Author Topic: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed  (Read 4224 times)

Tacachale

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #15 on: July 07, 2017, 01:26:55 PM »
^I spoke too soon - Bold City has been permitted to keep the tap room going with some conditions. Hopefully it'll make it easier to get the building up to code.

http://jacksonville.com/news/food-and-dining/metro/2017-07-07/bold-city-gets-reprieve-brewery-tap-room-ok-d-reopen?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=TheFloridaTimesUnion-SND
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Steve

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2017, 01:30:21 PM »
^I spoke too soon - Bold City has been permitted to keep the tap room going with some conditions. Hopefully it'll make it easier to get the building up to code.

http://jacksonville.com/news/food-and-dining/metro/2017-07-07/bold-city-gets-reprieve-brewery-tap-room-ok-d-reopen?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=TheFloridaTimesUnion-SND

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Jim

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2017, 01:31:57 PM »
Government busy bodies screwing things up for productive members of society. Typical.

Oh please. Fire safety should not be overlooked in the name of profit.
No, no. Per the Libertarian way, restaurants should be allowed to lace their food with asbestos and elementary schools should have the freedom to used lead-based paint on every wall.
I know you are just being flippant but the actual Libertarian way would be to have the FDA privatized. Kind of like the UL for anything electronic. Not required by federal law but good luck selling a product not certified.

Adam White

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #18 on: July 07, 2017, 02:02:44 PM »
Government busy bodies screwing things up for productive members of society. Typical.

Oh please. Fire safety should not be overlooked in the name of profit.
No, no. Per the Libertarian way, restaurants should be allowed to lace their food with asbestos and elementary schools should have the freedom to used lead-based paint on every wall.
I know you are just being flippant but the actual Libertarian way would be to have the FDA privatized. Kind of like the UL for anything electronic. Not required by federal law but good luck selling a product not certified.

Except in the "libertarian" utopia, the competition is eventually eliminated and consumers really won't be able to choose who they buy from.
“If you're going to play it out of tune, then play it out of tune properly.”

Adam White

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2017, 02:41:45 PM »
So, apparently the brewery were at fault. And it was a fire safety issue. Damn government!

Quote
The decision was that Bold City Brewery had been doing something for almost nine years that it was never permitted to do.

So the beer taps were shut down. The brewery was still operating, as was Bold City’s new tap room downtown on Bay Street. But the Riverside tap room was closed and dry Thursday night, one of only three days a week that it’s open to the public.

By Friday, however, Wilson said, his office found an exception deep in the National Fire Protection Association’s codes, which the city follows: The tap room could reopen as long as no more than 4o were there at a time.

“If there’s any wiggle room that we can keep them operating,” Wilson said, “we want to do that.”

That’s because the tap room as a mercantile operating falls under “incidental” use. Yoga, however, is classified as “assembly.” And that wouldn’t work.

“It all goes by square footage and with yoga they could have 300 people in there,” he said. “Then you’d need fire alarms, lighted exits.”
“If you're going to play it out of tune, then play it out of tune properly.”

Steve

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2017, 03:50:34 PM »
So, apparently the brewery were at fault. And it was a fire safety issue. Damn government!

Quote
The decision was that Bold City Brewery had been doing something for almost nine years that it was never permitted to do.

So the beer taps were shut down. The brewery was still operating, as was Bold City’s new tap room downtown on Bay Street. But the Riverside tap room was closed and dry Thursday night, one of only three days a week that it’s open to the public.

By Friday, however, Wilson said, his office found an exception deep in the National Fire Protection Association’s codes, which the city follows: The tap room could reopen as long as no more than 4o were there at a time.

“If there’s any wiggle room that we can keep them operating,” Wilson said, “we want to do that.”

That’s because the tap room as a mercantile operating falls under “incidental” use. Yoga, however, is classified as “assembly.” And that wouldn’t work.

“It all goes by square footage and with yoga they could have 300 people in there,” he said. “Then you’d need fire alarms, lighted exits.”

I'm glad they were able to come to a solution. I don't know how others felt, but I completely agree with taking fire code seriously, and understand why we have a fire code. I also never said that they were not at fault - ignorance to the law isn't an excuse to not follow a law.

With that said, this is exhibit A on people's frustration with government:

 - They were not trying to hide that they had a tap room. Everyone knew it, it was listed on their website, cars were around it when it was open.
 - The inspectors had been coming for years and clearly saw it. You can't hide a tap room by throwing a sheet over it.
 - By all accounts and reading quotes from them, they didn't know they were out of compliance. They sought the permits that they were told were needed, and received permits for what they sought.
    - The Fire Marshall in the Business Journal quote even concurred with this in his quote.

My belief - if this experience actually improves the permitting process, COJ learns from this, and puts steps in place to (reasonably) ensure this doesn't happen again, then good all around and Jacksonville will be a better place for small business owners who are investing in the community. Like I said, based on the press I've read Bold City was at fault and was missing proper permits....but when you have a business owner asking the city to tell them what they needed and is told incomplete information, then COJ needs to learn too.

fieldafm

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2017, 04:02:52 PM »
Quote
So, apparently the brewery were at fault. And it was a fire safety issue. Damn government!

