam-durants-proposal

A very famous artist that teaches for CAL Arts.  He put together a proposal
for a project at Friendship park. 

If we could get this installed it would be a great starting point for starting that type of
pride I think we need to develop.  I have his email and was supposed to get back to him
after finals were over last semester but didn't follow up.

BridgeTroll

December 25, 2008, 09:36:16 AM
Welcome globatron!  Great website from what I had a chance to see.  I will explore more later...

ProjectMaximus

December 25, 2008, 01:16:27 PM
welcome to the site, globatron. I took a look at your link and would be very interested to hear his back story.

globatron

December 25, 2008, 01:32:30 PM
Thank you so much.  really appreciate the kind welcome. 

Here's the project summary that Sam sent me.

Sam Durant

Proposal for Monument in Friendship Park, Jacksonville, FLA.
2000

This project consists of a theoretical proposal for a monument to Southern Rock in Friendship Park in Jacksonville Florida.  The park was the site of Sunday afternoon jam sessions in the late sixties in which members of the Allman Brothers Band and Lynyrd Skynyrd participated.  Other young musicians (who went on to form bands like Blackfoot, .38 Special, Grinderswitch and Wet Willie) would watch the jam sessions and sometimes participate.  Arguably this park was the birthplace of Southern Rock.

My idea with the Proposal for Monument in Friendship Park, Jacksonville, Fla. was to have a place for people to play music in the Park.  I built a country shack back porch and a rock garden with fiberglass rocks and trash cans.  The porch has rocking chairs, a large collection of Southern Rock records and two record players (which play both forwards and backwards). The fiberglass rocks and trash can in the garden have loudspeakers in them, which connect to the record players.  As you play the records on the porch the sound gets mixed out in the garden.  The rock formations in the garden are based on the pattern of the Ryoanji Temple Garden in a “figure eight” or infinity pattern.  This idea of no beginning or end is echoed symbolically as you play the music both backward and forward.

During the research for this project I began to see some connections to the work of Isamu Noguchi.  I am very interested in his gardens and parks.  Friendship Park looked like a site for a Noguchi park.  It is an urban plaza; more concrete than grass and trees.  It reminded me of Noguchi’s park here in Little Tokyo at the Japanese Cultural Center.  The  Cultural Center also has a traditional Japanese garden adjacent to Noguchi’s plaza.  In his writings Noguchi referred to the rocks in a traditional garden as being protuberances and that they connected below the surface to the primordial mass.  I found this idea very interesting as I imagined all the elements in my project to be connected by the music; porch to rocks to trash cans.

I am also very interested in his stage sets for Martha Graham’s dance performances, in particular her “Appalachian Spring”.  Aaron Copeland’s score is an emphatically American and particularly Southern work.  It is a hybrid, mixing American vernacular music into the European Symphonic form.  This seemed to be a parallel to Southern Rock (itself a hybrid) with its mixing Appalachian and country music with blues and rock and roll.  Noguchi’s sets for Graham’s dance included an abstracted shack and porch and a stylized rocking chair among other elements.  These became a basis for my porch and specially made rocking chairs.  I also liked the idea that the Proposal was itself a kind of set with a stage inside of it.  If the Proposal were ever to actually be built in Friendship Park the porch would serve as a stage on which people could jam with the sound being amplified throughout the park from the loudspeakers inside the rocks and trash cans.

Sam Durant

.....................

He was into talking about possibly a permanent install of the project.  I'm thinking it would be a perfect installation to start some of the ideas / concepts Stephen began to outline.  I'm betting with an internationally known artist interested the city might take interest.  Possibly?  Who knows.  I didn't get back to Sam but if we could get more folks interested and begin to rally around the project I bet he'd be more interested in investing his own time in it as I'm sure he is very busy (as are we all).

Thanks again for the welcome.
                                                   

globatron

December 25, 2008, 01:38:54 PM
nevermind. sorry.  that project description was on the original post. 

stephendare

December 25, 2008, 01:41:21 PM
Well what do we really need in order to get started with such a thing?  Globatron, weve started a thing or two in this town already, lets take this on?

BTW. thanks for the kind words, and welcome to the site at last!

stephendare

December 25, 2008, 01:50:45 PM
Memphis Wood would have a fabric and textile academy named after her, and there would be a gallery of her and Charlie Brown's works and effects in the downtown sponsored by all of our local learning institutions.

Marilyn Taylor would be a celebrity, Kate Kaufman would teach ceramics when the mood hit her, and Tim Bullard would have an entire course of his patented Ceramics glazes printed and in production supplying the whole world.

Lee Harvey would be a mainline opener at the JMOCA, Jennifer Johnson would be invited to (and accept invitations for) art parties thrown by Brenda Starr Walker.

Valery Anthony, Al Letson, David Pugh, and Ian Mairs would see their plays produced and written about by the local media.

Michael Emerson, Aaron Staten, and Connie Fletcher would be given keys to the city and Caitlyn Parrish would drink for free in any private club in town.

Jimmy Pines would have a skateboard franchise, Ryan Rummell would be teaching art, and Nurse would be a rich man from his successful pop art that would be pushed by every advertising agency in town.

Tim Hamlet would be the head of a powerful JCVA, and there would be an academy of contemporary art paid for by Preston Haskell at the Museum.

stephendare

December 25, 2008, 02:00:24 PM
http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/120104/new_17305512.shtml

CITY SOJOURN: Innovative art teachers draw laurels

By TONYAA WEATHERSBEE
Times-Union columnist

Memphis Wood had a knack for seeing the beauty in things that would otherwise be cast off as by-products.

The longtime Jacksonville artist and educator, who died in Atlanta 15 years ago at age 87, taught art in Duval County from 1929 until 1962. There was little money for art then, so she found herself digging through trash heaps for teaching materials like bottle caps, corks, wires and scrap fabrics -- things that could be shaped into art and, in turn, shape her students' ideas about possibilities.

"We had 25 cents a term [per student] for art supplies," Wood told the Times-Union in 1985. "I used to walk down to a junkyard near the school and find discarded lumber. Some of it was cut in beautiful shapes. Oh the things we made out of that were lovely!"

When it comes to teaching art these days, educators are facing much of the challenge that Wood faced back in the day.

That's why the Jacksonville Museum of Modern Art has come up with something it hopes will inspire more area teachers to meet that challenge by finding their inner Memphis Wood. It is introducing its Memphis Wood Excellence in Teaching Award.

The $1,000 award, which will be offered through the museum's Memphis Wood Society, recognizes a teacher who finds innovative ways to weave visual arts into the curriculum. Classroom and art teachers in kindergarten through grade 12 in Baker, Duval, Nassau, Clay and St. Johns counties are eligible to apply.

The nomination deadline is Feb. 15. For applications, go to www.jmoma.org, or call the museum at 366-6911 extension 204.

"In any profession, there's always some kind of recognition for people who do a good job, and art teachers feel very under-recognized," said Allison Graff, director of education at the museum. "Memphis Wood was an art teacher, and she was a member of our board during her lifetime ... so it's only fitting that this type of award would be made in her honor."

With teachers having to spend much of their time teaching skills for the Florida Comprehensive Assessment Test, this award is being offered at a crucial time for arts education.

Graff said the museum has high hopes for what the Memphis Wood award might do to inspire art in education.

"It won't only encourage the teachers who are good at their jobs, but will encourage other teachers to do more with art and to make more of what they do public," Graff said. "Teachers are so pressured to teach to the FCAT, and it is very limiting. This will encourage them to reach outside the box."

Maybe the award will inspire more teachers to work around those limitations by treating them as another artistic challenge. Like Memphis Wood did.

globatron

December 25, 2008, 05:30:16 PM
Nice vision Stephen.  I'm honestly not aware of many of the artists that you speak of.  I'd be interested in doing interviews with them.  Would you?  How would I pursue an interview with them?

Also, how could we pursue the Friendship Park installation?  Does anyone know the appropriate team to get together to pursue such an endeavor? 

Glad to be involved in such a dialogue.  Amazing to see it happening.   

stephendare

December 25, 2008, 06:57:16 PM
well memphis wood is dead, as is charlie brown.

Marilyn Taylor is still quite alive and kicking, and can be found through the Jacksonville Coalition of Visual Arts, Kate Kaufman is at the Beach as is Tim Bullard.

Lee Harvey is fairly elusive.  In fact the interview he gave you was the last local one he will probably do.

Jennifer Johnson's amazing photography is available at J. Johnson's gallery at the beach.

I think Ian Rannes is in touch with Jimmy Pines, Nurse can be found through the kids at Burro Bags, and Tim Hamlet is in Riverside.  Ryan Rummell owns TSI.

globatron

December 25, 2008, 08:17:20 PM
Well good :).  I don't feel too that out of it.  50 percent of the folks you speak of I'm fairly well acquainted with along with their state of mortality. 

What about the project?  Do you feel it's wroth pursuing?  I mean I think everyone involved in the arts in town could pick five-ten artists we think should be involved in the Who's Who of Jacksonville art, and get keys to the city, etc, but where to start? I myself am not too sure why you continually speak of Lea Harvey so fondly.  I know more than a handful of artist locally who feel anytime he's around he sort of spoils the scene. I mean we all have our friend and buddys, especially in the arts.

Lee Harvey has called me names and threatened me physically all through a thread on Globatron all of which have made me question his sanity.   Of which I often don't do as I myself was in a military mental ward for a nice two week stay for depression.  The best two weeks of my life.  I definitely think your opinion of him is quite biased as nearly everyone I speak to thinks completely opposite.  I'm confused as I really respect your opinion on nearly everything else.

The Friendship Park project is one that's already popularly exhibited by an artist that is more well known internationally than any local Who's Who.  We might need to tap artist outside of Jacksonville for anyone to take us serious for a monumental installation. 

stephendare

December 25, 2008, 08:59:51 PM
lol.  Thats Lee.

Even if he didnt enjoy the drama, and stirring the pot.  I think he just likes taking the piss out of you for using multiple screen names on the site.  I don't know, coz I havent tuned  on it, but even if he thought you needed a country ass whoopin ;) in real life, he prolly wouldnt be talking about it on the site.  Even so, he's  gotten pretty prickly and plainspoken:  Im sure you know what its like to fear dying of Cancer.  Lee has dodged the bullet for a while with the mesothelioma, which doesnt have much of a survival rate.  Even so, Im sure he'll find it hilarious to have it all discussed online though!

