Zodiac Closes after 20 Years

[Ken_FSU]

Man, this one sucks.

https://www.jacksonville.com/story/entertainment/dining/2021/01/06/covid-19-zodiac-bar-grill-closes-20-years-downtown-jacksonville/4137067001

[thelakelander]

Yeah it sucks. COVID-19 is a killer and we wasted 20 years with the Northbank by not coordinating the clustering of complementing uses within a compact setting to stimulate foot traffic and help existing businesses. Now with less foot traffic than ever in the city's history, COVID-19 is going to slowly kill off a lot of the existing business base.

[BridgeTroll]

Awful... I  have known Jeri and Rima for years.  Great people... great loss for this city...

[vicupstate]

The article did not mention anything about them seeking or getting any of the Covid assistance funding. I wonder if they sought that.   

[fieldafm]

The article did not mention anything about them seeking or getting any of the Covid assistance funding. I wonder if they sought that.   

Jeri mentioned he received one of COJ's $2k grants, but that wasn't enough to pay for two months of JEA bills- nonetheless much else.  Tough for a restaurant (particularly one Downtown that relies on a now non-existent lunch business) to justify PPP loans.. especially when that's not going to last you very long, you don't need to hire a full staff back given how little volume DT restaurants are seeing (you have to spend so much on staffing to qualify for forgiveness)... and its hard to see a time when Downtown's lunch business will take at least another half of a year to recover.  I don't blame him for not wanting to continue to maintain that overhead, or even worse.... go into debt.  That's no different than gambling in a casino using a credit card.

A PPP loan isn't going to bring customers back Downtown. The offices are empty. Even though the Barnett brought a few hundred (badly needed) residential units online, the residential population is still low.  And getting people to leave their current neighborhoods to drive to an empty Downtown with homeless camps setup everywhere... isn't exactly a winning proposition.

Zodiac was one of the few places where you could grab dinner Downtown.  Not only am I going to miss them at lunch, I'm most certainly going to miss them at dinner.

Jeri lives in Springfield, and has toyed with the idea of opening something in the neighborhood or another one of the urban core neighborhoods... so, hopefully they can find a second generation restaurant space where they could set up and at least be able to compete in the dinner arena (dinner Downtown is really, really bad now... and it wasn't particularly good before the pandemic).

I very much like Jeri, and hope to support him if he finds another space that doesn't have to worry about all of the problems associated with a Downtown restaurant.

I'm also saying this as a business owner Downtown that has also had to navigate that 70% drop in sales. Its tough, very tough, to want to keep going.  What's really baffling, is that my trash expenses have increased this year (even with less trash and less dumpster pulls). 

I know of two more Downtown that will likely follow Zodiac's lead in the next 30 days.

Pita Pit/Quiznos and Gili's (which is Downtown's hidden gem) have recently opened food trucks to help supplement the lost revenue Downtown.   

[jaxlongtimer]

What's really baffling, is that my trash expenses have increased this year (even with less trash and less dumpster pulls).

Based on my conversations and experience, commercial trash collection is up for several reasons:  One, there is less commercial volume (restaurants and office buildings were a big chunk of business for them) with COVID so operators are spreading their costs over fewer customers.  Two, with COVID impacting employees, there has been an ongoing shortage of drivers/garbage men increasing costs to deal with that.  Three, the continuing consolidation in the waste hauling industry (e.g. Waste Management bought Advanced Disposal greatly reducing competition locally).  Four, I also believe the City has been regularly raising the landfill charges passed onto commercial accounts.

[fieldafm]

What's really baffling, is that my trash expenses have increased this year (even with less trash and less dumpster pulls).

Based on my conversations and experience, commercial trash collection is up for several reasons:  One, there is less commercial volume (restaurants and office buildings were a big chunk of business for them) with COVID so operators are spreading their costs over fewer customers.  Two, with COVID impacting employees, there has been an ongoing shortage of drivers/garbage men increasing costs to deal with that.  Three, the continuing consolidation in the waste hauling industry (e.g. Waste Management bought Advanced Disposal greatly reducing competition locally).  Four, I also believe the City has been regularly raising the landfill charges passed onto commercial accounts.

That's nice and all, but I can deduct that you don't operate a business Downtown and have to put up with the very real disadvantages the area forces you to contend with.  Most businesses Downtown rely on curbside pickup, and are charged higher rates than those that actually have the ability to have a dumpster on site.   When you are watching your business lose money, while your overhead remains unchanged without any real sources of assistance, and operate in an environment where public policy has failed you for two decades, and meanwhile your local politicians are arguing about Lot J... you don't think 'hey, I should just continue to throw my life's savings down the drain because I understand about the garbage fees and sympathize with them.

Sorry to be crass, but perhaps right now is a time where we all need to take a look in the mirror and hold our elected officials accountable for the mess they've created.  A 20 year veteran of Downtown just closed up shop in the shadow of the City offices... and got nothing but a shrug as he turned out the lights.

[MusicMan]

Yep, and LOT J about to suck up a lot of resources whilst the rest of 'real' downtown withers up and dies.......

[bl8jaxnative]

"the real downtown" was all but dead long, long, long before this.

[jaxlongtimer]

What's really baffling, is that my trash expenses have increased this year (even with less trash and less dumpster pulls).

