Author Topic: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax  (Read 19126 times)

exnewsman

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #30 on: March 27, 2014, 06:44:26 PM »
If you take a look a the BJP projects - all of the JTA projects were on time and at budget. We know with the courthouse debacle - that cannot be said about COJ.

JTA blew their chance at $100 million in BJP funds for rapid transit by taking to long to utilize the money.  That cash ended up helping cover the cost of the courthouse.  That was a major black eye in my book.

Lake - I do agree that the delays opened the door for COJ to come along and redistribute those funds. But it still shouldn't have happened. Any more than it should have cost taxpayers $390M for a new courthouse.

dougskiles

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #31 on: March 27, 2014, 08:27:11 PM »
My observation has been that transit suffered greatly when they were in heavy road building mode.  I don't doubt that they did a good job with the BJP projects.  If they are going to continue as a road building agency, then perhaps it is time to create a separate transit agency.

As long as they are a road building agency their focus will be chasing road dollars, at the expense of possible transit funding.

Also a different administration too. Nat Ford has more of a transit background and it seems that he gets the need to make the improvements in the transit system. Unless there is another BJP that comes along, I don't see the JTA working on 30+ road/bridge projects. There just won't be funding for that. There needs to be a better balance of roads and transit. Don't think you can drop either one and be successful. The two must work together.

If you're talking about a balance between roads and transit, then we wouldn't spend another dime on a road project for the next 30 years while transit plays catchup.

spuwho

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #32 on: March 27, 2014, 10:03:59 PM »
6 cents per gallon on auto gas/diesel
10 cents per gallon on commercial diesel (yes they can tell)
1.25% sales tax
5 cents per kwh for charging stations
2 cents per therm for auto LNG
raise plate renewals by GVWR $30 for autos/residential trucks, by $100 per plate for commercial under 10,000, by $200 commercial over 10,000
15% of aggregate revenue must supply transit capital funding (which will be matched 80% by federal funding)
5% of aggregate revenue must support the fare box

Acceptance of this is dependent on COJ imposing a UPL (Urban Planning Line) to increase area density and provide long term fare box support. And then impose a moratorium on development outside the UPL for a minimum of 10 years. After 10 years they can reassess the capital funding percentage model.

While I agree with Joost that long term road funding using gas taxes is a dead end in the long term, there are still cars and trucks using them and they must still be maintained.

Transit is important, but it can't develop in a vacuum when the city fathers keep allowing the development borders to stretch out further. Hence the UPL to control sprawl until the new transit system is planned, ready and executed.


mtraininjax

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #33 on: March 28, 2014, 07:41:10 AM »
Has anyone seen Councilman Joost's follow-up? Or is this just a big steamy one-time pile?
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urbanlibertarian

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #34 on: May 27, 2014, 01:49:24 PM »
Gulliford and Joost do a Point/Counter-point style dueling columns debate at:

http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/
Sed quis custodiet ipsos cutodes (Who watches the watchmen?)

Tacachale

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #35 on: May 27, 2014, 02:36:23 PM »
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=543017 and http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=543018

Once again, Joost makes some very good points, but without offering any realistic alternatives it's not very convincing.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

spuwho

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #36 on: May 27, 2014, 07:54:42 PM »
Interesting story in the T-U today about people in Jacksonville still driving public dirt streets.

One has been protesting to the city since consolidation!

It does seem weird to me that in a city this big we still have dirt streets inside the metro area.

Perhaps another case for urban infill. Finish paving those streets they have been ignoring since 1968!


spuwho

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #37 on: May 27, 2014, 08:30:41 PM »
Odd.

The council voted 16-1 to extend the tax as is until 2036.

No debate was offered.  Joost was lone vote against.

via :Jax Record

http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=543022

City Council passes gas-tax extension with no debate

Tuesday, May 27, 7:14 PM EDT

By David Chapman, Staff Writer
After five months of discussion and debate, City Council passed a bill extending the 6-cent gas tax through 2036.

The 16-1 vote came after more than a dozen people, including U.S. Rep. Corrine Brown and former Mayor Jake Godbold, spoke on the issue.

But after the public comment period ended, it went straight to the ballot – no council members spoke up on the matter. That included Stephen Joost, who has been a vocal opponent and cast the lone nay vote, and council President Bill Gulliford, who introduced it in December and had been the most vocal supporter.

Afterward, Gulliford said he had pages of comments on the issue if anyone was interested, but it wasn’t necessary.

Under the extension, the Jacksonville Transportation Authority will receive 5 cents of the tax, which will be applied toward transit operations and debt repayment. The remaining 1 cent would go to the city for road maintenance and bike and pedestrian infrastructure.

Authority officials have said it will bond about $100 million to start and complete a collection of road projects, with the debt repaid gradually through collection of the tax. The tax raises about $28 million a year.

Projects encompass all areas of the county on the list of road and transportation projects that was compiled in recent months between the authority and city Public Works Department.

Gulliford and other proponents have said the bill will create jobs at a time when labor and interest rates are low. Joost and opponents said extending the tax this soon wasn’t necessary, given that is a dwindling revenue source as alternative fuel use and efficiencies rise. The tax is scheduled to end in 2016.

The bill now goes to another vocal opponent: Mayor Alvin Brown.

Brown for some time has said he is against extending the tax, which falls in line with his anti-tax stance.