No such thing as bad press.

Speaking of which, I was blown away by your brain tumor surgery video..  What an interesting video you posted.  Its brilliant.  (And, I certainly hope your chances are better long term than Lee's.  He has a daughter as well you know.)  Its nor for the squeamish, but its memorable and I cant wait to see the project that we discussed last night on Christmas Eve. 

I guess its about the Art, not the personalities, Byron.  Lee and I hated each other more than most for years, but that didnt influence my opinion on his work then.  In any case Im sure that all art opinion is biased.  How else could it be anything but?  Thanks for asking for mine!  Ive learned over the years that the 'scenes' come and go, but the art remains, and thats what I try to pay attention to.

But surely we can discuss art without trying to tear someone down, right? 

You should make a list of the artists that you think have made a significant contribution!

Mine is only based on artists who have already moved their art forward in a way that is also defined by or defines the things that are Jacksonville.

I totally should have included Ronnie Land on my list.  Let me do so now.

"Ronnie Land would have a huge textiling business creating his wacky wonderful art en masse for shops around the world through a seed capital grant from our Cultural Council.

Ryan Coleman would have been commissioned to create public murals throughout the decaying industrial areas.

Tom Hager would be the official photographer of the City of Jacksonville and would be commissioned to do the counties photography.

Suzanne Pickett would have an important gallery on Ashley Street, and it would be powerful enough to launch the career of Overstreet Ducasse nationally.

The kids from Burro Bags would have city incentives to make their business HUGE.

And of course, there would be a facility where conceptual art and crossmedia work could be explored by artists like Morrison Pierce, Mark Creegan and yourself, and you guys would have a yearly show that introduced new work that was covered intelligently in our local blogs and media.

globatron

December 25, 2008, 10:09:11 PM
Yes, opinions, personalities.  I totally agree.  We all have our favorites, etc.  The work remains, I completely agree.  And instead of talking about who I feel is in my top ten, I think you were on the right, on your last statement when you began talking about the infrastructure needed to pull any of this off. 

I think the most needed element is a walkable gallery district.  Having just come from the Wynwood Arts District in Miami just three weeks ago now I'm amazed by what they've done with a ghetto run down warehouse district with many a crack head making it the the home on a permanent basis. 

Art Basel has woken up Miami to a degree I bet they would have never imagined eight years ago.  The Wynwood Art district has turned run down dilapidated warehouses into high dollar rentable art spaces, with neighboring  condos going up in towers right next door.  Art is the center of this transformation. 

The city could start this easily by allowing artists groups to maintain downtown buildings that are empty or in between leases.  Allow them to have shows for Art Walk, etc.  Just doing this one event would be noticeable withing a short time. 

I have no issues with any local artists.  I however, am not the one starting virtual fist fights.  I am in no situation to fight anyone.  I'm just glad to be alive as you pointed out.  Thankful for every breath.  Brain tumors are quite deadly Stephen.  I've been given a short prognosis and will start on chemo within the month. None of the tumor was removable. Of course they tell you not to listen to the statistics.  My issue is the tumor is in an inoperable area.  So we have to keep our fingers crossed and wait for the miracles of modern medicine to progress.  I've been given teen years on the high end.  2-5 on the average.  As I stated earlier I'm very happy to be alive.  I thoroughly enjoyed chatting with you last night, and I'm glad you think my Cancer is My Super Power project would be interesting.  I'm very excited to begin volunteering at the Children's hospital.  I need to look more into that and get involved asap.

I respect all of the artist you named and I definitely think some of them should be given more respect, more press, etc.  My question now though after have gotten some press in town myself, is what does it do for you?  Nothing for me so far.

I read this whole thread, and for the ones who think this is a great city to live in, and don't understand where Stephen is coming from with the lack of pride he speaks of, I seriously doubt you are trying to improve this city, or are involved in anything culturally speaking in Jax at all.  If you were, you'd realize how little pride local artists have here. 

globatron

December 25, 2008, 10:13:51 PM
http://jaxcal.blip.tv/file/1595762/

Here's the surgery that Stephen mentioned.  Please be advised it's not for everyone. 

If you can't stomach Discovery Health, don't watch this.

enjoy.

Byron

globatron

December 27, 2008, 01:01:12 PM
Oh Stephen.  One clarification.  I've only used two screen names on Globatron.  One for Globatron the alter ego character, and one for myself.  It's an art project, and I would think Lee would respect that and understand it.  Afterall, you think he's the best artist in town correct correct?  Wonder why an art project would piss him off enough to call me baby hitler?

Here's is a description of the project:
http://byronking.com/portfolio/portfolio/globatron

Here is the questionable commentary from Lee:
http://www.globatron.org/featured/the-green-kids

How can you stand by someone like Lee so firmly when he conducts himself like this so often?

I've been nothing but nice to him in person, and done nothing to him to warrant such reactions.  I actually
went to his art show at Fuel and documented it for him adding to his dismal web presence. Of which I even offered to design him a web site for free?  And on top of that posted the interview that you did with him, even though he obviously didn't take it seriously.

http://www.globatron.org/photos?album=18&gallery=25

I would think he'd be thankful for someone documenting his work, instead, he has called me names numerous times and threatened me physically.  It's really mind boggling.

A lot of us are going through hard times (health issues) but I don't think that gives anyone the right to be out right rude and hurtful to people, online or in person.  I mean speaking your mind is one thing, but to say what he said in the thread above is out right unforgivable. 




stephendare

December 27, 2008, 01:46:01 PM
Byron.

Come on.  I don't have to justify my opinion to you based on who you have or have not gotten along with, or what your friends think either for that matter.

I love you  Byron,   And I pray for you and wish you well.

Lee is also an artist, which I would think you would understand.  Especially in terms of the fact that Lees forte IS Controversy.  Has been for years.  And as I expressed to you on jaxcal, Two Bit Baby Hitler is Bank.  You should totally commandeer the phrase and turn it into a Band Name or a project.   Its hilarious, and Ive been called worse.  "bisonfucker" is probably the best thing Ive ever been called on the open streets of Jacksonville.  Ive laughed about it for years.   So inspirationally debilitating.

Youd have to be an especially determined tough cookie to be in the frame of mind where such a diversion would even seem possible....Rugged around the edges so to speak.  Donna Braden a 90s era Jacksonville Hipster called me that in front of my old Fusion Cafe.  For years Ive been trying to turn that lemon into a lemonade sweet enough to match the laughter its given me over the years.

But this thread isabout Jacksonville, not some apparent issue between the two of you.

But I hope that you guys do work it out.  It seems a shame that theres enough negativity that its spilling over into areas that no one really cares about it.

Peace to you Byron.  The infighting and backstabbing in the art 'scene' is one of the reasons why it has such difficulty getting supporters or patrons.  I look forward to you helping the rest of us bring an end to it.  Its a contributing factor to the whole point of this essay.

We all have our detractors and character assassins.  I still proudly display my Morrison Pierce canvasses despite the controversies---because of their beauty and meaning, and I still love Owen Holmes' ( a fellow poster on this board, btw) band, Black Kids, despite the opinion expressed on Jaxcal.com.

At some point no one really cares what old bones we gnaw on in our doghouses.  Its about the art, and the ideas and the outcomes.

Im so excited that you are posting here!  I look forward to seeing your commentary in the Arts Section!  Feel free to cross post links!.

Btw.  Not enough is written about Mark Creegan.  I certainly hope that we can fix that.

Happy New Year.

globatron

December 27, 2008, 02:54:24 PM
Roger that Stephen.  I completely agree with you.  You always seem to rise above and are a true example of how to conduct oneself through these threads.  I completely respect your opinion and how you approach things from a lighthearted "turn the other cheek" perspective. 

Mark Creegan has also been a great example of how to rise above via the commentary on globatron, and I need to let bygones by bygones but I hold onto things and don't forgive easily.  Especially when I feel I've done nothing to deserve such treatment. 

As far as Owen Holmes and the Black Kids, if you read the entire thread, I was opening the door for criticism of the band.  Not personally attacking them.   

You are developing some great content on here, and I'd be happy to do some cross posting from what we're doing over on globatron.  I really think others should read this article myself.  It's a real inspiration of the types of ideas and concepts that could change Jacksonville and turn it into the type of city we all are proud of and decide to stay in.  I believe I'll post a shout out to this article asap. 

stephendare

December 27, 2008, 03:43:35 PM
Thanks Byron!

Looking forward to telling more of the real Jacksonville story.

After all, part of the lack of pride in our heritage is the lack of storytellers.

The Great Fire is now a part of our shared common heritage, but when Wayne Wood wrote the book and published it, it had been totally forgotten.

If a tree falls in the forest without anyone to hear it, does it make a sound?

JaxNative68

January 15, 2009, 01:10:46 PM
If a historic building in downtown Jacksonville falls down to make way for new buildings pretending to be old ones, does it get noticed?

Doctor_K

January 15, 2009, 01:12:52 PM
^ Only by us, the vociferous minority.

JaxNative68

January 15, 2009, 04:49:56 PM
Architecture for the times you live in is all I ask for.

You can't trade one for one on buildings and expect your city to grow.  At the rate this city is going the downtown area will have the same number of buildings and a lot less history to show for its existence.  Architecture is the true fabric of any city.  You can't keep repeating the same pattern expect to have a city with any character. 

stephendare

February 19, 2009, 04:51:59 PM
Quote
The Southern Music Hall of Fame would be open and full to capacity somewhere in downtown. Molly Hatchet, Lynyrd Skynyrd and The Allman Brothers would have exhibits there and all the music aficionados would know a history of the Southern music and the Jacksonville music scene.

A statue of Ray Charles would stand in the perfectly preserved and popular bar where he first played soul piano and blues in the South.

There would be another museum of Black Film commemorating the achievements of black filmmakers here in Jacksonville.

Peterbrookes, The Loop Pizza and the Chicken Coop would all have gigantic headquarters in the center of town that rivaled the marooned Cruise Ship of a Building that Preston Haskell's company erected to itself on Riverside Avenue. There would be standing lines for tours of Sally Industry.