Based on my conversations and experience, commercial trash collection is up for several reasons:  One, there is less commercial volume (restaurants and office buildings were a big chunk of business for them) with COVID so operators are spreading their costs over fewer customers.  Two, with COVID impacting employees, there has been an ongoing shortage of drivers/garbage men increasing costs to deal with that.  Three, the continuing consolidation in the waste hauling industry (e.g. Waste Management bought Advanced Disposal greatly reducing competition locally).  Four, I also believe the City has been regularly raising the landfill charges passed onto commercial accounts.

That's nice and all, but I can deduct that you don't operate a business Downtown and have to put up with the very real disadvantages the area forces you to contend with.  Most businesses Downtown rely on curbside pickup, and are charged higher rates than those that actually have the ability to have a dumpster on site.   When you are watching your business lose money, while your overhead remains unchanged without any real sources of assistance, and operate in an environment where public policy has failed you for two decades, and meanwhile your local politicians are arguing about Lot J... you don't think 'hey, I should just continue to throw my life's savings down the drain because I understand about the garbage fees and sympathize with them.

Sorry to be crass, but perhaps right now is a time where we all need to take a look in the mirror and hold our elected officials accountable for the mess they've created.  A 20 year veteran of Downtown just closed up shop in the shadow of the City offices... and got nothing but a shrug as he turned out the lights.

Field, I wasn't taking a position or defending any particular party.  Just addressing the economics of the general trash hauling business as I see it.

Fully agree about Downtown neglect and mismanagement and fully support small businesses trying to make it.  It is frustrating that City Hall and the Chamber, despite their pronouncements to the contrary, don't really support, substantially, small businesses or those located in distressed areas of the City.

[fieldafm]

What's really baffling, is that my trash expenses have increased this year (even with less trash and less dumpster pulls).

Based on my conversations and experience, commercial trash collection is up for several reasons:  One, there is less commercial volume (restaurants and office buildings were a big chunk of business for them) with COVID so operators are spreading their costs over fewer customers.  Two, with COVID impacting employees, there has been an ongoing shortage of drivers/garbage men increasing costs to deal with that.  Three, the continuing consolidation in the waste hauling industry (e.g. Waste Management bought Advanced Disposal greatly reducing competition locally).  Four, I also believe the City has been regularly raising the landfill charges passed onto commercial accounts.

That's nice and all, but I can deduct that you don't operate a business Downtown and have to put up with the very real disadvantages the area forces you to contend with.  Most businesses Downtown rely on curbside pickup, and are charged higher rates than those that actually have the ability to have a dumpster on site.   When you are watching your business lose money, while your overhead remains unchanged without any real sources of assistance, and operate in an environment where public policy has failed you for two decades, and meanwhile your local politicians are arguing about Lot J... you don't think 'hey, I should just continue to throw my life's savings down the drain because I understand about the garbage fees and sympathize with them.

Sorry to be crass, but perhaps right now is a time where we all need to take a look in the mirror and hold our elected officials accountable for the mess they've created.  A 20 year veteran of Downtown just closed up shop in the shadow of the City offices... and got nothing but a shrug as he turned out the lights.

Field, I wasn't taking a position or defending any particular party.  Just addressing the economics of the general trash hauling business as I see it.

Fully agree about Downtown neglect and mismanagement and fully support small businesses trying to make it.  It is frustrating that City Hall and the Chamber, despite their pronouncements to the contrary, don't really support, substantially, small businesses or those located in distressed areas of the City.

If we had a thumbs up emoji... I would insert it here. 

[marksjax]

Very sorry to see this happen. Jeri is a great operator. Passionate about downtown. I wish him well in any future endeavors.

Mike Field is spot on in his assessment of how little help the city offers a small business downtown. He understands what's what.

I have held back any negative comments about what happened to me but the time has come to tell it like it is. The truth.

I feel I can offer this opinion based on my personal experience, as I voluntarily closed my namesake bar, Mark's, on East Bay Street in 2017 due to sales declines.

The story is a familiar one. The city is very encouraging for you to open something, anything in downtown. I am specifically calling the Northbank downtown in this instance.

But then when you start out you hit a brick wall with zoning red tape, lots of permitting delays, signage issues, etc. Small details such as 'grease traps' for example: a grease trap in downtown cannot be the same as one in the suburbs due to limitations of the location. Think outside the box fellas and go to Tallahassee and make new rules that work for the urban (concrete footprint) environment. But do this before you ask people to invest their money in opening something in downtown. Otherwise they are left to deal with an expensive situation they did not anticipate or one that limits their capacity to even serve food.

But then once you are open there is nothing in real support. This is the key failure of the city leadership. You must nurture and create very compelling reasons/promotions for people to come downtown. This is not being done.
Yes, some occasional yet very temporary efforts to get folks to come downtown were tried but that's about it.
My suggestions went nowhere and man did I offer up a bunch over the years. It's easier for a city staffer to say no than to take a chance.
Plus there is not much of a promotional budget for them to work with even if they wanted to help you.
It's all about maintaining the status quo. 'Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.'

You've circled the wagons and are trying to survive but there is no cavalry coming to save you. You are on your own.

The painful reality of having to close a business and lay off employees is heart breaking.
At the day of the closing announcement the one & only contact I received from a city employee was an insensitive email asking this question:
"Mark, do you know what business is going to go in that space?"

I mean, what were they thinking?

I will never forgive the city management or that employee in particular for that slap in the face. I did not respond to that request.

Well thats about it. We move on and yes, there is life after downtown.

So I raise a glass to toast our old friend Jeri. You lasted a long, long time in downtown my friend.
Cheers!

[BridgeTroll]

I hear ya Mark... from an old Happy Hour friend...