I know, right?!?  I mean, yoga presents a serious fire hazard... much more so than brewing or serving beer (both uses they are allowed to do based on their zoning). Thank the Good Lord in Heaven that the government saved those limber hippies from the evil, reckless brewery owners trying to take advantage of their admittedly hazy judgement while in a Zen-like state of mind, from sure fire death.


^^That's sarcasm, in case you didn't pick it up.

jlmann

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2017, 04:05:45 PM »
true libertarianism is as cluelessly idealistic and ignores human nature to the same degree as comrade marx.  both are dumb. 

privatize the fda?  lol what could go wrong there.  need to look in the mirror and do some thinking when your political ideology produces ideas like that gem

but back to the thread. beer and fire safety are super. k bye.

Adam White

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2017, 04:14:58 PM »
Quote
So, apparently the brewery were at fault. And it was a fire safety issue. Damn government!

I know, right?!?  I mean, yoga presents a serious fire hazard... much more so than brewing or serving beer (both uses they are allowed to do based on their zoning). Thank the Good Lord in Heaven that the government saved those limber hippies from the evil, reckless brewery owners trying to take advantage of their admittedly hazy judgement while in a Zen-like state of mind, from sure fire death.


^^That's sarcasm, in case you didn't pick it up.

I picked it up.

Apparently, having groups of people assemble in a building requires fire alarms and lighted exits. It's about the number of people, not the activity. But I'm sure you knew that.
“If you're going to play it out of tune, then play it out of tune properly.”

Adam White

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2017, 04:15:55 PM »
true libertarianism is as cluelessly idealistic and ignores human nature to the same degree as comrade marx.  both are dumb. 

privatize the fda?  lol what could go wrong there.  need to look in the mirror and do some thinking when your political ideology produces ideas like that gem

but back to the thread. beer and fire safety are super. k bye.

How much Marx have you read?
“If you're going to play it out of tune, then play it out of tune properly.”

jlmann

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2017, 04:25:35 PM »
Quote
How much Marx have you read?

really.  I'm just using marx as euphemism for the leftiest of the left socialists as is quite common.  but why don't you just tell me why you disagree or how much marx you've read, the real reason for your question.



Adam White

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #26 on: July 07, 2017, 04:29:17 PM »
Quote
How much Marx have you read?

really.  I'm just using marx as euphemism for the leftiest of the left socialists as is quite common.  but why don't you just tell me why you disagree or how much marx you've read, the real reason for your question.

My point is that many (if not most) of the sins people ascribe to Marx aren't really to be found in his writings. In fact, even the sins people ascribe to Marxists usually aren't consistent with their myriad beliefs.
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jlmann

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #27 on: July 07, 2017, 04:39:15 PM »
yeah id agree- an astute sociological and economic observer as much as anything

but hard to say he's not a critic of capitalism, particularly the unadulterated version favored by libertarians

Adam White

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #28 on: July 07, 2017, 05:49:31 PM »
yeah id agree- an astute sociological and economic observer as much as anything

but hard to say he's not a critic of capitalism, particularly the unadulterated version favored by libertarians

Yes, definitely a critic of capitalism. And a guy who (apparently) made a bit of money on the stock market!

The idea of privatizing the FDA is ludicrous.

“If you're going to play it out of tune, then play it out of tune properly.”

fieldafm

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Re: Bold City Taproom (Roselle) Closed
« Reply #29 on: July 07, 2017, 07:27:27 PM »
Quote
So, apparently the brewery were at fault. And it was a fire safety issue. Damn government!

I know, right?!?  I mean, yoga presents a serious fire hazard... much more so than brewing or serving beer (both uses they are allowed to do based on their zoning). Thank the Good Lord in Heaven that the government saved those limber hippies from the evil, reckless brewery owners trying to take advantage of their admittedly hazy judgement while in a Zen-like state of mind, from sure fire death.


^^That's sarcasm, in case you didn't pick it up.

I picked it up.

Apparently, having groups of people assemble in a building requires fire alarms and lighted exits. It's about the number of people, not the activity. But I'm sure you knew that.

Because two dozen people 'assembling' to do yoga and then purchasing beer, is somehow more of a fire hazard then 30 people 'incidentally' traveling to said location to purchase beer... or 9 people 'primarily' making beer in said location? Interesting interpretation of fire safety.


BTW, you're talking to someone that once had to pay the fire marshall $2,000 to have a couple of 'trained professionals' stand around for 6 hours to make sure no one caught fire in a building that had the correct number of fire exits and lighted fire signs per code. If they weren't 'government officials concerned about safety',,, that would be called extortion in the real world.


Additionally, this rash of incidents is not just confined to Bold City Brewery and CORK. Over the past month, the neighborhoods of North Riverside, Durkeeville, Brooklyn and Mixontown have been hit with these same 'sudden' fire safety violations. In fact, several buildings have come down as a result. The TU, Daily Record, etc haven't picked up on this.. but its been happening. That kind of 'coincidence' tends to raise an eyebrow to the discerning type of individual.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2017, 07:39:43 PM by fieldafm »