Blaire Woolverton would have her own cable show and Jake Godbold would have a cookbook.

Ray Mason would have an Institute where international finance and Arabic trade principles were taught, studied and debated. People would know who Raymond Mason was, and have no fucking clue who Craig Van Horn was.

When the Jacksonville Film Festival opened every year, Josh Skierski and Chad Hendricks would be the Emcees and Rita Manyette would be the Gala Hostess.

Mandarin would have a trolley tour of the famous writers who lived there over the past century. And even white people would know that Zora Neal Hurston lived here.

People would know who Zora Neal Hurston was.

There would be tours of the Confederate monuments and rubbings over the gravestones at the Confederate Graveyard in the Old City Cemetery.

People would be patriotic about Maxwell House. It would have a string of successful cafes all over town.

Jacksonville Tars and the Negro League’s Jacksonville Redcap’s throwback jerseys, would be available at any given local sporting goods store.

Matt Carlucci would have been Mayor and John Peyton would be president of the Chamber of Commerce.

There would be a Maritime Museum on the riverfront celebrating the many nautical elements of Jacksonville's History.

Old Stanton would be a Music Conservatory which offered a scholarship in the name of the writer of "Lift every Voice and Sing" The River City Band would be housed there.

The Jewish Center and graveyard would have signs on the bridges and highways to point out the gigantic and culturing effect that Jewish people had on Jacksonville, an unexpectedly tolerant and welcoming home in a time and country that met them everywhere else with fear and loathing.

Brochures would direct people to the bohemian district in Five Points, the Gay Mecca at Park and King and the real cracker cooking in the nationally rated southern restaurants of the Northside.


Noel Freidline would be a rich man with a big Jazz Club that he owned somewhere on the Riverwalk.

Marabanong would be a famously discussed historical feature on the Jacksonville tour.

Someone would have said "Thanks" to John Currington for resurrecting San Marco.

Or Lex Hester.

There would be a monument and perhaps a college marking the Landing of Protestant French Huguenots, and you could buy well-researched books about their history here.

There would be reenactments of pirate clipper attacks on the Ortega River, and the locals would brag about which French or English pirate they were descended from.

The Great Black Way would have curio shops and little plastic bubbles with glitter in them swirling round Duke Ellington and Billy Holiday performing at the Ritz, and Klutho's Balustrade would be lit at night so that lovers could walk past the moonlit canal along Hogan's Creek.

There would be bronze statues of the Creature from the Black Lagoon, Bill Pickett (the famous black cowboy from Norman Studios in Arlington), Tom Mix and Oliver Hardy (of Laurel and Hardy) on the Riverwalk instead of the goofy jogger?

There would be a big Barbeque festival on Main Street every year and people would come from miles around to check out a hundred million recipes for ribs and collard greens.

It would create an interesting and colorful course that teaches our history and the cities issues and require that it be taught to all 7th graders.

The architecture wouldn’t have to be studied from old postcards and books with crossed out black and white photos with the word "demolished" stamped across them.

The urban population would have increased faster adding to the corporate scrapers due to the less restrictive city policy and would make Jacksonville the premier city in Florida if not the southeast.

The sports venues would have been built into the urban fabric allowing neighboring establishments to feed off of the activity.

We would have an iconic courthouse and a bustling government district.

We would have a multi-use convention center producing activity 24-7.

The surrounding neighborhoods would all be connected to the core via a comprehensive network of commuter, light rail or skyway lines.

Visitors to the city would have a multitude of way finding signs leading to attractions, parking, and districts.

Tourist visiting the area wouldn't leave town without making a trip over to the energetic and cultural diverse Jacksonville Farmer's Market District, which connects downtown with historic Durkeeville.



There would be a permanent exhibit of Joe La Rose's shoes at the City hall or perhaps the LaVilla School of the Arts and students would host John Fluevog competitions for shoe design every year.

Downtown would be full of Paparazzi following the exploits of Jacksonville's unbelievably accomplished Spoken Word Royalty.

Al Letson, Liz Straight, David Pugh Allan Justiss, Jon Reich, Valerie Anthony, Christina Wagner, Lee Harvey, and Iain Mairs would be household names. The Mayor would know them all, and they would be able to make a living with speaking engagements.

But we don't have those things.

They are too 'low class', too 'black' and too 'southern'.

Instead we have consultants telling us how to appear more like Indianapolis or Louisville.

If we wanted to be Indianapolis or some other place...

But we don't have a "Jacksonville".

add to this list, that there would be statues to the two little ladies that preserved the book collection of the 'black' library, and thereby saved a heritage.

That the colorful history of Napoleon Bonaparte Broward, a direct descendant of Napoleon who was both mayor of the city and Governor of Florida.

ProjectMaximus

February 19, 2009, 09:13:17 PM
and maybe lynyrd skynyrd would be spelled correctly on guitar hero.

http://videogames.yahoo.com/feature/new-guitar-hero-game-misspells-quot-lynyrd-skynyrd-quot-/1289712

buyamerican101

March 03, 2009, 08:33:18 AM
We will wake up and find we do not have a job any longer. Did you know that a local company is moving jobs to China? Biomet in Warsaw, IN and Biomet - Microfixation located in the Airport Industrial Park, 1520 Tradeport Drive Jacksonville is moving jobs to China. All Biomet companies are moving work we Americans make to China. The company sites labor costs as the reason. Will the quality of these products be compromised? Have you read lately of China’s quality problems? What about the toys with lead and tainted baby’s milk? They are letting good people go that even mention words about China. Now the company is being pressed to rapidly move their products there before new laws will regulate.

Deuce

July 14, 2009, 02:28:36 PM
Wow! I felt like I was in an episode of Sliders for a sec.

copperfiend

July 14, 2009, 02:48:59 PM
The one where the British won the war?

David

July 14, 2009, 03:21:52 PM
No, the one where the south won.

Or the one where the population of San Francisco was only 250,000 because of the old people "lottery"

copperfiend

July 14, 2009, 03:24:14 PM
Not the one where the gate didn't squeak.

deathstar

July 15, 2009, 04:44:06 AM
One band that I feel deserves recognition here, who wasn't mentioned. Burn Season.

In their prime, they were selling out shows not only in Jacksonville, but in Gainesville, Orlando, Tallahassee, and even South Carolina. All of this WITHOUT a record contract. They recently reunited, with 3 original members and a newcomer, former Shinedown, current Society Red bassist Brad Stewart. The band are going to record another album for Bieler Bros. Records, which will be their Sophomore release.

FTU ran a story on the band this past Friday here: http://jacksonville.com/entertainment/music/2009-07-10/story/burn_season_reunites_plays_saturday_at_freebird_live. The band played their reunion show the next day, Saturday, at Freebird Live.

I listen to a variety of online radio shows, and hear Burn Season's single "Carry On" still played, 4 years later.

Deuce

July 15, 2009, 02:58:21 PM
The episode where Maggie Beckett was introduced.

Wacca Pilatka

July 17, 2009, 06:25:56 PM
"Jacksonville Tars and the Negro League’s Jacksonville Redcap’s throwback jerseys, would be available at a"ny given local sporting goods store."

Are these sold anywhere in town at all?  I have the CD "Entering Duval County" by the local artists Tal-Kin Trees, and one of the members is wearing a Red Caps jersey on the face of the CD.  Not that that says anything about where he found it.

Wacca Pilatka

July 17, 2009, 07:23:54 PM
On the Maxwell House suggestion, I know it's been mentioned many times on here that MH ought to open a coffee house downtown, either at a central location like the Landing (or 11E?), or as part of its facility to better integrate the plant with downtown.  I know I saw it mentioned in a T-U article several years ago too.  Has anyone actually approached MH about this?

DeadGirlsDontDance

July 23, 2009, 12:42:52 AM
Good article, Stephen.

Okay, I didn't read ALL of the comments, but I would like to point out that I have an intelligent, well-traveled friend from Europe who has lived here for over a decade. Like many, he is frustrated about how cool Jacksonville isn't, but he still chooses to live here. That should say something about this town.

No segue:

I am a Maxwell House patriot! Back in the old days, before emission regulations forced the papermills to stop vomiting so much filthy stench, the lovely smell of roasting coffee overpowered it and was the only thing that made breathing downtown bearable.  I don't miss the papermill smell, but I think Maxwell House should be allowed to freely blow unfiltered coffee-scented steam as far and wide as possible.

newzgrrl

February 17, 2010, 11:32:26 PM
This remains one of my favorite pieces on this site. I've read it more than a few times, and it inspires me every time.

stephendare

February 18, 2010, 09:33:56 AM
thanks newzgrrl!  Its from the heart

heights unknown

February 18, 2010, 09:45:48 AM
If Jacksonville suddenly woke up, it would resemble Atlanta or Miami.

"HU"

Sportmotor

February 18, 2010, 09:56:59 AM
If Jacksonville suddenly woke up, it would resemble Atlanta or Miami.

"HU"

I'd rather it just be Jacksonville and not anyplace else

Dog Walker

February 18, 2010, 11:26:12 AM
I sometimes think that Maxwell House takes everything good in their coffee and blows it out into the downtown air 'cause their coffee sure doesn't taste as good as the air smells.

Sportmotor

February 18, 2010, 05:38:17 PM
Starbuck's does

CS Foltz

February 18, 2010, 08:30:13 PM
Three Layers is better...........no where near as metalic nor bitter!

Sportmotor

February 18, 2010, 08:32:39 PM
True, but its a far drive to go out of the way for for me being in St. Johns.
I do love Starbuck's VIA Ready Brew packets. Those are so worth the price.

duvaldude08

February 19, 2010, 06:44:35 PM
I acutally do think Jacksonville is a city that "hates itself". Being a Jacksonville native, I absolutely love being here and will rep my city wherever I go. However, there are alot of residents who hate jacksonville and hate staying here and wont move. Anytime there something negative about us in the media most residents resort to saying, " man jacksonville sucks" or " I hate this place." That type of  attitude will never get us anywhere. If Jacksonville woke up, this would be a mega city beyond anyones imagination. Forget Miami and Atlanta. Duval county would be the place to be. We already are the biggiest city land wise in the US, not to mention the most populous city in the state of Florida. We have so much potential....

