Author Topic: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park  (Read 16791 times)

Fallen Buckeye

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2024, 05:52:27 PM »
Can we talk about how the cost of removal went from $1.2 million to only $187,000? Obviously, the cost was trumped up to create a barrier to removal, but it makes you wonder how costs of other public projects are being manipulated.

Jax_Developer

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2024, 06:29:32 PM »
JEA septic phase out program is a Grade A example Buckeye. Been talking about it for more than a year now & nobody seems to care. Just how it is sadly.

jaxlongtimer

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #17 on: January 04, 2024, 06:33:39 PM »
Can we talk about how the cost of removal went from $1.2 million to only $187,000? Obviously, the cost was trumped up to create a barrier to removal, but it makes you wonder how costs of other public projects are being manipulated.

You may be correct in your conclusion but, to be clear, the larger quote included dismantling the stone domed and columned pavilion and base surrounding the statue in a manner that would allow it to be reassembled elsewhere.  This removal only entailed taking out the cast bronze statue and leaving the surrounding structure intact.

scbennett67@gmail.com

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2024, 08:30:30 AM »
I'm having a hard time understanding what's  racist about a statue of a woman surrounded by her children waiting on her husband to come home from war. Are we going to pretend that war never happened is that what we're doing? Excuse me for not getting this quote not exactly right but someone once said if we don't remember our mistakes we're bound to repeat them. I am  a open minded person and looking forward to responses to help me understand.

Ken_FSU

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #19 on: January 09, 2024, 08:47:50 AM »
I'm having a hard time understanding what's  racist about a statue of a woman surrounded by her children waiting on her husband to come home from war. Are we going to pretend that war never happened is that what we're doing? Excuse me for not getting this quote not exactly right but someone once said if we don't remember our mistakes we're bound to repeat them. I am  a open minded person and looking forward to responses to help me understand.

For this particular statue, it's important to know that it wasn't actually erected during the Civil War period. It was erected over 50 years after the war ended for the purpose of intimidating black citizens during the Jim Crow era.

https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/12/27/historian-springfield-park-confederate-monument-was-put-up-to-intimidate-black-residents-during-jim-crow-era/

As the mayor rightfully put it, "symbols matter," and despite all the doublespeak from local politicians, allowing these symbols to remain standing is an implicit endorsement of the Confederacy.

Yes, history is important, but Jacksonville belongs to all of us, and there's no universe where we need any public statues openly celebrating the enslavement, oppression, or intimidation of any ethnic group, regardless of historical context.

We absolutely should remember our past lest we repeat. But we can remember through Civil Rights or local historical museums without celebrating them in front of City Hall or in public parks.

To me, the best thing to do is to try to put yourselves into the shoes of someone else. How would you feel if you were a black family going to that particular park and walking beside that statue, openly celebrating an institution centered on the right to enslave African Americans? Would probably put a damper on your pickle ball game, right?

Removing the statue should have been the easiest decision of Deegan's early mayoral run.

Thankfully she made it.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2024, 08:52:09 AM by Ken_FSU »

thelakelander

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #20 on: January 09, 2024, 09:29:33 AM »
The mayor is on First Coast Connect today, explaining her position.
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Fallen Buckeye

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #21 on: January 09, 2024, 09:17:42 PM »
You may be correct in your conclusion but, to be clear, the larger quote included dismantling the stone domed and columned pavilion and base surrounding the statue in a manner that would allow it to be reassembled elsewhere.  This removal only entailed taking out the cast bronze statue and leaving the surrounding structure intact.
Thanks for clarifying that point. It does make it less egregious.

I'm having a hard time understanding what's  racist about a statue of a woman surrounded by her children waiting on her husband to come home from war. Are we going to pretend that war never happened is that what we're doing? Excuse me for not getting this quote not exactly right but someone once said if we don't remember our mistakes we're bound to repeat them. I am  a open minded person and looking forward to responses to help me understand.
I generally believe that we should avoid judging people in history based on today's standards, but in this case I don't have a problem with removing the statues. They were put up to intimidate a class of people in the midst of the civil rights movement. Removing that just rights a wrong imo.

I do believe that we need to preserve and teach history fairly, but that can be accomplished better using other means anyways. For instance, sites like Camp Milton give an actual perspective of history as it happened with lots of informational markers and explaining what took place. Ditto for Olustee. Teaching our children to read critically from several perspectives would be far more impactful than a statue. If anyone is concerned about preserving history, a quality education should be the priority. This is just a distraction from that end.


thelakelander

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #23 on: January 14, 2024, 09:18:30 PM »
I'm fine if they did not. I'm pretty skeptical about this one.
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Ken_FSU

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2024, 12:02:32 AM »
I'm fine if they did not. I'm pretty skeptical about this one.

Yeah, didn't realize this was the loony whitewashed museum coming out of HB 1441 that was discussed a couple of weeks back.

Good Lord at this description:

Quote
Harold Knowles, the CDC’s CEO, said the nonprofit envisions a museum where a unique blend of African American and old South Confederacy history is presented “in an atmosphere of objective academic rigor, free of historic emotional overlays.”

The proposal includes space for Confederate statues and memorials that have been removed from public display in recent years.

jaxlongtimer

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #25 on: January 15, 2024, 02:28:35 AM »
^ Sounds like more of a memorial to the Confederacy disguised as a Black History Museum.  This goes along with the GOP position touting the "benefits of slavery" and that the Civil War was not really about slavery at all.  You can bet that will be a big part of this "atmosphere of objective academic rigor, free of historic emotional overlays.”

This approach is about as ludicrous as those who deny the Holocaust was real.  It is truly offensive.

thelakelander

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #26 on: January 15, 2024, 08:59:05 AM »
Nassau County is also on the short list for the museum. If selected, it would be at Wildlight.....
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marcuscnelson

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #27 on: January 15, 2024, 10:30:52 AM »
I can't imagine people going all the way to Wildlight for a museum. That'd be goofy.
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Charles Hunter

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #28 on: January 15, 2024, 11:00:59 AM »
I can't imagine people going all the way to Wildlight for a museum. That'd be goofy.

It's closer than St. Augustine (from downtown, your mileage may vary. UNF seems to be the midpoint).
I think the idea is to catch tourists driving down I-95.

But, I agree with others here, that this will be a DeSatinized white-washed version of Black History. If that version must exist, let it be near all the other fantasy tourist traps attractions in central Florida. (Except that will give the tourists a warped picture.)

Tacachale

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Re: Confederate Monument removed from Springfield Park
« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2024, 10:37:17 AM »
No, the city did not pursue this particular project.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?