Author Topic: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station  (Read 6640 times)

marcuscnelson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 983
  • Gen Z - Tired of the status quo
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #30 on: November 13, 2020, 12:03:43 PM »
Is this the type of thing where we just need to bother enough council members to write a bill or something? I mean what can be done about this?
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

thelakelander

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 31855
    • Modern Cities
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #31 on: November 13, 2020, 01:26:38 PM »
It's the type of thing that if it were a high priority among just about any person in decision making position and influence, it could happen. In Lakeland, it was their Downtown Development Authority director that led the effort to get passenger rail back to their downtown 20 years ago.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

marcuscnelson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 983
  • Gen Z - Tired of the status quo
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #32 on: November 13, 2020, 05:40:47 PM »
Decided to just ask David Cawton what was up on Twitter. He responded surprisingly quickly.

Quote
Like much of the best laid plans in 2020 - COVID-19 happened. With a 60-70% drop in ridership, significant loss of sales and gas tax revenues since March, we've had to focus on other more pressing matters.

This project is still very much in the works.

For that little of a sum, it seems like a bit of a non-answer. Especially knowing that the AV route on Bay Street seems to be moving hell or high water.
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

marcuscnelson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 983
  • Gen Z - Tired of the status quo
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #33 on: November 13, 2020, 07:28:35 PM »
Another response:

Quote
For sure, and we would love to have it open right now. Its still very much in the works. I'll be the first one over to Burrito Gallery!

I'm not sure we were even ready to announce the project at the time tbh, but the Daily Record found a permit app and we had to respond.
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

thelakelander

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 31855
    • Modern Cities
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #34 on: November 13, 2020, 08:30:06 PM »
COVID is a good excuse for a delay. What's the timeline now? Are we looking a months or years?
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

jaxlongtimer

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #35 on: November 16, 2020, 10:59:18 PM »
Is this the type of thing where we just need to bother enough council members to write a bill or something? I mean what can be done about this?

My guess is there are more people concerned about other issues like drainage, sidewalks, potholes, crime, underfunded parks and garbage service every second of the day than the Skyway in 40 years.  I don't see the politics pushing a council member to get too excited about this project especially given the boondoggle-to-date it has repeatedly proven to be.  We have already met our quota for those this year:  JEA, Lot J, RNC Convention, automated vehicles, disastrous public garage deals, etc.  8).

marcuscnelson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 983
  • Gen Z - Tired of the status quo
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #36 on: November 16, 2020, 11:32:58 PM »
They don't have to get excited. They didn't seem particularly excited about spending over $20 million on the Landing buyout and demo. Something with about 4% of the cost shouldn't be this hard. Something this small and simple should be easy.

Speaking of automated vehicles, funny how this low-cost expansion is apparently just too hard, yet it's full-speed-ahead on U2C. And it's not like they aren't touching the existing system, I can see on JTA's procurement page that they're awarding plenty of contracts for new APUs, HVAC systems, and track components. I suppose adding a ramp and awning is bigger than that, but still, just, sigh.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2020, 11:34:44 PM by marcuscnelson »
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

Ocklawaha

  • Phd. Ferroequinology
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10438
  • Monster of Mobility! Ocklawaha is Robert Mann
    • LIGHT RAIL JACKSONVILLE
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #37 on: November 18, 2020, 01:10:22 PM »
I could hardly believe my eyes, “LIGHT RAIL” in Jacksonville. Sadly the writer appears not to know the difference $$$ between light rail, monorails or waste management trucks. For the record, what started as an APM or Automated People Mover was converted to monorail in the early 2000’s.

JTA crying that they can’t fix it is typical of BS they’ve been selling the unsuspecting public for decades. Monorails are highly customizable and are made by no less than a dozen companies around the globe. Anyone want odds that JTA never even inquired about new trains? I have spoken to several manufacturers and tend to get the same response, JTA who??

Brooklyn Station should have been built when the monorail conversion took place. Truthfully, be it monorail, Clown Carts or riding mowers towing little red wagons the system will remain fairly useless until it actually reaches the Sports District, San Marco and actually connects with FSCJ.

marcuscnelson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 983
  • Gen Z - Tired of the status quo
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #38 on: November 18, 2020, 03:22:20 PM »
Wow, it's been some time Ock. Welcome back, hope you're doing well.

Like I said, it's incredibly suspect that David is insisting we can't afford this when we can apparently afford tossing millions into technology scheduled to go into production service while Tampa is still running tests.

