Brightline ready to expand rail system to Tampa

[marcuscnelson]

Lake:

I've been saying for years now that Jax's best opportunity at any form of passenger rail service will be intercity service enhancements in the form of Amtrak and/or Brightline. It will be faster than anything at the local level.

JD:

Is it really that much easier for a private entity to do it?

Well, Amtrak is a Federal government corporation (losses are covered by us taxpayers, just like the USPS) and Brightline is getting lots of government subsidies/support so not sure one can say Lake is asking for "private" entities alone to do this.

Public transit is like low income housing... it is never going to work without government involvement as revenues rarely cover expenses or justify private capital investment alone.  So, wherever you see public transit, government involvement can't be far behind regardless of who is fronting it  .

I would note that this is how all transportation works, regardless of mode. The United States also subsidizes air travel to the tune of billions, from publicly funded airports to subsidies for aircraft manufacturers to bailouts of airlines when they collapse to the air traffic control system every pilot relies on. This state has just committed billions to another expansion of I-4, not to mention the multi-billion-dollar highway program in North Florida. Any form of transportation is reliant on government to some extent.

[Jax_Developer]

Lake:

I've been saying for years now that Jax's best opportunity at any form of passenger rail service will be intercity service enhancements in the form of Amtrak and/or Brightline. It will be faster than anything at the local level.

JD:

Is it really that much easier for a private entity to do it?

Well, Amtrak is a Federal government corporation (losses are covered by us taxpayers, just like the USPS) and Brightline is getting lots of government subsidies/support so not sure one can say Lake is asking for "private" entities alone to do this.

Public transit is like low income housing... it is never going to work without government involvement as revenues rarely cover expenses or justify private capital investment alone.  So, wherever you see public transit, government involvement can't be far behind regardless of who is fronting it  .

I would note that this is how all transportation works, regardless of mode. The United States also subsidizes air travel to the tune of billions, from publicly funded airports to subsidies for aircraft manufacturers to bailouts of airlines when they collapse to the air traffic control system every pilot relies on. This state has just committed billions to another expansion of I-4, not to mention the multi-billion-dollar highway program in North Florida. Any form of transportation is reliant on government to some extent.

Right I don't see any form of mass transit as fully-private. I assume the very defined nature of it, allows them to focus on "approvals" rather than local "baggage." They can go directly to larger sources of capital than JTA I would assume.

[thelakelander]

I say it will be quicker for Amtrak and Brightline to move forward than anything locally for a few major reasons IMO.

1. They've both done it before. They know what they are doing. No entity in Jax can say that...including JTA.

2. They already operate an intercity rail service. No entity in Jax can claim this. So much of what we'll struggle for years to figure out has already been resolved by these systems.

3. No matter what anyone thinks about Amtrak, this intercity rail service is already in operation in Jax. So with them, we're not talking about building something new from scratch. Instead, the conversation should be around adding an extra stop(s), similar to Stuart, Aventura or Cocoa getting an extra stop on an existing Brightline service that already operates through their communities. Adding a station downtown will always be easier and cheaper than JTA establishing a new rail service on tracks they don't own.

4. Brightline already has the rights to operate their service on the FEC. With them, it's not a matter of if. It's a matter of when, ridership feasibility and cost. A vibrant downtown Jax can make this happen sooner rather than later. So the local challenge is making downtown vibrant. Not figuring out how a transit agency that can barely run a reliable bus service can expand to running a passenger rail operation.