Wacca Pilatka

February 19, 2010, 08:42:57 PM
I live in Virginia, and if you've read anything I've written on this forum you know I love Jacksonville far more than any sane person should love a city.

I fell in love with it while growing up, when my family drove to New Smyrna on vacations.  From an early age I decided it was the most fascinating and beautiful place on the planet, just based on the view from 95. 

I didn't actually pay a formal visit to Jacksonville until I was 13 or 14.  I bought copies of Jacksonville's Architectural Heritage and the long out of print Old Hickory's Town.  Learning about Jacksonville's fascinating and underappreciated history and architecture took my 95-borne affection to a whole new level.

Any chance I get to take a vacation, I almost inevitably go to Jacksonville.  I love its warm and friendly people, its pace of life, its architecture, its color palette, its food, its football team.

Walking around downtown and Springfield and the other urban neighborhoods never gets old for me.  I love to visit the zoo, the MOSH, Kingsley Plantation, and Fort Caroline, and just to be on the river; to drive over the bridges and along Heckscher Drive and Riverside Avenue, enjoying the view.

How many cities have their own architectural style, served as the birthplace for a genre of music, played a central role in the development of the film industry?  How many played hosts to clashes of civilizations and clashes of two regions within one?  How many have a Clark's Fish Camp, a Jenkins, a Three Layers?  How many Avondale and San Marco equivalents are there to be found in this country?

In visiting Jacksonville much more frequently upon becoming an adult with stable income, and in reading this site daily for four years or so, I've learned a lot more about Jacksonville's flaws and shortcomings.  Learning this doesn't make me love the city any less.  I'm more inspired by its potential than dismayed over its failure to realize it.

I "meet," in person or through this message board and the jaguars.com one, a lot of people who love this city and stand up for it.

I also meet a lot of people who do not have the slightest appreciation for what Jacksonville is and trash the city and everything about it at the slightest opportunity. 

The proportion of the latter set seems disturbingly high.

Anyone who thinks there's no culture, no distinction, nothing to do in the city, mystifies me.

Anyone who accepts and internalizes the taunts of the Miamis and Orlandos or the national sports press mystifies me even more.

I've been fortunate to bring two of my best friends to Jacksonville in the past few years for several Jaguar games.  Going in without any preconceived notions of what Jacksonville is, they've enjoyed themselves and the city immensely.

I show friends and coworkers who've never seen Jacksonville pictures of the urban landscape, the neighborhoods, the architecture, and the river.  Without fail, they're stunned at the beauty of the buildings and setting.

I'm no denier of the areas in which Jacksonville needs to improve and almost always find myself in agreement with the leitmotifs of this website about how the ways in which the city needs to change.

But this is a very, very special place, and I'll never understand the damage wrought by those who choose to believe it's trendy to down their hometown.

finehoe

February 19, 2010, 09:32:18 PM
^^ Wacca, I'm curious...why haven't you moved here?

Miss Fixit

February 20, 2010, 09:02:49 AM
Anyone who thinks there's no culture, no distinction, nothing to do in the city, mystifies me.

Anyone who accepts and internalizes the taunts of the Miamis and Orlandos or the national sports press mystifies me even more.

I've been fortunate to bring two of my best friends to Jacksonville in the past few years for several Jaguar games.  Going in without any preconceived notions of what Jacksonville is, they've enjoyed themselves and the city immensely.

I show friends and coworkers who've never seen Jacksonville pictures of the urban landscape, the neighborhoods, the architecture, and the river.  Without fail, they're stunned at the beauty of the buildings and setting.

I'm no denier of the areas in which Jacksonville needs to improve and almost always find myself in agreement with the leitmotifs of this website about how the ways in which the city needs to change.

But this is a very, very special place, and I'll never understand the damage wrought by those who choose to believe it's trendy to down their hometown.

Wacca, thanks for this beautiful tribute  to Jacksonville.  I agree wholeheartedly with everything you've said.

I've lived and travelled all over the U.S. and world.  Settled in Jacksonville because of a job but grew to love the city, its rich history, its beautiful architecture. 

I can't possibly attend all of the events I have to choose from here,  both during the week and on weekends.  In the next few weeks I have my choice of Porgy and Bess, NCAA Basketball, Elvis Costello and Monster Truck jams!
The beaches and rivers and intracoastal all provide fantastic recreational opportunities.

Neither my waist nor my wallet can afford to eat as often as I'd like at my favorite Jacksonville restaurants, which can compete with those of any major city:  Orsay, Chew, Matthews, Thuptim Thai, Waafa and Mikes, Sliders, Athens Cafe, Picasso's, Meditteranea, the Casbah, Pastiche, the Wine Cellar, Bistro Aix...

Klutho and Ransom Buffalow homes in Springfield and Avondale, Marsh and Saxelbye and Henrietta Dozier's homes and churches and schools in San Marco, Avondale, Riverside, Springfield.  Cool shingled cottages in Atlantic Beach.  Modern masterpieces by Broward.

I love downtown and Springfield and that's where I get especially nostalgic for what might have been, and wonder how the politicians and business leaders of the 1940s through the 1990s could have looked the other way while Queen Ann homes built before the 1901 fire were converted to six unit apartments and Klutho's masterpieces downtown were demolished to make way for some of the ugliest parking garages anywhere on the planet. And his beautiful central park ignored and allowed to fall into disrepair.

But what remains is or could be beautiful. Both Springfield and downtown are on their way back.

Thanks to Metro Jacksonville for being such an eloquent voice for change!

stephendare

February 20, 2010, 09:14:11 AM
Thanks Miss Fixit!

We all love this place.  Its what brings us all together and clarifies the committment.

Wacca Pilatka

February 20, 2010, 09:19:53 AM
^^ Wacca, I'm curious...why haven't you moved here?

I get asked that a lot...mainly because all my family is here or nearby, I do like where I live and love my job.

PJparker

February 28, 2010, 08:11:40 PM
People who speak wistfully about other cities they have lived, they are just echoing this very article.  Jacksonville could be a great city for everyone.  Instead of telling people "you can always move," (no longer true, btw), why not tell people about some activity or location or establishment in Jacksonville similar to what they are missing?  Snowboarding? Have you tried surfboarding?  Miss the arts?  This is how to get involved with the Jacksonville art and culture venues.  Have ideas for the city council?  Good luck with that.
I grew up in Jacksonville and left as soon as I could for Atlanta.  I loved Atlanta, but had to return 10 years ago due to a dying father and sick mother.  Now I am stuck here.  I am an outsider.  I don't think like other people in Jacksonville, or so I am told when I express my opinions.  People are quick to take offense to everything, like they want to fight, be it in traffic or shopping or conversation.  The pervasive idea of putting other people down to feel up.  The mind control imposed by the local news, schools and churches is stifling.  It makes me sad. 
Jacksonville's people need to feel empowered, not restricted, pushed and herded.

sheclown

February 28, 2010, 09:06:15 PM
Quote
Jacksonville's people need to feel empowered, not restricted, pushed and herded.

...we all do.  Wonderful line.  Let's work on that!!!

SkipnStones

February 28, 2010, 10:15:01 PM
I am a Florida native....Miami ws the home town. Growing up in Miami North Fla always seemed to get the short end of the stick when it came to investments from State revenues.
It still the same because Jacksonville does not have Representatives worthy of the position they hold. I am sure they would shout and cry about how much they have done for Jacksonville. Make your own judgment but it is apparent that results are achieved from Orlando down to Key West.

Jacksonville is truly the hidden jewel  on the Sunshine Coast. If we had Representation Jacksonville could be polished and shine as the next great opportunity for business, technology and the arts!

 

tufsu1

February 28, 2010, 11:39:53 PM
if you are referring to representation in Tallahassee, what about the power of folks like John Thrasher and Jim King?

It is important to remember that South Florida has over 5 million people, the Tampa Bay area has close to 3 million, Orlando has over 2 million, and northeast Florida has about 1.25 million.

PJparker

March 01, 2010, 01:46:04 PM
True tufsu1, but all roads go through North Florida to reach those destinations.  More people experience North Florida first and last.  Jacksonville could be presented as a great place to stop along the way, with great hotels and restaurants and shopping, green areas like parks and easy access to beautiful vistas.  The landing is OK, but there should be an incentive for tourists and stop-overs.  I have traveled a lot for business throughout the Southeast, and I couldn't wait to get out of a city that was difficult to negotiate toward my destination.  Easy access to state parks for a rest or a local art festival or museum.  Chain stores and restaurants and hotels and a view of the road are boring, I can get that anywhere.  Scenic drives (Pacific coast) and interesting architecture (Natchez MI), and antique row (Marianna, FL) and festivals (New Orleans) are a welcome retreat.

JaxNative68

March 01, 2010, 03:03:28 PM
^It was that place a long time ago, the city leaders s**t all over it, and this is what we have left.

tufsu1

March 01, 2010, 05:28:02 PM
True tufsu1, but all roads go through North Florida to reach those destinations.  More people experience North Florida first and last. 

Unless of course you're flying in or arriving by boat....plus, remember, that many residents/visitors of Florida come from Central and South America.

Coolyfett

March 01, 2010, 10:27:25 PM
"Jacksonville Tars and the Negro League’s Jacksonville Redcap’s throwback jerseys, would be available at a"ny given local sporting goods store."

Are these sold anywhere in town at all?  I have the CD "Entering Duval County" by the local artists Tal-Kin Trees, and one of the members is wearing a Red Caps jersey on the face of the CD.  Not that that says anything about where he found it.

The Baseball grounds used to sell Redcap Jerseys...that is the only place I ever seen one.

Jaxson

March 07, 2010, 03:00:25 PM
I definitely agree with stephendare about how the city could make more of its heritage and culture.

Wacca Pilatka

March 07, 2010, 03:07:01 PM
"Jacksonville Tars and the Negro League’s Jacksonville Redcap’s throwback jerseys, would be available at a"ny given local sporting goods store."

Are these sold anywhere in town at all?  I have the CD "Entering Duval County" by the local artists Tal-Kin Trees, and one of the members is wearing a Red Caps jersey on the face of the CD.  Not that that says anything about where he found it.

