Author Topic: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy  (Read 65728 times)

Shwaz

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #30 on: December 10, 2014, 03:16:39 PM »
I just don't see why we're tearing down a 70 year old building (roughly the same age as the older crop of structures in R/A when RAP was formed) instead of encouraging reuse?

From what I've heard, the structure in it's current condition would need over $1M in work just to meet code. I live a couple blocks away and it really does look likes it's in bad shape.

The plan proposed looks nice and would certainly be an improvement.... but I'll always miss cheap pool & pitchers of Rolling Rock :( 

That new construction will cost that much. That, and it's a historic district, cost shouldn't be the only concern anyway.

Then why didn't Taps continue with their construction plans? Notice how the building was torn apart, inspected and then abandoned? I'm all for preservation but waiting for the right investor may never end.

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Shwaz

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #31 on: December 10, 2014, 03:18:55 PM »
My only gripe would be the windows, which is the only good point Crowe makes.

Other than that: its built to the street, has parking in the back and covered outdoor seating. Looks pretty 'urban' to me. The rest of the aesthetics nuances would be nit-picky.

In the rendering it appears the architecture is similar to the Orsay building and looks comparable to what MM built. Both of which are fine by me :)
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thelakelander

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #32 on: December 10, 2014, 04:23:28 PM »
I'm really starting to take issue with the near-wholesale exclusion of commercial structures from the R/A and Springfield overlays. Respectfully, someone screwed the pooch.

The building was constructed in 1950 after the historic district's period of significance (1909-1936) and was identified as having no historic significance under the National Register criteria.

http://www.coj.net/departments/planning-and-development/docs/historic/historic-preservation-guidelines-for-riverside---a.aspx (page 13 in link)

It was built in 1948, and is now older than a 1936 structure was at the time the R/A overlay was enacted, Lake. It's a 70 year old building, why not do an adaptive (not even THAT adaptive...it was already a restaurant and has the floor space for it) reuse? And for the record, sorry to be the lone voice of dissent here, but that rendering on the new one looks like it belongs in front of a strip mall on the southside.

No need to apologize. Personally, in this particular case, I don't have a strong opinion either way.  I just figured it was worth sharing with everyone since the COA meeting was coming up and I hadn't heard anything about the project elsewhere.
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jcjohnpaint

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #33 on: December 10, 2014, 08:19:52 PM »
I live in this neighborhood.  I just heard about this today from MJ (as usual).  I have until 3 to respond.  I work until 7 tonight.  This gentleman (who does not live in this neighborhood, but seems to represents us)... was notified of this news so early to consult his family and craft a letter... I say this property looks like shit and I say... let this happen... it is better than what it is (by far).  But hell, I am only a person living in the neighborhood.  What the hell do I know. 

BD51

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #34 on: December 10, 2014, 09:26:19 PM »
Not a fan of the new design...looks like it could be placed as an outparcel in Fleming Island where the operator's other restaurant apparently is.  The existing structure is not necessarily worth saving, though.

This is a new proposal. Different operator than Taps from Fleming Island. I don't think Taps would have been able to compete in R/A to be honest.

This is a new concept from the owner of Taps.

bencrix

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #35 on: December 11, 2014, 08:37:57 AM »
I live about 1.5 blocks away. The comments on design are welcome. I echo the aesthetic reservations voiced above and in the letter, while acknowledging that my opinion is subjective. As for the attempts to micro-manage / blow-up the business plan via the specter of a parking crisis (sigh), here we go again... 

ChriswUfGator

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #36 on: December 11, 2014, 09:07:18 AM »
To clarify, my only issue is I'd like to see an older building reused rather than demolished. The parking issue to me seems like focusing on the wrong thing. This neighborhood was designed originally with a streetcar circulator integral to it, and we've removed that. Now that it's finally reaching the point in economic growth where it was when that was in place, you're going to have to address transit. Parking is a symptom, not the problem, and stifling economic growth is not the cure.


thelakelander

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #37 on: December 11, 2014, 09:13:40 AM »
I believe the COA was approved, with conditions, yesterday.
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camarocane

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #38 on: December 11, 2014, 09:19:36 AM »
To clarify, my only issue is I'd like to see an older building reused rather than demolished.

I'm with you 100%, even moreso with that particular building (my uncle operate a restaurant there in the early 80 and parents ate there the night I was born). However when the actual structure is stifling growth, it needs to go.

JHAT76

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #39 on: December 11, 2014, 10:31:21 AM »
I live about 1.5 blocks away. The comments on design are welcome. I echo the aesthetic reservations voiced above and in the letter, while acknowledging that my opinion is subjective. As for the attempts to micro-manage / blow-up the business plan via the specter of a parking crisis (sigh), here we go again...

Although to be fair.  When there was a workout/gym facility in that strip across from this location the parking on Dancy Wes / Northwest of Park was a mess.  Although I favor creative solutions over denying a new restaurant.

Live_Oak

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #40 on: December 11, 2014, 10:46:17 AM »
There really shouldn't be any parking crisis. There is an on site parking lot which will have 32 parking spaces.

ben says

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #41 on: December 11, 2014, 01:25:03 PM »
To clarify, my only issue is I'd like to see an older building reused rather than demolished. The parking issue to me seems like focusing on the wrong thing. This neighborhood was designed originally with a streetcar circulator integral to it, and we've removed that. Now that it's finally reaching the point in economic growth where it was when that was in place, you're going to have to address transit. Parking is a symptom, not the problem, and stifling economic growth is not the cure.

Per usual, agree w/ Chris.
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Dog Walker

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #42 on: December 11, 2014, 03:39:21 PM »
We REALLY, REALLY need to put streetcars back in R/A & Murry Hill.

They could also buy and tear down that trashy building across the street.

39 spaces X 3 people per car avg. = 117 people.  How many seats are they going to have?
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Josh

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #43 on: December 11, 2014, 04:17:04 PM »
3 people per car average? Where does that come from?

Know Growth

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Re: New Avondale Restaurant Proposed: Not Everyone Happy
« Reply #44 on: December 11, 2014, 07:19:17 PM »
Thad Crowe ("Palatka")

Susan Fraser ("Clay County")  (Mello Mello Mushroom,WLA,et al)

All the while,residing here,a best place. Takes the heat off Dr. Wood,not that pressure must be relieved.

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« Last Edit: December 11, 2014, 07:24:43 PM by Know Growth »