Author Topic: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park  (Read 40815 times)

CityLife

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #105 on: June 24, 2021, 08:00:58 PM »
Presentations/videos:

https://coj365-my.sharepoint.com/personal/rmezini_coj_net/_layouts/15/guestaccess.aspx?folderid=0d9f2fc4345b241aa93f899407aa76fb8&authkey=AeypNIdOUXA8KM2rBjpHKoo&e=V8VYtv

Thanks for sharing. As a planner that's been involved in some cool waterfront dining and placemaking projects, I'm typically able to pick holes in the process or design concepts of projects like this, but after looking through Perkins & Will's PPT

« Last Edit: June 24, 2021, 08:26:13 PM by CityLife »

Ken_FSU

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #106 on: June 24, 2021, 08:11:08 PM »
^100 percent agree.

Video is STUNNING for P&W too.

I don’t think it’s even close.

Hope to see it happen.

Ken_FSU

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #107 on: June 24, 2021, 08:31:39 PM »
Presentations/videos:

https://coj365-my.sharepoint.com/personal/rmezini_coj_net/_layouts/15/guestaccess.aspx?folderid=0d9f2fc4345b241aa93f899407aa76fb8&authkey=AeypNIdOUXA8KM2rBjpHKoo&e=V8VYtv

Thanks for sharing. As a planner that's been involved in some cool waterfront dining and placemaking projects, I'm typically able to pick holes in the process or design concepts of projects like this, but after looking through Perkins & Will's PPT



P.S.

As a marketer who builds a lot of decks for national brands, I can't pick any holes in the PPT either.

Frankly, I don't know if I've ever seen a better deck for a Jacksonville project.

This is next level compared to what we typically see here.

fsu813

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #108 on: June 24, 2021, 08:41:44 PM »
Feels like each one is trying to pack A LOT into a relatively small area. The former Landing site doesn't have to be everything to everyone. We have a gigantic amount of other vacant riverfront space, and a significant portion of it will likely be park/public space. It's almost as if we need a master plan, so parks and their purposes aren't planned in silos.....

thelakelander

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #109 on: June 24, 2021, 08:44:18 PM »
I still need to finish going through the three concepts but I did catch the Perkins + Will presentation. What was shown will cost more than $30 million. Not saying that's a bad thing, because all of them will end up costing more than what's being said right now at the conceptual stage. In general, from my quick glance, all these projects pretty much offer the same uses and activities, just in different shapes and locations within the space. I will say that the Olin concept seems more like a poor man's version of what's already featured on the St. Pete Pier. With that said, whatever is selected will be fine. Drawing renderings and pretty pictures has never been a problem in this town. Getting something decent funded, built and maintained has and remains our challenge. Any idea of how much the Agency concept is estimated to cost at this point?
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Ken_FSU

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #110 on: June 24, 2021, 09:02:38 PM »
I still need to finish going through the three concepts but I did catch the Perkins + Will presentation. What was shown will cost more than $30 million. Not saying that's a bad thing, because all of them will end up costing more than what's being said right now at the conceptual stage. In general, from my quick glance, all these projects pretty much offer the same uses and activities, just in different shapes and locations within the space. I will say that the Olin concept seems more like a poor man's version of what's already featured on the St. Pete Pier. With that said, whatever is selected will be fine. Drawing renderings and pretty pictures has never been a problem in this town. Getting something decent funded, built and maintained has and remains our challenge. Any idea of how much the Agency concept is estimated to cost at this point?

Estimated costs from the three groups were:

$27 million for Olin.

$23-30 million for P+W.

$3.2 million per "acre of developed land" for Agency.

All three had annual maintenance at $500k to $1 million.

jaxoNOLE

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #111 on: June 24, 2021, 09:11:54 PM »
I didn't feel the Olin concept prioritized urban examples of activation. Relegating food and drink to the private pads without much of a concept there seemed like a punt on a critical component. The eco stuff was pretty cool, but they came off as a distant third to me.

I think the Agency concept is pretty good, but the art is definitely not rising to an iconic level.

The P&W concept is the most complete and the art is really well done. I LOVE the civic building concept on the one development pad, as well as the beer garden. Both are homeruns. I'd cast my vote for this one as well.

I don't think any of the three will give us one of the great, iconic waterfront parks in the country, but we'll have an asset and attraction for our residents and visitors to enjoy and be proud of. It's worthy of significant investment.

CityLife

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #112 on: June 24, 2021, 09:17:52 PM »
Presentations/videos:

https://coj365-my.sharepoint.com/personal/rmezini_coj_net/_layouts/15/guestaccess.aspx?folderid=0d9f2fc4345b241aa93f899407aa76fb8&authkey=AeypNIdOUXA8KM2rBjpHKoo&e=V8VYtv

Thanks for sharing. As a planner that's been involved in some cool waterfront dining and placemaking projects, I'm typically able to pick holes in the process or design concepts of projects like this, but after looking through Perkins & Will's PPT



P.S.

As a marketer who builds a lot of decks for national brands, I can't pick any holes in the PPT either.

Frankly, I don't know if I've ever seen a better deck for a Jacksonville project.

This is next level compared to what we typically see here.

Agreed on it being next level. Just watched the video and you are right, it is stunning.  Earlier in the thread I mentioned that I hope some of the firms put their A teams on the project in hopes that it will be a high profile project for them. Looks like they treated this as a portfolio building, legacy type project that they put a lot of time and effort into.

In looking at the other PPT's, I do like some of the ecological concepts Olin incorporated. Agency's design already looks dated.

This one seems like a no brainer.

marcuscnelson

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #113 on: June 24, 2021, 09:33:12 PM »
Definitely some lovely presentations. And I see the broad consensus appears to surround the Perkins & Will proposal. Hopefully the DIA agrees.