The Baseball grounds used to sell Redcap Jerseys...that is the only place I ever seen one.

Thanks...I still was wondering about this.

scottjsmith

April 21, 2010, 09:54:13 PM
Actually, what Jacksonville needs is a good marketing firm.  There are several in town, and I'm not sure who holds the account right now.  Whoever it is obviously does not have a good enough budget to market to its own residents, let alone potential visitors.  I'm sure that's something else that gets knocked down at city council meetings:  "Why should we pay to advertise our city, when we have cobblestone crosswalks to build?"

This article, and its comments, show that Jacksonville is a vibrant city, but the energy is wasted talking about "what could have been," rather than "what can be."

Peg

May 18, 2010, 11:46:27 AM
Great article!  I would move to that city in a heartbeat.  Instead, we're leaving after six years.  But not before finding our more about Zora Neale Hurston having lived in Mandarin....

In packing today I came across a letter that my grandmother wrote to the state education commissioner in 1963 referencing a film called "The County That Cares".  She states that it compares Duval to Pinellas and says that it is "very thought provoking".  By chance, does anyone know if this is still out there anywhere? 

duvaldude08

May 18, 2010, 11:51:08 AM
as long as were arguing about bus shelters and parking for the landing, this city will never wake up. We cant even acheive the basics

Keith-N-Jax

May 18, 2010, 12:05:02 PM
Hard to wake when you dont even know your already dead.

stephendare

June 22, 2010, 05:23:43 PM
Some say, "Jacksonville is a diamond that wants to remain coal". What would it be like if Jacksonville were a city that didn’t hate itself... led by people who acknowledged its achievements?
Here are a few things that possibly would have happened in New York, Rome, London Paris, Seattle, or San Francisco if the leaders that made them into Great Cities had been given our city and history.

The George Washington Hotel on Adams Street, would be the premier boutique hotel in downtown, instead of the surface parking lot it is today.

The Southern Music Hall of Fame would be open and full to capacity somewhere in downtown. Molly Hatchet, Lynyrd Skynyrd and The Allman Brothers would have exhibits there and all the music aficionados would know a history of the Southern music and the Jacksonville music scene.

A statue of Ray Charles would stand in the perfectly preserved and popular bar where he first played soul piano and blues in the South.

There would be another museum of Black Film commemorating the achievements of black filmmakers here in Jacksonville.

Peterbrookes, The Loop Pizza and the Chicken Coop would all have gigantic headquarters in the center of town that rivaled the marooned Cruise Ship of a Building that Preston Haskell's company erected to itself on Riverside Avenue. There would be standing lines for tours of Sally Industry.

Blaire Woolverton would have her own cable show and Jake Godbold would have a cookbook.

Ray Mason would have an Institute where international finance and Arabic trade principles were taught, studied and debated. People would know who Raymond Mason was, and have no fucking clue who Craig Van Horn was.

When the Jacksonville Film Festival opened every year, Josh Skierski and Chad Hendricks would be the Emcees and Rita Manyette would be the Gala Hostess.

Mandarin would have a trolley tour of the famous writers who lived there over the past century. And even white people would know that Zora Neal Hurston lived here.

People would know who Zora Neal Hurston was.

There would be tours of the Confederate monuments and rubbings over the gravestones at the Confederate Graveyard in the Old City Cemetery.

People would be patriotic about Maxwell House. It would have a string of successful cafes all over town.

Jacksonville Tars and the Negro League’s Jacksonville Redcap’s throwback jerseys, would be available at any given local sporting goods store.

Matt Carlucci would have been Mayor and John Peyton would be president of the Chamber of Commerce.

There would be a Maritime Museum on the riverfront celebrating the many nautical elements of Jacksonville's History.

Old Stanton would be a Music Conservatory which offered a scholarship in the name of the writer of "Lift every Voice and Sing" The River City Band would be housed there.

The Jewish Center and graveyard would have signs on the bridges and highways to point out the gigantic and culturing effect that Jewish people had on Jacksonville, an unexpectedly tolerant and welcoming home in a time and country that met them everywhere else with fear and loathing.

 



Brochures would direct people to the bohemian district in Five Points, the Gay Mecca at Park and King and the real cracker cooking in the nationally rated southern restaurants of the Northside.


Noel Freidline would be a rich man with a big Jazz Club that he owned somewhere on the Riverwalk.

Marabanong would be a famously discussed historical feature on the Jacksonville tour.

Someone would have said "Thanks" to John Currington for resurrecting San Marco.

Or Lex Hester.

There would be a monument and perhaps a college marking the Landing of Protestant French Huguenots, and you could buy well-researched books about their history here.

There would be reenactments of pirate clipper attacks on the Ortega River, and the locals would brag about which French or English pirate they were descended from.

The Great Black Way would have curio shops and little plastic bubbles with glitter in them swirling round Duke Ellington and Billy Holiday performing at the Ritz, and Klutho's Balustrade would be lit at night so that lovers could walk past the moonlit canal along Hogan's Creek.

There would be bronze statues of the Creature from the Black Lagoon, Bill Pickett (the famous black cowboy from Norman Studios in Arlington), Tom Mix and Oliver Hardy (of Laurel and Hardy) on the Riverwalk instead of the goofy jogger?

There would be a big Barbeque festival on Main Street every year and people would come from miles around to check out a hundred million recipes for ribs and collard greens.

It would create an interesting and colorful course that teaches our history and the cities issues and require that it be taught to all 7th graders.

The architecture wouldn’t have to be studied from old postcards and books with crossed out black and white photos with the word "demolished" stamped across them.

The urban population would have increased faster adding to the corporate scrapers due to the less restrictive city policy and would make Jacksonville the premier city in Florida if not the southeast.

The sports venues would have been built into the urban fabric allowing neighboring establishments to feed off of the activity.

We would have an iconic courthouse and a bustling government district.

We would have a multi-use convention center producing activity 24-7.

The surrounding neighborhoods would all be connected to the core via a comprehensive network of commuter, light rail or skyway lines.

Visitors to the city would have a multitude of way finding signs leading to attractions, parking, and districts.

Tourist visiting the area wouldn't leave town without making a trip over to the energetic and cultural diverse Jacksonville Farmer's Market District, which connects downtown with historic Durkeeville.



There would be a permanent exhibit of Joe La Rose's shoes at the City hall or perhaps the LaVilla School of the Arts and students would host John Fluevog competitions for shoe design every year.

Downtown would be full of Paparazzi following the exploits of Jacksonville's unbelievably accomplished Spoken Word Royalty.

Al Letson, Liz Straight, David Pugh Allan Justiss, Jon Reich, Valerie Anthony, Christina Wagner, Lee Harvey, and Iain Mairs would be household names. The Mayor would know them all, and they would be able to make a living with speaking engagements.

But we don't have those things.

They are too 'low class', too 'black' and too 'southern'.

Instead we have consultants telling us how to appear more like Indianapolis or Louisville.

If we wanted to be Indianapolis or some other place...

But we don't have a "Jacksonville".

Jerry Moran

June 22, 2010, 06:59:45 PM
Oh Stephen, you're a regular One Man DVI!  I wish you would run for City Council, District 4.

Jaxson

June 22, 2010, 07:44:10 PM
Run, Stephen, run!!!  We need you on the city council!

billy

June 22, 2010, 08:36:14 PM
The waters of the the Saint Johns would run as clear as Sprite from Sanford to the Jetties.
Dolphins, whom it would be legal to marry, who frolic on the sandy bottom of the downtown riverbed. Hogans Creek would be potable. An archipelago built from dredge spill off of San Marco would feature a statue of Ranger Hal, bigger than the Colossus of Rhodes.
You could turn on the radio and hear a non rap/country song recorded after 1982.

(Please note:I agree with and have previously contributed to this thread. It's been a long day.)

St. Auggie

June 22, 2010, 09:22:26 PM
In all seriousness, why dont you run for office?  You are very well spoken, have forgotten more about Jax then I will ever know.  You have this awesome platform with which to help you run.  I dont agree with you all the time, but Id back ya.  So there is one vote!

mtraininjax

June 22, 2010, 09:37:24 PM
Stephen,
You cannot compare Jacksonville to Indianapolis. Jacksonville is in a state that has the 4th larges GDP in the US, one that is larger than many of the countries in the world. We fight for resources with other multi-million populated cities, Orlando, Miami, and Tampa. Indianapolis has no one else really in the state other than South Bend, over 100,000 people. Comparing Jacksonville to a state with 1 major city is an unfair comparison. Indy has a much better governor who understands business, we just have too many people with their hand out on medicare, too many issues in our state.

Jerry Moran

June 22, 2010, 10:09:55 PM
I am quite serious about Stephen running for City Council.  He possesses a brilliant mind, a quick wit, great oratory ability, a familiarity with Jacksonville second to none,  and a unique charisma that would be remembered for decades into the future.  Stephen is a natural debater and tireless champion for the Truth.  How could he not run for a seat on the Council?

stephendare

June 23, 2010, 12:03:49 AM
I am very flattered guys!

Ive thought about it over the years, and it would be a cool opportunity.  If I became a councilmember, it would definitely be the most memorable office for decades.  I don't think I would stop writing directly from the council.

Who is district 4 anyways?

Jerry Moran

June 23, 2010, 01:39:51 AM
Quote
Who is district 4 anyways?

The  Honorable Don Redman.

Notice the little postage stamp in the upper left hand corner:

http://www.coj.net/NR/rdonlyres/edf7antnibynsxxvsz75xizl5wq4kja2swrijzcwbffov4uoskbhs5sp4hfsvu7r6nbzpro3djs5zqki4ldc3rocaqd/2007District04Map.pdf

BridgeTroll

June 23, 2010, 07:02:50 AM
The campaign would certainly be entertaining! :)

Wacca Pilatka

June 23, 2010, 08:26:45 AM
Council campaign or not, in all seriousness, whenever I read that essay I am more inspired to do what I can to improve Jacksonville's awareness of its many assets and fascinating history.

hightowerlover

June 23, 2010, 09:43:06 AM
The Allman Brothers are from Macon,GA and Oliver Hardy is from Milledgeville, GA

stephendare

June 23, 2010, 09:44:58 AM
True.  But people remember FDR for what he did in Washington rather than Hyde Park township, NY.

