Author Topic: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009  (Read 22752 times)

Lunican

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #15 on: May 05, 2009, 11:04:42 AM »
Here is an email regarding the Courthouse:

Quote
From:  Mosley, Alan
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2009 4:33 PM
To: Yarborough, Clay; Bishop, Bill; Clark, Richard; Redman, Don; Shad, Art; Webb, Jack; Gaffney, Johnny; Lee, Denise; Brown, Reginald; Jones, Warren; Holt, Ray; Davis, Daniel; Graham, Art; Corrigan, Michael; Crescimbeni, John; Joost, Stephen; Fussell, Ronnie; Johnson, Glorious; Hyde, Kevin Cc: Sherman, Kirk; Billy, Janice; Rowe, Lisa; Skipper, Misty; Hollingsworth, Adam; Hall, Sherry; Miller, Mickey; Schneider, David;

Subject: Update on Courthouse
To confirm the information shared with each of you earlier today, the city has received a Guaranteed Maximum Price (GMP) proposal for construction of the Duval County Courthouse from Turner Construction. Bids have been received on most major trade packages and Turner has calculated the GMP at $224.2 million. This figure is within the total project budget authorization of $350 million approved by the City Council with the passage of 2007-401-E.

The $350 million authorized budget includes funding for construction of the new unified courthouse facility in LaVilla, renovations of the old federal courthouse (to house the State Attorney’s Office), renovations of space within the Ed Ball Building (for the Public Defender) and all prior courthouse related expenditures.
The city’s construction team, led by Sam Mousa and Dave Schneider, has reviewed the proposal and has recommended moving forward with a Notice to Proceed. I will meet with the Council Auditor and his staff early next week to discuss the proposal. After completing those discussions, we will proceed with presenting the proposal to the City’s Competitive Sealed Proposal Evaluation Committee (CSPEC) for approval at its meeting on Thursday, April 30.

If you have additional questions, please feel free to contact me directly.

Thank you.
Alan R. Mosley, P.E.
Chief Administrative Officer
City of Jacksonville
Office of the Mayor
117 W. Duval St.
Jacksonville, Florida 32202

Basstacular

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #16 on: May 05, 2009, 11:13:07 AM »
Take this for what its worth regarding Barnett and the trio.  My source who is "in the know", but would not elaborate told me about the pending deal prior to it going public, which he turned out to be right.  He also informed me that the buyer was looking to develop the residential component.  Again, take it for what it is, but if that is the case, I think every DT supporter will be pleased.

jeh1980

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #17 on: May 05, 2009, 11:21:04 AM »
I am so sick of hearing people whine about the courthouse....first you get annoyed that it had cost overruns and time delays...but then when you don't like the look, you say delay it even more...which is it?


Its been delayed so long and the plan is so bad, that at this point, many believe it may be worth it to have a future Mayor deal with it.  My personal thinking is that its going to happen and "it is what it is."  My hope is that we can do something positive with the left over land surrounding the actual structure.
I am so sick of hearing people whine about the courthouse....first you get annoyed that it had cost overruns and time delays...but then when you don't like the look, you say delay it even more...which is it?

I'm with you on this on TUFSU1, I'm sick of the whole project. Just build the damn thing and get over it folks. Yes I think it's ugly (on paper). Like I said, to me, it looks like an explosion in a pillar factory.

But there is a flip side.

Several major projects hinge on getting the Courthouse out of the ground. In fact we referenced 3 M/L major construction projects just a couple of weeks past, all waiting for dirt to move. So what if I think it should have been vertical, it's going to be a BIG catalyst as construction leads to more construction.

Another thing is the appearance from the ground might be stunning. I'm a huge fan of those 14 massive sandstone columns in front of The Jacksonville Terminal, and from ground level this might have the same effect. As Lake has said, "it is what it is". I'm looking forward to this project setting off a chain reaction of new development.


OCKLAWAHA
We really do have a lot of whiney people here in Jacksonville do we? We just can't be satified for whatever its worth. I personally don't care about the design of the new courthouse. I'll accept it if anyone else doesn't. I'm happy that its about to start construction. Stop all this whining, folks and just be thankful for what we have and see the future in a positive way.

TheProfessor

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2009, 11:33:58 AM »
The cheap signs do detract from the architecture of the Oral Explosion project.  I suppose it would be costly and there is not much more room for nicer signage.

Basstacular

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #19 on: May 05, 2009, 11:37:04 AM »
If you build it.....they will come

tufsu1

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #20 on: May 05, 2009, 11:44:37 AM »
btw....for what its worth, it sounds like the new Courthouse itself (not including the land, the garage, or renovations to existing buildings) will come in around $225-$250 million....how does that stack up with some of the other cities (like Charlotte) that have been profiled on this site?

thelakelander

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #21 on: May 05, 2009, 12:10:25 PM »
I'll have to go back and look into the old sources but I believe these are the total cost numbers for these projects (ex. includes land, design costs, etc....the things "excluded" from our numbers).
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/content/view/648/115/

Mecklenburg County Courthouse

Charlotte (2007) - 568,000sf / $148 million = $261/square foot

Harris County Civil & Criminal Justice Center

Houston (2001 - 2005) - 1,390,000sf / $210.5 million = $151/square foot

Clark County Regional Justice Center

Las Vegas (2004) - 700,000sf / $185 million = $264/square foot

Calgary Courthouse - Calgary, AB

Calgary (2007) - 1,200,000sf / $280 million = $233/square foot

Duval County Courthouse

Jacksonville (n/a) - 800,000sf / $225 - $250 million** = $281 - $313/square foot
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

thelakelander

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #22 on: May 05, 2009, 12:13:01 PM »
Btw, since that MJ article was written, the Calgary Courthouse has been completed.  Here are a few shots.


http://www.glass3ent.com/images/projects/Ferguson-001_orig.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3048/2905968327_f080610e16.jpg
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tufsu1

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #23 on: May 05, 2009, 12:29:35 PM »
so we're still higher, but not ridiculously out of whack....obviously there are cost savings in going vertical (once you get past 3-4 stories anyway) which Jax. could have done....but I guess that wasn't really considered once all the land had been purchased and cleared.