David DeCamp, Brown’s spokesman, said as with any piece of legislation, the administration will review it in full before any determination is made.

Brown could sign the legislation, let it pass into law without his signature or veto the measure. If he did the latter, the council would need 13 votes to override that veto.

Badfinger

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #38 on: May 28, 2014, 07:24:56 AM »
Odd.

The council voted 16-1 to extend the tax as is until 2036.

No debate was offered.  Joost was lone vote against.

via :Jax Record

http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=543022

City Council passes gas-tax extension with no debate

Tuesday, May 27, 7:14 PM EDT

By David Chapman, Staff WriterJ
After five months of discussion and debate, City Council passed a bill extending the 6-cent gas tax through 2036.

The 16-1 vote came after more than a dozen people, including U.S. Rep. Corrine Brown and former Mayor Jake Godbold, spoke on the issue.

But after the public comment period ended, it went straight to the ballot – no council members spoke up on the matter. That included Stephen Joost, who has been a vocal opponent and cast the lone nay vote, and council President Bill Gulliford, who introduced it in December and had been the most vocal supporter.

Afterward, Gulliford said he had pages of comments on the issue if anyone was interested, but it wasn’t necessary.

Under the extension, the Jacksonville Transportation Authority will receive 5 cents of the tax, which will be applied toward transit operations and debt repayment. The remaining 1 cent would go to the city for road maintenance and bike and pedestrian infrastructure.

Authority officials have said it will bond about $100 million to start and complete a collection of road projects, with the debt repaid gradually through collection of the tax. The tax raises about $28 million a year.

Projects encompass all areas of the county on the list of road and transportation projects that was compiled in recent months between the authority and city Public Works Department.

Gulliford and other proponents have said the bill will create jobs at a time when labor and interest rates are low. Joost and opponents said extending the tax this soon wasn’t necessary, given that is a dwindling revenue source as alternative fuel use and efficiencies rise. The tax is scheduled to end in 2016.

The bill now goes to another vocal opponent: Mayor Alvin Brown.

Brown for some time has said he is against extending the tax, which falls in line with his anti-tax stance.

David DeCamp, Brown’s spokesman, said as with any piece of legislation, the administration will review it in full before any determination is made.

Brown could sign the legislation, let it pass into law without his signature or veto the measure. If he did the latter, the council would need 13 votes to override that veto.
This is a pretty big loss for Joost as he was the only NO vote and he was so public in his opposition to the gas tax extension.  Many questioned his motives and some even thought that he was making his arguments on behalf of Mayor Brown.

Regardless, after last night he now becomes one of if not the least relevent members of the City Council.

spuwho

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #39 on: May 28, 2014, 08:22:32 AM »
I would say less relevant is a little extreme.

He was only against extension in its current form. Not against taxes period.

Kudos for having the guts to vote no when everyone wanted status quo.

Me thinks Brown will let it pass by ignoring it. He knows a veto can get out voted at this point.

It's too bad the council was more worried about expedience than the future.

However since we treat the mobility plan with such disregard, there is nothing a future council couldn't do to unwind this and start over.

fieldafm

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #40 on: May 28, 2014, 08:51:59 AM »
Quote
However since we treat the mobility plan with such disregard, there is nothing a future council couldn't do to unwind this and start over.

It's a little more difficult to bond out construction projects and then take away the funding source that pays for that bond debt.

spuwho

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #41 on: May 28, 2014, 09:44:15 AM »
Quote
However since we treat the mobility plan with such disregard, there is nothing a future council couldn't do to unwind this and start over.

It's a little more difficult to bond out construction projects and then take away the funding source that pays for that bond debt.

I wasn't thinking of elimination per se. I was thinking you can refinance the bonds and use them for other purposes. Change the priority of the delivery of certain items. You can change the revenue mix from strictly a gas tax to other things.

That is what I was thinking of. Happens all the time across the country.

BoldBoyOfTheSouth

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #42 on: May 28, 2014, 11:29:53 AM »
Extention of the gas tax and the one cent a gallon going toward bicycle and pedestrian infrustruture safety improvments is prudent and fiscally responsible and will help out city get away from being one of the most dangerous and deadly cities in the United States for pedestrians and cyclists.

tufsu1

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #43 on: May 28, 2014, 12:49:16 PM »
Extention of the gas tax and the one cent a gallon going toward bicycle and pedestrian infrustruture safety improvments is prudent and fiscally responsible and will help out city get away from being one of the most dangerous and deadly cities in the United States for pedestrians and cyclists.

FYI...the 1 cent goes to the City...and 20% of that goes to bike/ped improvements

Badfinger

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Re: Councilman Joost: Why I Oppose Extending the Gas Tax
« Reply #44 on: May 28, 2014, 03:01:17 PM »
I would say less relevant is a little extreme.

He was only against extension in its current form. Not against taxes period.

Kudos for having the guts to vote no when everyone wanted status quo.

Me thinks Brown will let it pass by ignoring it. He knows a veto can get out voted at this point.

It's too bad the council was more worried about expedience than the future.

However since we treat the mobility plan with such disregard, there is nothing a future council couldn't do to unwind this and start over.
Actually it is less extreme than what some of Joost's colleagues where saying privately after the vote. 

Let's just say, if you spend two months on the stump, write editorials and do several television and radio appearances and persuade no one who has a vote to follow you, then yes your relevancy will be questioned.