Doctor_K

June 23, 2010, 10:32:59 AM
The campaign would certainly be entertaining! :)
"Stephen Dares to take a bold new step for the Bold New City of the South!"

stephendare

June 23, 2010, 10:36:03 AM
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/GoAmQGzcLkc" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/GoAmQGzcLkc</a>

Doctor_K

June 23, 2010, 10:41:53 AM
If only I could see embedded videos at the office!  Makes me want to rush home on my lunch break! ;)

duvaldude08

June 23, 2010, 12:16:34 PM
I actually think Jacksonville is waking up. That is why the 2011 mayoral race is very important. We cant make the same mistake and hender our progress for another 4-8 years. We need a mayor that cares about its citizens and our needs and the needs of this city (downtown in particular), and not their own personal agenda.

SightseerLounge

June 24, 2010, 12:19:13 AM
Who will be that "savior" to deliver us out of the darkness?

Tell the savior to give me some Amtrak tickets, and tell him/her to give me some Sharks tickets. Both of them will be free of charge. I would say the Jaguars, but they are going to LA! (Jaguars--speak of waking up!)

Forget transit. Tell the "savior" to fix the schools!

BlueHorizon

July 19, 2010, 02:58:51 PM
We would be the number one city in the country to start up a company, instead of number thirteen.
@gkicjax

stephendare

September 06, 2010, 11:38:17 PM
Add to this that

The City would be known as the Cradle of Blues Music and there would be a Blues Museum next to the Clara White Museum on the Spot that it was first documented being played.

The intellectual and cultural accomplishments of the people who went on from Jacksonville to form the Harlem Renaissance would be remembered as the Jacksonville Genesis.

There would be a statue to Mary Nolan and a Grace Wilbur Trout Center for Women commemorating the achievements of the Suffragettes.

There would be a Ward Street Bordello Tour to show new generations the establishments that made the City famous, and Cora Crane would be one of the most famous women of the City's history.

ricker

September 07, 2010, 06:36:30 AM
DO eet!
before JAX does 'wake-up'!
Stephen Dare would be the ruphie that smacked the lifers in their sleepy arses_

stephendare

September 13, 2010, 09:48:36 AM
Another Addition:

Jacksonvillians would be the ultimate all american city because hell, we even invented the Six Pack of Beer.
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/forum/index.php/topic,9759.0.html

dougskiles

February 13, 2011, 08:26:50 AM
I had the pleasure of seeing Jacksonville wake up this morning.  Went for my weekend long run and watched the sky turn from deep blue to purple to orange.  The river was calm and reflected the lights from the bridges and buildings.  I stopped to admire the Tillie Fowler Memorial - which is spectacular at dawn and dusk.  Then I stopped to read about the World War memorial at Riverside Park (dedicated in 1924).  I love the Northbank Riverwalk.  It is something that our city has done really well and provides enjoyment to all.  I run along it several times a week and can think of no more diverse place in our city.

Then I got home and read this letter in the Florida Times Union:

Quote
Recently, I went to Five Points to meet a group. It was buzzing on a warm Florida winter night while the rest of the United States was bunkering down for the snowstorm of the century.

I am a single Mom so I don't get out very much and was surprised by all the activity. It was alive!

Five Points is not downtown, dang it. I am a real estate agent who has invested in downtown and would like to see it thrive.

I also fly for Delta Airlines and listen to the flight attendants who talk about how much fun it is to be on a layover in Jacksonville. The usual talk is about running alongside the river, the restaurants, shopping in San Marco, the great parties when there is the Florida-Georgia game and out music along the banks of the St. Johns River.

The flight attendants have told me they feel safe.

As I have had the privilege of experiencing cities throughout the U.S. and the world, the thing I look for is eye candy, then finishing up with my thirst and my stomach. We have such a great climate.

I am blown away by the story of the slave woman from Kingsley Plantation who became the wife of a plantation owner, then owned her own place. Why hasn't this story been made into a movie with Halle Berry playing the main role?

For food, we need to specialize in what we have right here - shrimp! Can you believe it, I was in Honolulu and was told they don't have shrimp! They don't live there! I go to Europe and you need to take out a second mortgage for, as they call it, "scampi."

Our proximity to amazing oysters is a treasure. We have a king's ransom in delicacies right here in our seaports. Try buying oysters in Europe. Ouch! Not tasty, thin and expensive.

I am an educated geographer and have interned in urban affairs at the University in Minnesota. Jacksonville has more qualities than San Diego, yet it has this insecurity complex that is undeserved.

We live in an amazing part of the United States. Water everywhere! This beats anywhere in California, Oregon or Maine. I can sell waterfront properties from Lake George to Fernandina Beach!

CYNTHIA SYVERSON

Read more at Jacksonville.com: http://jacksonville.com/opinion/letters-readers/2011-02-13/story/jacksonville-no-reason-low-self-esteem#ixzz1DqRm74sM

Bravo Ms. Syverson!  Thank you for sharing your optimism.  With so much time spent trying to fix the things that are wrong, we need to spend more time expressing gratitude for what we have.

Noone

February 13, 2011, 09:53:16 AM
+1

cityimrov

February 13, 2011, 11:26:18 AM
I had the pleasure of seeing Jacksonville wake up this morning.  Went for my weekend long run and watched the sky turn from deep blue to purple to orange.  The river was calm and reflected the lights from the bridges and buildings.  I stopped to admire the Tillie Fowler Memorial - which is spectacular at dawn and dusk.  Then I stopped to read about the World War memorial at Riverside Park (dedicated in 1924).  I love the Northbank Riverwalk.  It is something that our city has done really well and provides enjoyment to all.  I run along it several times a week and can think of no more diverse place in our city.

Then I got home and read this letter in the Florida Times Union:

Quote
Recently, I went to Five Points to meet a group. It was buzzing on a warm Florida winter night while the rest of the United States was bunkering down for the snowstorm of the century.

I am a single Mom so I don't get out very much and was surprised by all the activity. It was alive!

Five Points is not downtown, dang it. I am a real estate agent who has invested in downtown and would like to see it thrive.

I also fly for Delta Airlines and listen to the flight attendants who talk about how much fun it is to be on a layover in Jacksonville. The usual talk is about running alongside the river, the restaurants, shopping in San Marco, the great parties when there is the Florida-Georgia game and out music along the banks of the St. Johns River.

The flight attendants have told me they feel safe.

As I have had the privilege of experiencing cities throughout the U.S. and the world, the thing I look for is eye candy, then finishing up with my thirst and my stomach. We have such a great climate.

I am blown away by the story of the slave woman from Kingsley Plantation who became the wife of a plantation owner, then owned her own place. Why hasn't this story been made into a movie with Halle Berry playing the main role?

For food, we need to specialize in what we have right here - shrimp! Can you believe it, I was in Honolulu and was told they don't have shrimp! They don't live there! I go to Europe and you need to take out a second mortgage for, as they call it, "scampi."

Our proximity to amazing oysters is a treasure. We have a king's ransom in delicacies right here in our seaports. Try buying oysters in Europe. Ouch! Not tasty, thin and expensive.

I am an educated geographer and have interned in urban affairs at the University in Minnesota. Jacksonville has more qualities than San Diego, yet it has this insecurity complex that is undeserved.

We live in an amazing part of the United States. Water everywhere! This beats anywhere in California, Oregon or Maine. I can sell waterfront properties from Lake George to Fernandina Beach!

CYNTHIA SYVERSON

Read more at Jacksonville.com: http://jacksonville.com/opinion/letters-readers/2011-02-13/story/jacksonville-no-reason-low-self-esteem#ixzz1DqRm74sM

Bravo Ms. Syverson!  Thank you for sharing your optimism.  With so much time spent trying to fix the things that are wrong, we need to spend more time expressing gratitude for what we have.


Maybe because we have all this stuff naturally is why we're taking things for granted and have become lazy.  We don't need to work to obtain natural beauty like that river.  It was given to us. 

Some of the greatest areas in the world are in terrible places climatically.  I'm thinking, as a city, we should act like we have nothing so we can use our strength to build something.  Look at cities in our northern neighbors - Canada.  They are in the middle of the frozen tundra during the winter yet they managed to unify and create their own unique culture.  They had to in order to survive.

dougskiles

February 13, 2011, 12:52:11 PM
^There is no reason we can't have both natural beauty and a vibrant city life.

cityimrov

February 16, 2011, 12:04:23 AM
^There is no reason we can't have both natural beauty and a vibrant city life.

San Francisco.  San Francisco is a city which took advantage of it's natural advantages as well as made it's own man-made advantages to create the powerhouse city it is today.  It even had it's own military facilities nearby supporting it!  We had 3 during our heyday.  Both our cities are consolidated too!

If Jacksonville's natural advantages went way, what would be this city's main draw?  No beaches, No St Johns River, No I-10/I-95 Intersection, etc.  

I'm not expecting Jax to be as large as SF but the growth rate of both cities should have been pretty similar.  Economically, SF is much more richer then Jax.  

Why did our city decline and became stagnant while theirs are thriving and still growing to this day?  Even their rail system is expanding way faster then ours. 

dougskiles

February 16, 2011, 06:27:09 AM
Why did our city decline and became stagnant while theirs are thriving and still growing to this day?  Even their rail system is expanding way faster then ours. 

The main difference I can think of between SF and Jax is the cultural diversity.  Perhaps that has something to do with it?

I'm not an expert on these matters, but I have read recently, that the accepting nature of a community that allows people to act how they choose instead of conforming to a societal norm also fosters creativity in other areas - like technological innovation.

Garden guy

February 16, 2011, 08:39:55 AM
The only reason that's kept this city backwards is it's leaders...conservative rightwing leadership. As a city on the ocean with a great river...we should be the happeningest place in the states...but these leaders....i think not...

Jaxson

February 16, 2011, 08:52:31 AM
Previous posters are right when they point out that our city is diverse with many backgrounds, interests and perspectives.  Our city's problem is that there is no unifying force that empowers the majority to stand up to the good old boys who continue to run our city into the ground. 