That Calgray one looks pretty cool...of course it would never fly here....that said, there is something to be said for neo-classical design...after all, the current courthouse definitely fit with the design tend of the 1960's but now it looks pretty awful.

Jason

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #24 on: May 05, 2009, 12:36:32 PM »
The one thing I like about our proposal is that it looks like a courthouse.  The buildings shown above could pass for just about anything.

thelakelander

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #25 on: May 05, 2009, 12:54:02 PM »
Yes, the Calgary Courthouse would never fly here.  Unfortunately, not much that does not copy design of 100 years ago with cheaper mass produced materials will.  It will be interesting to see how future generations view the architecture of this era.  I imagine, if Klutho had just come down in 2001, his prairie school style ideas would have quickly been shut down in favor or copying styles from past generations.

As for the courthouse itself, I care more about how it meets the street, then the structure itself.  That's the major downfall of the design, imo.  From a money standpoint, I'm also not crazy about the one story piece causing the relocation of Monroe Street.  It would seem to be cheaper to take the main structure up an extra floor or two, thus eliminating the need to relocate Monroe Street and the utilities under it.  After all, we're already paying for the elevators, stairwells and the structural system.  Because we refused to work with the surrounding context and in a vertical nature we're going to kill the redevelopment potential of two full blocks and pay a few extra million to relocate a two block stretch of street.

Anyway, as mentioned earlier "it is what it is".  Now its time to focus on getting the best use out of the carved up land surrounding the structure.  If we can do this, it will have a greater positive impact on the downtown environment.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2009, 12:56:46 PM by thelakelander »
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heights unknown

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #26 on: May 05, 2009, 01:56:20 PM »
Heights-

While I know nothing about this particular deal, "under contract" typically means the buyer and seller have signed a purchase & sale agreement, but the actual closing of the sale has not happened and is contingent upon a variety of factors, including but not limited to:
- The seller having good title, free from liens
- The buyer obtaining acceptable financing
- A satisfactory building inspection and environmental report
- Closing happening on or before a certain date

Thanks Traveller, that answers my question(s); so it has nothing to do with a possible "intended use" based on the acquisition of the property, but basically the administrative aspect of the sale and purchase of the property by a buyer or prospective buyer...and of course closure of the deal.

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #27 on: May 05, 2009, 01:58:57 PM »
Here is an email regarding the Courthouse:

Quote
From:  Mosley, Alan
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2009 4:33 PM
To: Yarborough, Clay; Bishop, Bill; Clark, Richard; Redman, Don; Shad, Art; Webb, Jack; Gaffney, Johnny; Lee, Denise; Brown, Reginald; Jones, Warren; Holt, Ray; Davis, Daniel; Graham, Art; Corrigan, Michael; Crescimbeni, John; Joost, Stephen; Fussell, Ronnie; Johnson, Glorious; Hyde, Kevin Cc: Sherman, Kirk; Billy, Janice; Rowe, Lisa; Skipper, Misty; Hollingsworth, Adam; Hall, Sherry; Miller, Mickey; Schneider, David;

Subject: Update on Courthouse
To confirm the information shared with each of you earlier today, the city has received a Guaranteed Maximum Price (GMP) proposal for construction of the Duval County Courthouse from Turner Construction. Bids have been received on most major trade packages and Turner has calculated the GMP at $224.2 million. This figure is within the total project budget authorization of $350 million approved by the City Council with the passage of 2007-401-E.

The $350 million authorized budget includes funding for construction of the new unified courthouse facility in LaVilla, renovations of the old federal courthouse (to house the State Attorney’s Office), renovations of space within the Ed Ball Building (for the Public Defender) and all prior courthouse related expenditures.
The city’s construction team, led by Sam Mousa and Dave Schneider, has reviewed the proposal and has recommended moving forward with a Notice to Proceed. I will meet with the Council Auditor and his staff early next week to discuss the proposal. After completing those discussions, we will proceed with presenting the proposal to the City’s Competitive Sealed Proposal Evaluation Committee (CSPEC) for approval at its meeting on Thursday, April 30.

If you have additional questions, please feel free to contact me directly.

Thank you.
Alan R. Mosley, P.E.
Chief Administrative Officer
City of Jacksonville
Office of the Mayor
117 W. Duval St.
Jacksonville, Florida 32202

So based on what I've just read (and it's dated April 30th), construction of the Courthouse is a sure go and is imminent.

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #28 on: May 05, 2009, 02:03:21 PM »
If you build it.....they will come

Yeah, especially if "they" have committed a crime and get arrested.

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Re: Downtown Construction Update - May 2009
« Reply #29 on: May 05, 2009, 02:06:40 PM »
Looking at the prices of all the other Courthouses that "Lake" listed along with their photos, our Courthouse seems to be not that big, is not vertical/tall, and comes out with a much bigger price tag versus the Courthouses in these photos in which some or most are talls and come in with a much leaner, lesser price tag. 

We didn't do our homework folks and I won't beat a dead horse, but I have to say that our City Leaders really "dropped the ball" on this one.  But being that it's getting ready to be built, I'll take it with no whining.  Again, something is better than nothing, and maybe this thing will be a catalyst for that portion of downtown (got to look at the positives to forget the many negatives).

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