Author Topic: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center  (Read 13153 times)

thelakelander

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #15 on: December 03, 2014, 05:39:14 PM »
Question - why couldn't this deveopment been done at Regency Square ?  It's only 3 miles away and access is 1000 times better than the Atlantic North development ?? I know the mall is outdated but the property is already more shopper friendly than Atlantic North plus several anchor stores are already there ?  Tear the mall down and redevelop the property

Blame Regency's former owner. They made a decision to not invest in what they determined was an underperforming asset and eventually got rid of it. While no investment was made in Regency, the market and demographics around it continued to change and other firms have taken advantage of it.
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thelakelander

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #16 on: December 03, 2014, 05:41:31 PM »

The question now is, what is next for Atlantic North after Belk opens?

I'd look no further than Regency and the older strip malls surrounding it, further down on Atlantic. Any chain making a decision to reinvest or upgrade in an area store, would probably evaluate shifting to a newer location with more favorable demographics. In the case of Regency, Belk's departure will cause some retailers in the east mall to consider leaving as well.
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spuwho

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #17 on: December 03, 2014, 07:21:32 PM »

The question now is, what is next for Atlantic North after Belk opens?

I'd look no further than Regency and the older strip malls surrounding it, further down on Atlantic. Any chain making a decision to reinvest or upgrade in an area store, would probably evaluate shifting to a newer location with more favorable demographics. In the case of Regency, Belk's departure will cause some retailers in the east mall to consider leaving as well.

A major difference is that Belk leases its space at Regency. Sears and JC Penney own their buildings outright.  JC Penney in fact stayed put (they owned the building as well) when Palm Center was torn down. The new developer ended up building a whole new facility around it.

However, I remember driving by Randall Park Mall outside Cleveland and Macy's, owning their building were the only store open...period. The rest of the mall was completely dead. The surrounding stores around the mall were all closed and shuttered. They were like an island in a retail desert.

At least Regency still has new tenant activity on the surrounding properties. Best Bet, Jacksonville Chrysler, Kendalltown, etc. all keep the area vibrant and present new opportunities.

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #18 on: December 03, 2014, 07:51:06 PM »
The decisions of the "free" market are never to be questioned.

Generally, when you run a business... you have to make make more than you spend. Closing an underperforming store and opening a new location on a site with better demographics makes perfect sense.

Especially when it's the public at large who are footing the bill for the externalities.

The is the best we're going to get in Jacksonville, with our spineless City Council and brainless Transportation Authority (...and I don't mean 100% of you, but you know who you are). The flip side is Finehoe's utopian socialist model where instead of the public contributing some breaks and infrastructure, they build the whole faceless and nameless big box, hire 2,000 employees (none of which have to really work) and bring customer service to a new epic fail. Socialism does work, works well, works 100% of the time, and actually thrives... until they run out of other peoples money!

thelakelander

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #19 on: December 03, 2014, 08:01:18 PM »

The question now is, what is next for Atlantic North after Belk opens?

I'd look no further than Regency and the older strip malls surrounding it, further down on Atlantic. Any chain making a decision to reinvest or upgrade in an area store, would probably evaluate shifting to a newer location with more favorable demographics. In the case of Regency, Belk's departure will cause some retailers in the east mall to consider leaving as well.

A major difference is that Belk leases its space at Regency. Sears and JC Penney own their buildings outright.  JC Penney in fact stayed put (they owned the building as well) when Palm Center was torn down. The new developer ended up building a whole new facility around it.

I fear both JCPenney and Sears won't be around as chains long term. Not just for Regency's sake but malls all over the country.

Quote
However, I remember driving by Randall Park Mall outside Cleveland and Macy's, owning their building were the only store open...period. The rest of the mall was completely dead. The surrounding stores around the mall were all closed and shuttered. They were like an island in a retail desert.

Reminds me of Winter Haven Mall in my hometown. In 1996, a new mall opened and the Byron's chain closed, leaving Winter Haven Mall with Burdines as the only anchor.  The mall's specialty shops quickly closed with no additional anchors to generate foot traffic their way. A few years later, a new developer purchased the property and tore down everything except Burdines, which had become a Macy's. They lured Belk from a nearby strip mall, got Macy's to expand and filled the rest of the old mall site with a Lowe's, a power center, and a few restaurant outparcels.

Winter Haven Mall - 1994


Citi Centre - 2014 (Mall torn down in 2000)


The old Macy's mall entrance.
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brainstormer

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #20 on: December 03, 2014, 08:26:13 PM »
Uninspiring. Meh. Jacksonville's zoning and development requirements suck. Period. I mean, the least we could have required was that there was a sidewalk connecting the apartments to the retail. But then again, we don't even require sidewalks in new subdivisions. We live in a fat-ass country because of shit like this. And then we wonder why we have some of the highest pedestrian death rates in the nation.

spuwho

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #21 on: December 03, 2014, 09:15:41 PM »
Uninspiring. Meh. Jacksonville's zoning and development requirements suck. Period. I mean, the least we could have required was that there was a sidewalk connecting the apartments to the retail. But then again, we don't even require sidewalks in new subdivisions. We live in a fat-ass country because of shit like this. And then we wonder why we have some of the highest pedestrian death rates in the nation.

Not just Jacksonville....look at those pictures Lake posted. I don't see many sidewalks on those side streets there either.

thelakelander

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #22 on: December 03, 2014, 09:38:15 PM »
Yes, not just Jacksonville. Many cities across the country have land use policies in place that treat the pedestrian as a second class citizen.  In recent years, several cities have modified their regulations to lay the ground work for a better future development pattern. I hope Jacksonville will one day as well. 

In Winter Haven's case, this shopping center is roughly six blocks south of downtown.  You can't see it on the aerials above (you'd have to zoom in) but the city recently reduced a stretch of SW 3rd Street from 4 to 2 lanes. With the extra right-of-way, they added a share use path that connects the shopping center to the heart of downtown. That path is intended to eventually connect with a network of citywide shared use paths that will then connect into a network of paths spanning Central Florida from coast to coast.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2014, 09:42:22 PM by thelakelander »
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vicupstate

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2014, 08:40:08 AM »
The decisions of the "free" market are never to be questioned.

Generally, when you run a business... you have to make make more than you spend. Closing an underperforming store and opening a new location on a site with better demographics makes perfect sense.

Especially when it's the public at large who are footing the bill for the externalities.

The is the best we're going to get in Jacksonville, with our spineless City Council and brainless Transportation Authority (...and I don't mean 100% of you, but you know who you are). The flip side is Finehoe's utopian socialist model where instead of the public contributing some breaks and infrastructure, they build the whole faceless and nameless big box, hire 2,000 employees (none of which have to really work) and bring customer service to a new epic fail. Socialism does work, works well, works 100% of the time, and actually thrives... until they run out of other peoples money!

I don't know any socialist countries that own department stores or for that matter any product distribution other than the social safety net.  Stop listening to Rush.
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fsujax

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2014, 06:21:40 PM »
The only thing that might would save Regency would be to lure a Macy's there. Not sure it would ever happen, but a redeveloped Regency and a Macy's could do the trick.

I-10east

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Re: Atlantic North: Jacksonville's Next Major Retail Center
« Reply #25 on: December 05, 2014, 10:06:33 PM »
I fear both JCPenney and Sears won't be around as chains long term. Not just for Regency's sake but malls all over the country.

Almost on cue with Sears.

http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/blog/morning-edition/2014/12/up-to-speed-sears-announces-235-stores-to-close-as.html