BridgeTroll

February 16, 2011, 08:54:53 AM
Quote
I am blown away by the story of the slave woman from Kingsley Plantation who became the wife of a plantation owner, then owned her own place. Why hasn't this story been made into a movie with Halle Berry playing the main role?


Stephen... I smell a screenplay...

Garden guy

February 16, 2011, 09:08:33 AM
This city could us a few more Anna Kingsley...talk about a hard worker...i'll bet she would take a bribe like the fools that run this city.

Jaxson

February 16, 2011, 09:13:24 AM
Quote
I am blown away by the story of the slave woman from Kingsley Plantation who became the wife of a plantation owner, then owned her own place. Why hasn't this story been made into a movie with Halle Berry playing the main role?



Stephen... I smell a screenplay...

I could see Jennifer Hudson, another Oscar-winning actress, playing the part!

billy

February 16, 2011, 09:29:36 AM
Martin Lawrence

Dog Walker

February 16, 2011, 09:31:34 AM
Both Kingley and Ana Jai were powerful, complex characters who made their own way in the world mostly right her in Northeast Florida.

Dan Shafer, the retired UNF history professor who has done the most to write their history lives right here in Riverside.  Their story was mostly unknown until he did the hard work of research and writing.

You couldn't get their lives into a 90 minute movie, but it would make a great HBO mini-series.

stephendare

February 16, 2011, 09:39:42 AM
Quote
I am blown away by the story of the slave woman from Kingsley Plantation who became the wife of a plantation owner, then owned her own place. Why hasn't this story been made into a movie with Halle Berry playing the main role?



Stephen... I smell a screenplay...

I could see Jennifer Hudson, another Oscar-winning actress, playing the part!

Jennifer Chase did the musical at Boomtown in Springfield.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/LZSwfvRfP4Y" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/LZSwfvRfP4Y</a>

Ocklawaha

February 16, 2011, 12:02:06 PM
^There is no reason we can't have both natural beauty and a vibrant city life.

San Francisco.  San Francisco is a city which took advantage of it's natural advantages as well as made it's own man-made advantages to create the powerhouse city it is today.  It even had it's own military facilities nearby supporting it!  We had 3 during our heyday.  Both our cities are consolidated too!

I'm not expecting Jax to be as large as SF but the growth rate of both cities should have been pretty similar.  Economically, SF is much more richer then Jax.  

Why did our city decline and became stagnant while theirs are thriving and still growing to this day?  Even their rail system is expanding way faster then ours.  

Each day in San Francisco 850,000 people wake up and commute to work, school or play.





















ALL OF THE ABOVE PHOTOS - SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA

Each day in Jacksonville 830,000 people wake up and commuter to work, school or play.



JACKSONVILLE

Maybe it's just me, or maybe our leaders could be certified as brain dead, but I see a difference in these photos, do you?


OCKLAWAHA

finehoe

February 16, 2011, 12:47:04 PM
ALL OF THE ABOVE PHOTOS - SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA

Yeah, but there are libruls and homoseckuals livin' there.

Jaxson

February 16, 2011, 12:59:44 PM
ALL OF THE ABOVE PHOTOS - SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA

Yeah, but there are libruls and homoseckuals livin' there.

But imagine all of those heathens we can convert once we find a good church to take over their sin-ridden city.

dougskiles

February 16, 2011, 01:13:19 PM
Quote
I am blown away by the story of the slave woman from Kingsley Plantation who became the wife of a plantation owner, then owned her own place. Why hasn't this story been made into a movie with Halle Berry playing the main role?



Stephen... I smell a screenplay...

I could see Jennifer Hudson, another Oscar-winning actress, playing the part!

Jennifer Chase did the musical at Boomtown in Springfield.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/LZSwfvRfP4Y" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/LZSwfvRfP4Y</a>



Jennifer also gave the performance at Hendricks Avenue Elementary School 2 years ago as part of the cultural arts week.  It was outstanding.

Bativac

February 16, 2011, 03:28:32 PM
Ock - I don't know if you realize this, but those photos kind of prove the point, but not in the way you were thinking. That last photo, of the road surrounded by green? That's why a lot of people live here. They'd sooner leave than Jacksonville become full of what they perceive to be the trappings of "big city life."

And for anyone who doesn't think Jax is culturally diverse, I would beg to differ. I personally know Jacksonvillians from different continents and nations, and their families all live here. I think we're a very diverse city.

I think the one big thing about Jacksonville is that most of the people here want to do their thing, keep to themselves, and be left alone. Regardless of their culture, that seems to be the prevailing mindset. You have a hard time convincing people whose idea of a good time is to sit in the driveway with Skynyrd blasting and a six twelve 24 pack Bud Lite that Jacksonville could have a bustling downtown. Same with people who'd rather grill in the backyard, or watch TV in the comfort of their dens, etc.

I don't think many of the people here want Jacksonville to be more. It's easy to blame the leaders but I think the people who live here (such as my family, who has been here for generations) should share in some of the blame. They'd like things to stay the way they are, with none of their tax dollars going to any kind of improvements. (Unless it involves JTB or another highway.)

Dog Walker

February 16, 2011, 03:59:59 PM
Someone who was either very wise or very cynical once said that we get the kind of government we deserve.   OUCH!

Ocklawaha

February 16, 2011, 07:56:56 PM
Ock - I don't know if you realize this, but those photos kind of prove the point, but not in the way you were thinking. That last photo, of the road surrounded by green? That's why a lot of people live here. They'd sooner leave than Jacksonville become full of what they perceive to be the trappings of "big city life."

Maybe so, but to anyone who has been in San Francisco knows, the entire city would fit into our downtown. Certainly beyond that there is suburban development, but there are also miles of redwood forests and seemingly remote shores. With such diverse mass transit those people who prefer the gentle life in the vineyards at Sonoma, or the remote Muir Beach, a home in the mountains of Montara, or a farmette at Walnut Creek, they can all do so, without having to drive more then a few blocks, if they have to drive at all. This protects the exact lifestyle choices that you point out, nobody is going to throw you out on the street for another 12 lanes of concrete. When I drive into town from WGV I'm committed to a 30 mile trip one-way, if one drove that same 30 miles in most any direction from San Francisco, they would be in a different world completely. In many cases in less then 5 miles they are in primeval forest.

If we had commuter rail, my trip to the city would be about 5 miles saving me over 50 miles daily. The magic of a railway is that it doesn't have to be widened.


OCKLAWAHA

dougskiles

February 16, 2011, 08:10:23 PM
I brought up the point about diversity.  Perhaps what I should have emphasized is the acceptance of that diversity.

cityimrov

March 02, 2011, 01:35:35 AM
What is the "True Jacksonville"?  What is it that the people here want? 

If I wanted to build an amusement park here..... would enough people visit and support it?
If I wanted to build a glass condo with shopping center in downtown.... would enough people here live there?
If I wanted to bring the MLB/NBA here..... would I have full stadiums? 
If I wanted to build a world class private research university here..... would people here attend?  would they pass?

What exactly is this city?   

I've been watching my smartest and most entrepreneurial and most creative friends and acquaintances MOVE away from this city day after day.  One day, I have this feeling I'll be joining them too.  I'm worried about this city. 

I see people here get excited over a brand new maintenance facility!  A maintenance facility!  That seems kind of pathetic for a city that even brought the Mayo Clinic over....back then.   

So what is it that the vast majority people who are staying here, want - exactly? 

dougskiles

March 02, 2011, 05:57:38 AM
What is the "True Jacksonville"?  What is it that the people here want? 

That is a great question.  We seem to be wandering aimlessly.

Which leads me to believe that while many may not say they 'want' it, we desperately need stronger leadership.  Leadership that unifies more than divides.  Leadership that is focused on what we want to be instead of what we don't want to be.

Money may be able to buy an election, but it can't buy leadership.

Garden guy

March 02, 2011, 06:44:22 AM
This city is the way it is because of the endless amounts of conservative good ole boy leadership that had diseased this city for many many years..good luck.

Noone

March 02, 2011, 07:00:21 AM
What is the "True Jacksonville"?  What is it that the people here want?  

  I'm worried about this city.  

So what is it that the vast majority people who are staying here, want - exactly?  

Use the RIVER! Open up Public Access and Economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River especially in our Downtown Jacksonville Overlay Zoning District and especially before a total Govt. takeover of the Entertainment District by a yet to be voted on and created Downtown Improvement Agency that will have to be approved by a new city council.

In 4 days Mayor Peyton will be arriving by boat to the new floating dock at RAM. This is a pivotal piece of what could be an explosive message to the taxpayers of Jacksonville and the citizens of the state of Florida.

Who will be on the boat for this historic symbolism of perceived economic access. Perceived because will it really be expanded. Ron Barton? Terry Lorince? Wayne Wood? Michael Corrigan? Neil Armingeon? Tera Meeks? Daniel O'Byrne? Don Redman? Paul Anderson? Ron Littlepage? Any other guesses on who will be on this historic voyage on our RIVER?

To take a line from Mark Woods column in todays Times Union with a slight variation.

The St. Johns River is Open for Business.  

Jaxson

March 02, 2011, 08:26:56 AM
Much respect for Noone.  Jacksonville should take advantage of its existing natural resource - the St. Johns River.  Unlike an amusement park, the river is something that we do not have to build.  It has been with us for eons. 
Why can't we have more water-based recreation downtown?  I remember seeing two-person pedal boats in Baltimore's Inner Harbor.  I also enjoyed seeing the 'Duck' tourist boats in Boston and Philadelphia.  Why do we not make more of our river?  [Gnashes teeth]...

Garden guy

March 02, 2011, 08:40:08 AM
Much respect for Noone.  Jacksonville should take advantage of its existing natural resource - the St. Johns River.  Unlike an amusement park, the river is something that we do not have to build.  It has been with us for eons. 
Why can't we have more water-based recreation downtown?  I remember seeing two-person pedal boats in Baltimore's Inner Harbor.  I also enjoyed seeing the 'Duck' tourist boats in Boston and Philadelphia.  Why do we not make more of our river?  [Gnashes teeth]...
Have you ever swam in downtown waters? It's not the cleanest waterway and it needs attention but i do agree that the river itself has not been used enough to boost this city. This city would be a great place for skulling..more sailing schools..fishing...if we have a clean river to use...maybe we could actually get in it. With dying fish..i really dont want to actually swim in downtown waters yet...

fieldafm

March 02, 2011, 08:54:00 AM
Quote
Have you ever swam in downtown waters? It's not the cleanest waterway and it needs attention but i do agree that the river itself has not been used enough to boost this city. This city would be a great place for skulling..more sailing schools..fishing...if we have a clean river to use...maybe we could actually get in it. With dying fish..i really dont want to actually swim in downtown waters yet...

