Elements of Urbanism: Buffalo

[civil42806]

Have some friends that live in Buffalo, unfortunately the city itself is dying a slow death over the decades.  burbs are still doing somewhat well. 

[Jason]

Thanks for the info guys.

Looks like an awefully large building for a city the size of Buffalo.  Jax could go for that much square footage to consolidate everything though.

[thelakelander]

Buffalo had 573,076 residents when the building was under construction in 1930.  The city peaked with 580,132 residents.  Today, Buffalo is down to 272,632 and continuing to lose residents.  So that city hall was definately built for a larger progressive community. 

Buffalo City Hall history: http://www.ci.buffalo.ny.us/home/leadership/mayor/cityhallhistory#prelude

[civil42806]

Buffalo had 573,076 residents when the building was under construction in 1930.  The city peaked with 580,132 residents.  Today, Buffalo is down to 272,632 and continuing to lose residents.  So that city hall was definately built for a larger progressive community. 

Buffalo City Hall history: http://www.ci.buffalo.ny.us/home/leadership/mayor/cityhallhistory#prelude

I love that "built for a larger progressive community."  To quote quark yet again what exactly does that mean.  It was built for a larger city whether it was particularly progressive I don't know. 

[civil42806]

Though I will say it is a spectacular building, and I wish we had it in jax.  I always look at the old Jax city hall and just shake my head what a beautiful building

[thelakelander]

Definition of Progress

headway; forward movement; development; advancement

http://www.english-test.net/toeic/vocabulary/words/065/toeic-definitions.php#progress

During the era the Buffalo City Hall was constructed, the city had grown a healthy 13.1%, adding 66,301 residents over a ten year period.  It also was a large port city, due to its location at the mouth of the Erie Canal.  It was the largest grain-milling center in America, had one of the largest steel mills in the country, was a major railroad hub, ethnically diverse, and the 13th largest American city, in terms of population.  What if it wasn't progressive during that era, then what was it?

[civil42806]

Definition of Progress

headway; forward movement; development; advancement

http://www.english-test.net/toeic/vocabulary/words/065/toeic-definitions.php#progress

During the era the Buffalo City Hall was constructed, the city had grown a healthy 13.1%, adding 66,301 residents over a ten year period.  It also was a large port city, due to its location at the mouth of the Erie Canal.  It was the largest grain-milling center in America, had one of the largest steel mills in the country, was a major railroad hub, ethnically diverse, and the 13th largest American city, in terms of population.  What if it wasn't progressive during that era, then what was it?

A typical aggressive capitalistic town, with people trying to make as much money as possible.  I'm sorry if I misinterperted your comments, I thought when you used the term progressive, I thought you meant it in the modern terms.

[thelakelander]

Sorry, but I did not mean progressive in terms of how we define the term from a political viewpoint.

[civil42806]

Sorry, but I did not mean progressive in terms of how we define the term from a political viewpoint.

Again my apologies

[GatorDone]

Buffalo looks like a city that is very similar to Jax with the river splitting it up. My guess is that it is also spread out. How well used is their train system, seems like if one works in Buffalo, it would work in Jax.

[thelakelander]

Buffalo sits on Lake Erie.  There is a river just south of downtown, but most of the city lies to the north of it.  Buffalo has a single 6.4-mile light rail line (opened in 1985) that runs from downtown to University at Buffalo. 





In downtown, 1.2 miles of the line run on an at-grade pedestrian mall.  There is no charge to ride the downtown section (7 stations).  The rest (5.2 miles) acts as a subway, running under Main Street.  A one-way ticket costs $1.50 for the subway section. The entire line has 15 stations and carries 23,200 riders a day.  By comparison, our skyway is 2.5 miles, carrying less than 3,000 riders a day.



There's also a proposal to expand the line to the south to connect with a casino under construction and to create land for transit oriented development.

[RiversideGator]

Who wouldnt trade our Skyway for their light rail line?   

[Ocklawaha]

This one is rare compatriot River, a one-of-a-kind system in Buffalo, trade? I WOULDN'T!

While the Skyway is flawed in many ways, BUFFALO shot itself in the foot by digging an un-needed SUBWAY for streetcars. Far worse then JACKSONVILLE they have the distinct record of spending the most money per mile in the history of Light Rail! So guess where the locals got the numbers to stack LRT up to BRT? Oh yeah, Buffalo... Gee, see how much better BRT is? Don't you feel better already? They did EVERYTHING backwards, worse then JTA's worst nightmares... Like a one lane Buckman Bridge to hell. Building Subway in the Burbs and surface LRT downtown where street congestion is worse, is bass-ackward.

We really need streetcar, and a economy model to finish the Skyway. In the end I think our Skyway will become our own SUBWAY. A trunk line unhindered by traffic. The streetcar, LRT, BRT, Bus, Waterway, and Commuter Rail will feed the Skyway.

Buffalo's transit motto could be "Where a Streetcar cost more then heavy rail!" Only in Buffalo.

OCKLAWAHA

[ProjectMaximus]

whats the dynamic like with Rochester? A similar-sized city with a stronger economy just an hour away...is there much cross-traffic between the cities?

[Ocklawaha]

Thanks for the info guys.

Looks like an awefully large building for a city the size of Buffalo.  Jax could go for that much square footage to consolidate everything though.

But Jason, we'd screw it up. First to make sure it was not steel, we'd have gate cpncrete construction throughout. Then it would only be 2 floors high and 15 square blocks in size. Not to mention the trailers we'd push into the parking lot when oversight discovered we left out 3 departments when they tore down the St. James building... Just us, being us I guess.

I'm still trying to figure out a way to steel frame a cage that would hold double wide portables, stacked one over the other, perhaps 40 floors high. Now THAT would be a classic Jacksonville building!

OCKLAWAHA