Author Topic: And now for something completely different  (Read 2900 times)

sandyshoes

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And now for something completely different
« on: December 02, 2019, 10:27:19 AM »
Just because I am wondering - does anyone have an idea how many abortion-supporters are also in favor of gun control and vice-versa? 

Peter Griffin

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2019, 11:21:27 AM »
Current political affiliations seem as if they would suggest pro-gun and anti-abortion are likely to be coincident, as would anti-gun, pro-abortion.

Not everything is black and white, though; there are probably plenty of people who are pro-gun, pro-abortion, and others who are anti-gun, anti-abortion.

If you're looking for a statistic, though, probably best for a searching, though you're undoubtedly going to come up with some biased results with such a particular set of statistics.

Tacachale

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2019, 11:29:19 AM »
Depends on what you mean by both "abortion supporters" and "in favor of gun control." 82% of Americans believe abortion should be legal in case of rape and incest, while 60% believe it should be legal in most or all cases. As for gun control, 94% of Americans want universal background checks, while 61% want stricter gun laws in general. As such there's bound to be overlap in there depending on what exactly you're talking about.

https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=2623
« Last Edit: December 02, 2019, 11:50:24 AM by Tacachale »
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

icarus

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2019, 11:42:13 AM »
Current political affiliations seem as if they would suggest pro-gun and anti-abortion are likely to be coincident, as would anti-gun, pro-abortion.

Not everything is black and white, though; there are probably plenty of people who are pro-gun, pro-abortion, and others who are anti-gun, anti-abortion.

If you're looking for a statistic, though, probably best for a searching, though you're undoubtedly going to come up with some biased results with such a particular set of statistics.

I agree not everything is black and white and I think most people's opinions are shades of grey.  Average citizens dont fit neatly in a box or category based on party affiliation.

Papa33

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2019, 03:34:59 PM »
"Right to lifers" who support the death penalty.  Discuss.

sanmarcomatt

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2019, 04:10:02 PM »
"Right to lifers" who support the death penalty.  Discuss.


Can we add “Right to Choosers” who don’t support the death penalty and somehow get gun control back in the mix as well?

sandyshoes

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2019, 07:25:37 AM »
Papa33 - how many crimes have fetuses committed? 

Peter Griffin

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2019, 08:22:58 AM »
This is a troll thread, whoever started this wanted to start an argument.

sandyshoes

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2019, 12:48:44 PM »
I started it because I wanted to get some feedback about an issue that is confusing to me, and see if I could get some real answers to help me figure it out.  The way I hear it is that people who favor gun control are not in favor of killing human beings...but it seems that abortion is doing exactly that.  So, like the person who pointed out why people who are anti-abortion favor the death penalty - - that's another side I had never even considered existed.  Just trying to sort it out for my own little wrinkled brain, with some help.  I do not have a degree to study the human psyche, and so realize that I may never find the answer.  Isn't this what a forum is about?  Educating each other, asking what we don't know?  And you want to attack me for that.  Nice.   

Tacachale

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2019, 01:35:31 PM »
I started it because I wanted to get some feedback about an issue that is confusing to me, and see if I could get some real answers to help me figure it out.  The way I hear it is that people who favor gun control are not in favor of killing human beings...but it seems that abortion is doing exactly that.  So, like the person who pointed out why people who are anti-abortion favor the death penalty - - that's another side I had never even considered existed.  Just trying to sort it out for my own little wrinkled brain, with some help.  I do not have a degree to study the human psyche, and so realize that I may never find the answer.  Isn't this what a forum is about?  Educating each other, asking what we don't know?  And you want to attack me for that.  Nice.   

Well, this forum is mostly about things and Jacksonville and urban development. There's nothing wrong with asking the big questions here, but in some cases, contentious topics can generate more heat than light, and we don't want that. That said, I don't believe this thread has gotten to that point yet.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

sandyshoes

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #10 on: December 03, 2019, 04:59:10 PM »
Then it was my mistake to seek info here.  By all means remove this thread if it will inflame sensitive types. 

I-10east

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2019, 10:23:19 AM »
Current political affiliations seem as if they would suggest pro-gun and anti-abortion are likely to be coincident, as would anti-gun, pro-abortion.

Not everything is black and white, though; there are probably plenty of people who are pro-gun, pro-abortion, and others who are anti-gun, anti-abortion.

If you're looking for a statistic, though, probably best for a searching, though you're undoubtedly going to come up with some biased results with such a particular set of statistics.

I totally agree with this. Im pro abortion (no late term nonsense like New York, except for rare life threatening cases) and I'm totally against gun control.

In fairness to Sandyshoes, many people are aligned within the same political paradigm (esp major wedge issues); being for gun control and pro choice of course aligns with many on the left (not all).
« Last Edit: December 04, 2019, 10:33:45 AM by I-10east »

Tacachale

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2019, 11:36:13 AM »
Then it was my mistake to seek info here.  By all means remove this thread if it will inflame sensitive types.

As I said, I don't think this discussion has gotten remotely to the point that we'd step in. But contentious issues often become, well, contentious. One thing we're not going to have is a return to the place where people openly mocked and insulted each other in the forums. If it stays civil, I have no problem with the thread.

In this case it's really not too hard to understand where the different sides are coming from if you're willing to consider peoples' differing perspectives. Pro-life people generally believe that conception is the point where human life begins, and so terminating a pregnancy is ending a human life. They typically favor the government restricting abortion as a matter of protecting human life. Meanwhile, pro-choice people by and large don't consider conception the point that human life begins, particularly in the earlier stages when the blastocyst/embryo/fetus isn't developed and couldn't survive outside the womb. As such, they believe it's a medical and personal issue for the women and families, and the government has no business getting involved.

For some it's less a matter of whether abortion is right or wrong, and more about who should have a say - should it be a woman's decision, or society's and the government's? There are folks who would never get an abortion themselves who are pro-choice in that they think it's best left to the woman involved.

As Peter said, as with anything, there's a lot more nuance and variation in how people's views on abortion line up with their other beliefs. There are libertarians who strongly favor limiting the government in every way, including abortion, gun control and the death penalty. There are politically active Catholics who strongly favor protecting life, opposing abortion and the death penalty and favoring gun control. As with most things, most people are somewhere in between on all these different issues.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

Snaketoz

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2019, 03:17:58 PM »
I would like to bring up another contentious subject.  That subject is gravity.  I am against gravity.  Those of you who insist on using it, go ahead.  I prefer the freedom of weightlessness.  Also, the earth is flat and the center of the universe.  Anyone who differs will surely have to answer to God.

sandyshoes

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Re: And now for something completely different
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2019, 12:23:12 PM »
Snaketoz, I'm not looking at it from a morality or religious standpoint, I'm just trying to find a trail of logic - ('Jane Doe favors this issue but not that one...but they both boil down to the same thing', if you want it sort of in the form of an algebra problem).