Author Topic: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018  (Read 31504 times)

thelakelander

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #105 on: April 23, 2018, 08:36:00 AM »
A PD&E study alone could take a couple of years to complete! It's not as simple as securing money (which we still don't have what's necessary). Even with 100% funds, there's still a timeline associated with the process.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2018, 08:38:14 AM by thelakelander »
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Tacachale

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #106 on: April 23, 2018, 09:17:23 AM »
^Yeah, I'm totally prepared to bet one Aardwolf beer of choice that this thing is not built out come April 2023.

We know it won't get started next year, as they're planning on selling parking passes for Lot J for the 2019 season.
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KenFSU

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #107 on: April 24, 2018, 05:38:57 PM »
^Weird, I've heard that they're targeting somewhere between summer and fall 2019 to begin Lot J construction, but I guess they might start with the garage.

Like I mentioned previously, I'm also continuing to hear that office space, not residential or hotel, is what Khan/Lamping consider to be the key to Lot J.

Whether there's a market for it is clearly a whole different matter, but the magic number that the Jags are targeting is 2,000 jobs in and around Lot J, between office and service.


thelakelander

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #108 on: April 24, 2018, 06:11:55 PM »
It's not like this city is Manhattan. Both the District and the Jags proposals include a lot of office space. There's also a ton of empty office space in the Northbank. Which one will win and who will miss out?
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MusicMan

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #109 on: April 25, 2018, 08:40:28 AM »
Jacksonville Chamber of Commerce should set up a satellite office in Silicon Valley and start recruiting corporations to consider relocating to Jacksonville.

Not sure how we landed Fidelity but there have to be plenty of candidates for relocation out there who would love the idea of "cheap" land, no state income tax, and affordable lifestyle choices for their employees.

KenFSU

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #110 on: April 25, 2018, 10:05:50 AM »
It's not like this city is Manhattan. Both the District and the Jags proposals include a lot of office space. There's also a ton of empty office space in the Northbank. Which one will win and who will miss out?

Call me an optimist, but if and when new office space opens up at Lot J and/or District, I think it will come at the expense of the suburbs, not the Northbank. The suburban market has already started to get really tight, particularly in the last year, with limited options and escalating prices. Rising tides have a tendency to raise all ships, and as downtown improves and new projects like these are potentially built out, I'd hope that all office space downtown would become more desirable, not just the newly added space.

Tacachale

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #111 on: April 25, 2018, 10:56:15 AM »
It's not like this city is Manhattan. Both the District and the Jags proposals include a lot of office space. There's also a ton of empty office space in the Northbank. Which one will win and who will miss out?

Call me an optimist, but if and when new office space opens up at Lot J and/or District, I think it will come at the expense of the suburbs, not the Northbank. The suburban market has already started to get really tight, particularly in the last year, with limited options and escalating prices. Rising tides have a tendency to raise all ships, and as downtown improves and new projects like these are potentially built out, I'd hope that all office space downtown would become more desirable, not just the newly added space.

Downtown still has an office vacancy rate of 12.5%. The market isn't exactly bursting at the seems right now.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

Wacca Pilatka

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #112 on: April 25, 2018, 11:36:55 AM »
One assumes that Iguana and Rummell have designs on luring companies to relocate not just from the suburbs but from outside the market...otherwise the profusion of office space makes no market sense.
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KenFSU

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #113 on: April 25, 2018, 11:45:39 AM »
It's not like this city is Manhattan. Both the District and the Jags proposals include a lot of office space. There's also a ton of empty office space in the Northbank. Which one will win and who will miss out?



Call me an optimist, but if and when new office space opens up at Lot J and/or District, I think it will come at the expense of the suburbs, not the Northbank. The suburban market has already started to get really tight, particularly in the last year, with limited options and escalating prices. Rising tides have a tendency to raise all ships, and as downtown improves and new projects like these are potentially built out, I'd hope that all office space downtown would become more desirable, not just the newly added space.

Downtown still has an office vacancy rate of 12.5%. The market isn't exactly bursting at the seems right now.

Right now, no. If downtown keeps improving at the rate that it is and one or two of these shiny new projects fall into place, I absolutely think the northbank will be able to poach from the 'burbs. The bar has been set very low, for a very long time.

To Wacca's point above, Iguana is absolutely targeting companies outside of market.

And let's not forget that not all of the space will be net new.

JEA is looking for somewhere to put 800 employees, as their existing office tower has reached end-of-life and is likely coming down.

JBTripper

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #114 on: April 25, 2018, 11:57:02 AM »
One assumes that Iguana and Rummell have designs on luring companies to relocate not just from the suburbs but from outside the market...otherwise the profusion of office space makes no market sense.

Correct. Khan isn't interested in growing downtown at the expense of the suburbs. That doesn't add value to his investment. Jacksonville currently has no premier, urban, walkable, live/work/play environment necessary to attract the sort of enterprise that recruits young talent from outside of town. So Khan would like to build one next door to the football stadium in order to create a marketplace of NFL fans to sell tickets to. Grow Jacksonville, grow the Jaguars.