I can't say I'm surprised that train builders haven't heard of us. It's almost certain that for some reason, there was a meeting in 2017 where some very important people agreed on autonomous vehicles and decided to not bother looking at anything else.

To be just a little fair, Brooklyn wasn't as far along in the mid-90s when they planned the expansion as it was by even the mid-2000s. For the longest time they've wanted to build tracks to a new, separate elevated station to the southeast of the maintenance facility, I assume in order to continue expanding later. This is a concession, but a worthwhile one to expand to what Brooklyn is today. And the U2C plan as it stands does include expansions to the Sports District, San Marco, and North through FSCJ. Most people don't seem to have any issue with the routes (save for the silly bridge idea), it's the vehicle technology and deciding to run them in mixed traffic, and the likelihood of them generating TOD.
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

thelakelander

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 31855
    • Modern Cities
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #39 on: November 18, 2020, 05:20:46 PM »
Doesn't matter if the U2C connects into the stadium or not. On its most successful day, it would be a cluster. It won't have the capacity to move large game day crowds and if it did, it would clog the road for everyone with several little vehicles mixed in traffic running at a max speed of less than 15mph.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

Ocklawaha

  • Phd. Ferroequinology
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10438
  • Monster of Mobility! Ocklawaha is Robert Mann
    • LIGHT RAIL JACKSONVILLE
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #40 on: November 18, 2020, 05:33:36 PM »
Thank you! I’m doing well and currently freezing my posterior off in Wauwatosa, WI.

The U2C is a door to first and last to door mile solution for riders of mass transit (the transit we don’t have). The inteligencia should be able to add on their fingers the fact that 15mph, 12 passenger glorified golf carts are not going to impress Tibor Hollo, into plopping a 85 story Panorama Tower downtown anymore than it will convince Burger King to remodel 210 E State Street. I will predict a very modest success or usage along downtown streets, though we’d probably get more passenger miles by running them around Town Center. Then as they become old, worn and common, we’ll gradually wake up to the millions $$$ flushed chasing A ridiculous shot-gun marriage of elevated rail and clown cart technology. Mass transit, speed, comfort, etc is simply not what they are designed for.

Don’t lose faith in Jacksonville’s ability to remain coal in a nation of diamonds, by the time we retire the U2c Hollywood will have produced yet another intergalactic block buster... “Ooh, we want one of those!”

Charles Hunter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3214
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #41 on: November 18, 2020, 08:52:24 PM »
Never mind, this should have been in the U2C discussion - and now it is.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2020, 10:55:28 PM by Charles Hunter »

jaxlongtimer

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #42 on: November 18, 2020, 09:47:53 PM »
I could hardly believe my eyes, “LIGHT RAIL” in Jacksonville. Sadly the writer appears not to know the difference $$$ between light rail, monorails or waste management trucks. For the record, what started as an APM or Automated People Mover was converted to monorail in the early 2000’s.

JTA crying that they can’t fix it is typical of BS they’ve been selling the unsuspecting public for decades. Monorails are highly customizable and are made by no less than a dozen companies around the globe. Anyone want odds that JTA never even inquired about new trains? I have spoken to several manufacturers and tend to get the same response, JTA who??

Brooklyn Station should have been built when the monorail conversion took place. Truthfully, be it monorail, Clown Carts or riding mowers towing little red wagons the system will remain fairly useless until it actually reaches the Sports District, San Marco and actually connects with FSCJ.

I believe JTA is spending a dollar (or way more!) to spare spending a dime to give up on the Skyway.  JTA is to the Skyway what Trump is to conceding the election.  They just can't admit to the facts and will obfuscate for as long as they can.

Regarding light rail, Ock, why doesn't someone point out that the Better Jacksonville Plan (BJP) budgeted $100 million (in 20+year old dollars) to buy right of way for light or other rail and never spent a dime on it.  Instead, the money went to the stadium (more dollars for the Jags, the real motivation for the BJP) and courthouse overruns.  That tells you everything about our plans for improving mass transit. 

thelakelander

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 31855
    • Modern Cities
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #43 on: November 18, 2020, 10:28:37 PM »
JTA tried to spend that $100 million on buying land for bus rapid transit stops along I-95. Ultimately, they took to long and the money went elsewhere.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

marcuscnelson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 983
  • Gen Z - Tired of the status quo
Re: JTA to open No Frills Brooklyn Skyway Station
« Reply #44 on: November 18, 2020, 11:53:08 PM »
What a silly idea.
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey