Five Reasons to Address The Landing Parking Situation

[tufsu1]

I hate the argument that the parking "isn't close enough"...Barton is correct that many folks at Town Center often walk the equivalent of 2+ blocks from their car to the store/restaurant.

[Keith-N-Jax]

Not just Town Center, but the other malls as well.When DT though they have to exit their car and enter their seat for some reason.

[Sportmotor]

at the town center I have no problem walking Best Buy to Publix if need be. Its typically a pretty walk 

[thelakelander]

The ball is in Sleiman's court but I do wonder how effective the Water Street garage will serve as a solution to attract first tier tenants.  While the outer edges of mall parking lots may be a three or four block walk away, in reality most people aren't parking four blocks away in those lots except during Christmas season.  Before anyone claims this will or won't work, does anyone know of a true example in a similar situation to DT Jax's environment where the closet space in the parking garage is a three to four block walk from the retail property it serves?

[brainstormer]

I assume they are taking about the old county courthouse site.  That walk isn't bad at all because of the Riverwalk.  I usually park there for free when I'm downtown in the evenings.  It is kind of a little known secret because not many people park there.

With regards to the parking garage plan for the lot next to the SunTrust Tower.  It seems shortsighted to just build a couple story parking garage in that prime location.  Perhaps something a bit more creative would help make the area more vibrant.  I realize a skyscraper is probably not feasible right now, but what about a smaller building with street level retail and parking above?  Or better yet, since no one likes parking on the top floor anyway, perhaps a unique rooftop restaurant with rose gardens and plenty of outdoor seating.  Make it high enough to see over the Landing.  That would be a great view for outdoor seating.

[thelakelander]

In terms of dedicated parking the courthouse site does not address this situation.  Dedicated parking needs to be 24/7, not after 6pm.  Until a garage is built across the street (which seems like a waste of that property btw), the only thing "dedicated" would be the spaces in the Water Street garage.  So the question then becomes if the garage and its "connectivity" to the Landing is sufficient for first tier retailers.  That said, I don't know if it is or not.  However, I do know that no other retail center in Jax faces this situation.

[thelakelander]

I figured this would be the response.

Jacksonville Landing: City’s solution to parking shortage unsuitable for goals
 
The city’s solutions aren’t convenient for patrons, venue’s spokesman says.

 By David Bauerlein
Let Our People Park.

That's the message being beamed from the huge electronic sign at The Jacksonville Landing, whose owner wants $3.5 million from the city to help him buy a nearby parking lot for use by the Landing.

On Tuesday, the head of the Jacksonville Economic Development Commission outlined a markedly different plan for how to boost the availability of parking for The Landing, which is struggling to fill space.

His proposal to the City Council would offer hundreds of parking spaces for free use by Landing patrons at a city-owned parking garage, the county courthouse lot, and a new garage to be built by the Parador Group, which bought a majority stake in the SunTrust Tower last year.

"Clearly with the implementation of this plan, parking can no longer be identified as a contributing factor in the performance of The Landing," JEDC Executive Director Ron Barton wrote in the letter to council members.

But Landing spokesman Bruce Barcelo said the solution fails to meet the test of offering convenient parking.

"The reality of it is that Mr. Barton proposes some fringe parking solutions," Barcelo said. "They are inconvenient to Landing patrons."

He said Barton's plan would still leave the Landing unable to show nationally known restaurants that parking is sufficient for them to become tenants.

Barton said in his letter the parking options would be within the range that's acceptable for suburban malls such as St. Johns Town Center and "very much the norm" for a downtown. He said it also would be a way to help the Landing by using city-owned parking facilities and "still being mindful of the current budget constraints."

He gave the City Council a three-pronged recommendation:

Immediately designate the county courthouse lot as free parking for patrons of The Jacksonville Landing and Bay Street area clubs after 6 p.m. Monday through Friday, and all-day on weekends until 3 a.m. That lot has 379 spaces.

Starting May 1, the Landing's customers and employees can park for free anytime at 300 spaces in the city-owned Water Street Garage, located three blocks from the Landing. A validation program would let Landing customers park free for up to three hours at the garage.

The JEDC will propose an agreement with the Parador Group, the main owner of the SunTrust Tower, to build a parking garage with at least 250 spaces across Independent Drive from the Landing. The city would pay $2.2 million to Parador Group after the garage is built.