Tacachale

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #115 on: April 25, 2018, 12:00:23 PM »
It's not like this city is Manhattan. Both the District and the Jags proposals include a lot of office space. There's also a ton of empty office space in the Northbank. Which one will win and who will miss out?



Call me an optimist, but if and when new office space opens up at Lot J and/or District, I think it will come at the expense of the suburbs, not the Northbank. The suburban market has already started to get really tight, particularly in the last year, with limited options and escalating prices. Rising tides have a tendency to raise all ships, and as downtown improves and new projects like these are potentially built out, I'd hope that all office space downtown would become more desirable, not just the newly added space.

Downtown still has an office vacancy rate of 12.5%. The market isn't exactly bursting at the seems right now.

Right now, no. If downtown keeps improving at the rate that it is and one or two of these shiny new projects fall into place, I absolutely think the northbank will be able to poach from the 'burbs. The bar has been set very low, for a very long time.

To Wacca's point above, Iguana is absolutely targeting companies outside of market.

And let's not forget that not all of the space will be net new.

JEA is looking for somewhere to put 800 employees, as their existing office tower has reached end-of-life and is likely coming down.

Outside the market is one thing, poaching from our own suburbs is another.

There are very few real businesses in the Jax area outside Duval County, and those in the Duval suburbs are already paying their taxes here. It's not worth the many millions in incentives this project would take if all it accomplishes is moving some company from part of the municipality to another (and still isn't in the downtown core). There are many better ways to invest in downtown development.

What's the evidence that they're recruiting outside companies, especially considering this is all so conjectural right now?
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

KenFSU

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #116 on: April 25, 2018, 02:07:18 PM »
What's the evidence that they're recruiting outside companies, especially considering this is all so conjectural right now?

I read it on Taste of the Town Center.



(or heard from a fairly reliable source that Khan has been pitching businesses on Jacksonville for years, both nationally and internationally, for the Shipyards development, and may have some takers lined up if/when it ever gets built)

Of anyone in this city, Khan is the one guy that I wouldn't underestimate under any circumstance. He's one of the most well-connected men on the planet, with deep ties in London, Chicago, and the Middle East.

I don't think he's spending his own money on an office tower in hopes that Larry's Giant Subs moves in 30 employees.

thelakelander

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #117 on: April 25, 2018, 07:31:40 PM »
It's not like this city is Manhattan. Both the District and the Jags proposals include a lot of office space. There's also a ton of empty office space in the Northbank. Which one will win and who will miss out?



Call me an optimist, but if and when new office space opens up at Lot J and/or District, I think it will come at the expense of the suburbs, not the Northbank. The suburban market has already started to get really tight, particularly in the last year, with limited options and escalating prices. Rising tides have a tendency to raise all ships, and as downtown improves and new projects like these are potentially built out, I'd hope that all office space downtown would become more desirable, not just the newly added space.

Downtown still has an office vacancy rate of 12.5%. The market isn't exactly bursting at the seems right now.

Right now, no. If downtown keeps improving at the rate that it is and one or two of these shiny new projects fall into place, I absolutely think the northbank will be able to poach from the 'burbs. The bar has been set very low, for a very long time.

To Wacca's point above, Iguana is absolutely targeting companies outside of market.

And let's not forget that not all of the space will be net new.

JEA is looking for somewhere to put 800 employees, as their existing office tower has reached end-of-life and is likely coming down.
JEA already has a site in the heart of the Northbank. Assuming they aren't sold, it would be a loss for the Northbank to lose them to either the Shipyards, Lot J or the District.
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thelakelander

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #118 on: April 25, 2018, 07:36:50 PM »
What's the evidence that they're recruiting outside companies, especially considering this is all so conjectural right now?

I read it on Taste of the Town Center.



(or heard from a fairly reliable source that Khan has been pitching businesses on Jacksonville for years, both nationally and internationally, for the Shipyards development, and may have some takers lined up if/when it ever gets built)

Of anyone in this city, Khan is the one guy that I wouldn't underestimate under any circumstance. He's one of the most well-connected men on the planet, with deep ties in London, Chicago, and the Middle East.

I don't think he's spending his own money on an office tower in hopes that Larry's Giant Subs moves in 30 employees.
Where did it say that Khan would spend his own money on an office tower? I doubt that happens.
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KenFSU

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Re: Jaguars State of the Franchise 2018
« Reply #119 on: April 25, 2018, 08:37:21 PM »
JEA already has a site in the heart of the Northbank. Assuming they aren't sold, it would be a loss for the Northbank to lose them to either the Shipyards, Lot J or the District.

Someone might be able to correct me, but to the best of my knowledge, there's no formal agreement in place, and no movement on a land swap has taken place since last summer. JEA and the city agreed that the parcel adjacent to the courthouse would be worth exploring further (JEA was talking about bringing CBRE in to begin due diligence), but I think the sales talk might have temporarily stalled that.

JEA would be a terrible fit for Khan's project (if anyone's spent time there, it's not exactly a Jacksonville Live! crowd), but I could see the District group making a play for JEA. JEA is looking for approximately 200,000 sf. The District is proposing 200,000 square feet.

All that said, JEA and the city work very closely together, and I think it behooves JEA to stay within earshot of City Hall. I bet they take that spot.