Its a Christmas miracle!!  Garden Guy, I agree 100%.
Mark this down boys and girls, its 'come together day' on MJ and Garden Guy is leading the charge.

GG,
Quote
the river itself has not been used enough to boost this city. This city would be a great place for skulling..more sailing schools..fishing...if we have a clean river to use
If you write a letter with this text and send it to all city council members, candidates for office, everyone on the Waterways Commission, Parks Dept and the mayor's office... I will pay for the postage!

cityimrov

March 02, 2011, 11:54:42 AM
Much respect for Noone.  Jacksonville should take advantage of its existing natural resource - the St. Johns River.  Unlike an amusement park, the river is something that we do not have to build.  It has been with us for eons.  
Why can't we have more water-based recreation downtown?  I remember seeing two-person pedal boats in Baltimore's Inner Harbor.  I also enjoyed seeing the 'Duck' tourist boats in Boston and Philadelphia.  Why do we not make more of our river?  [Gnashes teeth]...

Something is stopping it.  It's not that difficult a business to create.  I'm very sure there is at least 1 person willing (unless they already left), to buy a duck boat and is willing to sell rides for a few bucks each.

What does it take to park and operate a duck boat in a downtown pier?

cgaskins

March 02, 2011, 01:18:23 PM
For a duck boat, there would need to be a ramp from street level to the river.  The ramp(s) would have to be out of the way of the riverwalk, or the riverwalk would have to be rebuilt as a bridge going over where a ramp is built.
Or, a slightly more pain in the ass, or more dangerous depending how you look at it, way would have the duck boats driving over the riverwalk to a ramp that leads it into the river — getting in the way of pedestrians.
My friends in Boston and Baltimore all hate the duck boats, and it seems to be a popular hate that most locals share.  They move slowly on the streets, because they are giving tours of sights, or might possibly only be able to go a certain speed, which brings foot and auto traffic down.
Duck boats would be used less by locals than a theme park or aquarium.  You'll do a duck boat when you're five years old, you might do it again when you have a five year old of your own.
How often do the water taxis get used?  Does anyone have any figures on that?

Duck boats are cute, but I doubt there's really much business for one in a city until that city already has a steady stream of tourists visiting.  Duck boats don't bring the tourists, tourists are already there and ride the duck boats.

Speaking of "cute" things, I was just thinking of memorable things in cities.
The Delta Queen Hotel in Chattanooga.

Vintage cabs in London.

Historic streetcars in San Francisco.

The brightly painted buildings in Tannersville, NY.

The Googie architecture in Southern California, among other places.


Streetcars are well worn territory on MJ, and I strongly believe that a streetcar line in the core would be an amazing thing.  Especially if it uses vintage cars.  Great form of public transit + cool as hell looks = happy locals with pride, and a memorable visit for tourists.

On that note, I wonder if a local cab company would ever be willing to use vintage yellow cabs.  I also wonder if the city, state, or country would help with funds to a company for upgrading vintage cars to be hybrids, or more fuel efficient, because they're preserving classic American made cars.  Just a thought.  If Jacksonville's downtown was full of yellow cabs from the '40s to '60s it would definitely make the city more memorable to people, and give an element of playfulness and historic charm.

A steamboat on the Saint John's that is a restaurant and hotel would make a killing, especially if residents of Duval were given a discount, making it a couple's romantic getaway and interesting alternative for people visiting.

I'm bored at work and just throwing this out there.

blandman

March 02, 2011, 04:03:41 PM
Duck Boat Tours are popular with tourists in Philly, but not with residents.  Since last year's collision with a barge in the Delaware River that killed two tourists, "Ride the Ducks" has been lobbying to get access to the Schuylkill (pronounced "skoo-kill") River, on the other side of Center City.  However, the Schuylkill River Path is incredibly popular with city dwellers and they staunchly oppose the idea of having the loud, ugly duck boats ruining an afternoon's job/ride/stroll.  Last month the city sided with residents and decided not to award a contract for the Schuylkill.

Noone

March 02, 2011, 04:31:25 PM
Much respect for Noone.  Jacksonville should take advantage of its existing natural resource - the St. Johns River.  Unlike an amusement park, the river is something that we do not have to build.  It has been with us for eons. 
Why can't we have more water-based recreation downtown?  I remember seeing two-person pedal boats in Baltimore's Inner Harbor.  I also enjoyed seeing the 'Duck' tourist boats in Boston and Philadelphia.  Why do we not make more of our river?  [Gnashes teeth]...
Have you ever swam in downtown waters? It's not the cleanest waterway and it needs attention but i do agree that the river itself has not been used enough to boost this city. This city would be a great place for skulling..more sailing schools..fishing...if we have a clean river to use...maybe we could actually get in it. With dying fish..i really dont want to actually swim in downtown waters yet...

No we don't have to swim in the waters yet but we sure can paddle in it and fish too. GG, your right the river does need to be used more to boost this city. Lets Kayak Hogans Creek together. In fact I'll put you ahead of anyone that is running in the Spring elections. I'm saying this in a complimentary way because I believe that you can make it happen.
 

CG7

March 02, 2011, 04:54:43 PM
I just think the majority of people are lazy, they are content to sit on the couch, watch tv and eat a delivered pizza. They must be compelled to leave their couches. This can be done as evidenced by huge numbers at the zoo when they open a new exhibit, opening weekeng at RAM etc. We need more people to help bring our assets to their full potential (ie the river and access to the river, our beaches, the nations largest urban park system, the symphony, the jaguars, museums etc) I challenge the people of metrojacksonville to find a cause and do whatever it takes to make it something the citzens of Jacksonville will get off their couches for. Sorry I'll get off the soap box now.

finehoe

March 02, 2011, 05:13:07 PM
duck boats...move slowly on the streets, because they are giving tours of sights, or might possibly only be able to go a certain speed, which brings foot and auto traffic down.

Since we have no pedestrain or auto traffic downtown, this wouldn't be an issue.   ;D

cgaskins

March 02, 2011, 05:39:41 PM
I just think the majority of people are lazy, they are content to sit on the couch, watch tv and eat a delivered pizza. They must be compelled to leave their couches. This can be done as evidenced by huge numbers at the zoo when they open a new exhibit, opening weekeng at RAM etc. We need more people to help bring our assets to their full potential (ie the river and access to the river, our beaches, the nations largest urban park system, the symphony, the jaguars, museums etc) I challenge the people of metrojacksonville to find a cause and do whatever it takes to make it something the citzens of Jacksonville will get off their couches for. Sorry I'll get off the soap box now.

Is anyone doing a digest size magazine that promotes shops, restaurants, bars, markets, et cetera for the Riverside, Avondale, and downtown areas?  A quarterly or yearly digest that is free.  Get as many locations to submit a little money to go toward printing cost, have maps of areas with markers showing where places are.  Pop in a history lesson about that area every few pages.  Sell ad space to radio stations or law firms...whatever.
Each location gets a paragraph or two written about them and a photo of their shop front...

These are common guides in most cities/neighbourhoods.

If you can open up a little booklet and see all of the shops and restaurants around your house, you're more likely to go visit them.  You can plan out your night of bar crawling, or find out more information about a place you walked by earlier that day that you never noticed before.

There are people who are really up on their game and know about all of the best places in their area, but there are a lot more people who actually don't know where to go and would benefit a ton with a guide like this.
Also, seeing a guide filled to the brim with all kinds of great places makes people realise there is actually a lot more going on than they thought.

All of the places featured in the magazine will carry little stacks of them by their doors.  It's pretty basic stuff that will make locals more aware of what is around them.  If you have a copy on your coffee table and you're thinking about just staying in on a Friday for Netflix and a pizza, you might rethink it when you see how much night life is right in front of your face.

The main thing with this is to list as many things as possible.  Greasy spoons to gourmet, dive bars to posh lounges...  People need to be more aware of what is around them.

You create a neat and tidy package that presents a lot of options to people and everyone wins.

To give you an example of something I've done...
My friend and I had an idea the other year for a website.  We wished there was a website that listed all of the events that were going on in NYC that our friends and us would be interested in.  We started one, now the blog section of the site has hundreds of unique hits a day, we get emails from tons of promoters and bands each week wanting us to list their events.  We've become known as thee website to go to if you're in this niche little world we're in.  People plan trips to NY according to the events we have posted.
Unfortunately, we turn down a lot of stuff and try to stick to things that have to do with '60s garage punk, soul and R&B, surf rock, ska and rocksteady, rockabilly, and other related styles of music.
Check it out:  www.garagepunknyc.com

And just to show you I'm not afraid of print, this is a magazine I do.  We're in 12 countries.  Issue three comes out in three weeks.  It's a free mini-tab.
www.bananasmag.com

Ocklawaha

March 02, 2011, 08:18:16 PM
Is anyone doing a digest size magazine that promotes shops, restaurants, bars, markets, et cetera for the Riverside, Avondale, and downtown areas?

Actually they are, it's called:  http://www.metrojacksonville.com/

Though your idea of a free standing PERMANENT section of City and Regional Information and Events might be a cool thing to do here.


OCKLAWAHA

cgaskins

March 03, 2011, 06:19:19 AM
Is anyone doing a digest size magazine that promotes shops, restaurants, bars, markets, et cetera for the Riverside, Avondale, and downtown areas?

Actually they are, it's called:  http://www.metrojacksonville.com/

Though your idea of a free standing PERMANENT section of City and Regional Information and Events might be a cool thing to do here.


OCKLAWAHA

A print magazine can sometimes have more of an effect on people than just a website.
But yeah, if this site had a google map with markers showing restaurants, bars, shops... it would be easier to update and maintain than if it were a print booklet.
Now, I'm off to Miami until Monday.
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