A validation program would provide free parking in the garage to Landing customers after 6 p.m. Monday through Friday, and all-day on weekends until 3 a.m. At least 200 spaces would be accessible to the Landing during those hours.

Barton's letter said those three parking options would be on top of the 243-space lot that Sleiman previously purchased from the city east of the Landing.

The current agreement between the city and the Landing says the city will provide $3.5 million if a parking garage is built that provides 300 daytime spaces for the Landing and 375 nighttime spaces. Barton's letter said that after Orlando developer Cameron Kuhn defaulted on that agreement, the city's financial obligation shifted to pay the $3.5 million to The Landing only after The Landing built its own parking garage.


Sleiman wants to purchase an existing parking lot a block from the Landing and designate it with signs as a 300-space lot for Landing patrons. Sleiman is seeking $3.5 million from the city to help him pay for the purchase of the lot, which he said would cost about $5 million. Sleiman has said it shouldn't matter whether it's a parking lot or parking garage, so long as the parking is close enough to the Landing.

Barcelo said the city's agreement with The Landing defined that parking area being bounded by Julia Street, Forsyth Street, Ocean Street and the St. Johns River. He said the Water Street Garage and the county courthouse lot are both outside that area.

"At best, they would qualify as overflow parking," he said.

He said it's not realistic to expect Landing patrons will walk three blocks through downtown at night. He said a new parking garage across the street from the Landing would fit the bill, but only if it has 300 daytime spaces and 375 nighttime spaces for the Landing.

Under Barton's proposal, the Landing would get rights to 200 spaces but only after 6 p.m. on weeknights, plus both day and night on weekends.

full article: http://jacksonville.com/business/2010-04-20/story/jedc-chief-proposes-solution-jacksonville-landings-parking-needs

[hanjin1]

The JEDC will propose an agreement with the Parador Group, the main owner of the SunTrust Tower, to build a parking garage with at least 250 spaces across Independent Drive from the Landing. The city would pay $2.2 million to Parador Group after the garage is built.

I sure hope this new parking garage has some retail on the first floor. this would be a complete waste of space yet again to have a parking garage with nothing else.

[thelakelander]

The article does not mention when this garage would be built.  For all we know, construction may not be complete on this thing until five or ten years from now.  Does anyone know if construction would begin immediately or at least this year?

[Captain Zissou]

If the garage is a stand alone structure, that would be a huge waste of an important parcel donwtown.  The garage should be at the base of a tower or at least something mid rise mixed use.  Kuhn had the right idea, he just bit off more than he could chew.

[thelakelander]

Judging from his Orlando projects, if he could have gotten through the local approval process (and the chilled water issue with JEA) faster there would probably be a completed building and garage already on that site.  The bank would have still ended up taking it but there would be something instead of a dirt lot.  Hopefully, we'll learn to open the door on things when opportunity knocks.

[finehoe]

Hopefully, we'll learn to open the door on things when opportunity knocks.

I thought we were discussing Jacksonville. 

[Steve]

The article does not mention when this garage would be built.  For all we know, construction may not be complete on this thing until five or ten years from now.  Does anyone know if construction would begin immediately or at least this year?

It doesn't even say they have to build a garage.  It just says that the JEDC will ask nicely.  The bum on the downtown streets sometimes ask nicely for money.  That doesn't mean I have to give them some.  The idea about the courthouse lot and water street is a bit ridicuous.  I think the courthouse lot is open anyway, and the water street garage is always empty, since it is build in a poor location.  That garage should show why we don't need more garages downtown.

This just shows how little the JEDC and city get about downtown.  Downtown doesn't need more parking - it has plenty.  We have just policy'ed ourselves out of available parking.  Give Sleiman the 3.5 and be done with the issue forever. 

[strider]

In a letter to Council President Clark dated April 20th, 2010, Mr. Barton (ED of JEDC) says:

The city has no present obligation to provide any parking or funding for parking for the landing.

  If fact, the first page of the letter has this quote in bold twice.  It would seem as if The Landing must pony up and build and open their own parking garage with at least 300 daily and 375 night and weekend spaces first before any funding obligation arises. Either the lawyers will get involved or what has been offered by the city and described above in other posts may be the best the Landing will get right now.

[thelakelander]

Seems like that area and the Northbank will remain a slug at least until the next mayor takes office.  If anything, this situation serves as a reason for having a DDA.  The JEDC's priorities are too spread thin to really focus on and work to solving the needs of downtown.