The question I'd ask is, seeing now that stuff like Atkins' Riverfront Jax proposal exists, how could we potentially reconcile those proposed designs? Suppose we drop the Riverfront Jax park design entirely, how could something like Perkins & Will's design then fit into that space? How might that affect the proposed city share of that project? Can we make these ideas work together?
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

thelakelander

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #114 on: June 24, 2021, 09:41:01 PM »
Is the city taking the Atkins proposal seriously?
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Ken_FSU

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #115 on: June 24, 2021, 09:56:46 PM »
I don't think any of the three will give us one of the great, iconic waterfront parks in the country, but we'll have an asset and attraction for our residents and visitors to enjoy and be proud of. It's worthy of significant investment.

What I do love is that all of these parks in various stages of renderings and planning incorporate public art.

If the P+W concept wins, and the centerpiece JAX piece is installed, that'd be really cool.

If the Southbank RiversEdge park that is scheduled to start construction after bulkhead repairs are completed includes the 50-foot interactive sculpture from Marc Fornes that the DIA and Preston Hollow have commissioned, that'd be really cool.

If Metro Park incorporates showcase public art, as Mark Lamping says it will, and if the new park that the DIA is negotiating a land swap for Kids Campus for happens and includes the signature public art that Lori Boyer has mentioned, that'd be really cool.

Individually, the public art is nice.

But collectively, having that network of riverfront parks with showcase public art, complimented by Friendship Fountain at St. Johns Park, the Lone Sailor statue on the SB riverwalk, etc. kind of would give Jacksonville something rather unique for its riverfront (e.g. lots of parks, each having a central showcase "thing").

Would be even nicer if the private sector funded the art  8)

Couple of things I love about the "Jax" art piece included in the P+W proposal:

1) In a city that tries so hard to be edgy with nonsense garbage like NoCo and Soba, the "JAX" shorthand of Jacksonville is about as authentic and organic as it gets. It's modern. It distances our identity from Andrew Jackson. Locals actually use it. It's a genuine thing, and I really love how we've started to own it more and more in recent years.

2) The design pays tribute to the river, while also literally reflecting it if we go for a mirrored finish.

3) From a marketing and tourism perspective, it gives Jacksonville our "thing" for tourist photo ops. St. Louis has the arch. Hollywood has the sign. Chicago has the bean. I spent the last four days in Nashville tripping over teenage Instagrammers trying to get their photos with the wings. Might seem gimmicky, but you don't know how many hoteliers I've heard ask for something like this. And it'd be fantastic to have it right in the heart of the CBD to draw in some folks who would otherwise spend their entire stay at the beach.

I also love how the P+W proposal leaves enough flex space to allow some of this stuff that DVI is currently doing (ice skating, skateboard championship, concerts, etc.) to still potentially fit. Not sure the Olin concept does.

jaxoNOLE

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #116 on: June 24, 2021, 10:46:29 PM »

3) From a marketing and tourism perspective, it gives Jacksonville our "thing" for tourist photo ops. St. Louis has the arch. Hollywood has the sign. Chicago has the bean. I spent the last four days in Nashville tripping over teenage Instagrammers trying to get their photos with the wings. Might seem gimmicky, but you don't know how many hoteliers I've heard ask for something like this. And it'd be fantastic to have it right in the heart of the CBD to draw in some folks who would otherwise spend their entire stay at the beach.

I couldn't envision anything that would accomplish this--probably why I'm not in a creative profession--but yes, the JAX accomplishes what you state. In fact, the artist's portion of the presentation was extensive and downright compelling. 12-18 million for the art installation is WELL worth it for that quality. I prefer it to Chicago's bean, personally. And the merchandising angle was not only politically savvy, it legitimately looked good (although the Vegas replica might be a bit much).

thelakelander

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #117 on: June 25, 2021, 06:28:27 AM »
I still need to finish going through the three concepts but I did catch the Perkins + Will presentation. What was shown will cost more than $30 million. Not saying that's a bad thing, because all of them will end up costing more than what's being said right now at the conceptual stage. In general, from my quick glance, all these projects pretty much offer the same uses and activities, just in different shapes and locations within the space. I will say that the Olin concept seems more like a poor man's version of what's already featured on the St. Pete Pier. With that said, whatever is selected will be fine. Drawing renderings and pretty pictures has never been a problem in this town. Getting something decent funded, built and maintained has and remains our challenge. Any idea of how much the Agency concept is estimated to cost at this point?

Estimated costs from the three groups were:

$27 million for Olin.

$23-30 million for P+W.

$3.2 million per "acre of developed land" for Agency.

All three had annual maintenance at $500k to $1 million.

$15 million for the Agency Landscape one, according to the Jax Daily Record.

https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/three-visions-proposed-for-the-former-jacksonville-landing

What's hard to determine is what is and is not included in these estimates. I assume that the development pad parts are not. So much of the ground floor retail shown in these would not be included in the estimates presented. Someone should photoshop out those pad parcels, so that we can get a realistic perspective of the numbers and overall development
time frame.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2021, 06:35:30 AM by thelakelander »
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thelakelander

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #118 on: June 25, 2021, 06:58:48 AM »
Quote
3 different visions unveiled for former Landing site



Our partners at WJCT take a look at three different visions recently unveiled for the redevelopment of the former Jacksonville Landing site.


Read More: https://www.thejaxsonmag.com/article/3-different-visions-unveiled-for-former-landing-site/
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

Des

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Re: DIA wants the Landing to start with a park
« Reply #119 on: June 25, 2021, 08:36:36 AM »
I like that P & W leaves the most open lawn area, I think that's an important aspect.