Author Topic: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?  (Read 233679 times)

IrvAdams

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #255 on: March 13, 2014, 09:27:26 AM »
I could be wrong but I don't believe trucks can legally set up and serve on public streets. If CM Brown wants regulations for further clarity, the legislation should allow them to under certain circumstances.

Lake,

This specific restriction was mentioned and talked about at yesterday's committee meeting with the FT operators; it spawned some good ideas and further discussion from both sides. Details have not been worked out yet.
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Keith-N-Jax

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #256 on: March 13, 2014, 10:07:26 AM »
Some problems are unique, and thus cannot be solved by 100 % reliance on history.  Besides, the evidence you speak of, or the absence of it, is perhaps vague at most, and certainly is not recorded with the accuracy as presented in rigid experiments.  I hesitate to rely excessively on statements such as "there is no evidence".

This should become Jacksonville's motto.  It's a great line of thought for why we keep shooting ourselves in the foot.



Post of the day!!

IrvAdams

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #257 on: March 13, 2014, 11:04:52 AM »
“He who controls others may be powerful, but he who has mastered himself is mightier still”
- Lao Tzu

Lunican

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #258 on: March 13, 2014, 01:28:07 PM »
Quote
Today, Brown and at least 25 others will review the draft ordinance line by line — adding parts here, crossing out parts there — to craft what he calls “landmark legislation” on the issue.

So 25 downtown business owners were dealing with this tedium instead of running their businesses.

BridgeTroll

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #259 on: March 13, 2014, 02:00:42 PM »
Quote
Today, Brown and at least 25 others will review the draft ordinance line by line — adding parts here, crossing out parts there — to craft what he calls “landmark legislation” on the issue.

So 25 downtown business owners were dealing with this tedium instead of running their businesses.

yes.  welcome to a repeat of SPAR's nuclear annihilation of Main Street
Think of it as... regulations to promote vibrancy and infill...
In a boat at sea one of the men began to bore a hole in the bottom of the boat. On being remonstrating with, he answered, "I am only boring under my own seat." "Yes," said his companions, "but when the sea rushes in we shall all be drowned with you."

tufsu1

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #260 on: March 13, 2014, 02:54:20 PM »
Quote
Today, Brown and at least 25 others will review the draft ordinance line by line — adding parts here, crossing out parts there — to craft what he calls “landmark legislation” on the issue.

So 25 downtown business owners were dealing with this tedium instead of running their businesses.

actually many of those are food truck people

BridgeTroll

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #261 on: March 13, 2014, 03:02:30 PM »
Quote
Today, Brown and at least 25 others will review the draft ordinance line by line — adding parts here, crossing out parts there — to craft what he calls “landmark legislation” on the issue.

So 25 downtown business owners were dealing with this tedium instead of running their businesses.

actually many of those are food truck people

No doubt... I am sure they would rather be stealing other peoples customers...
In a boat at sea one of the men began to bore a hole in the bottom of the boat. On being remonstrating with, he answered, "I am only boring under my own seat." "Yes," said his companions, "but when the sea rushes in we shall all be drowned with you."

thelakelander

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #262 on: March 13, 2014, 03:35:06 PM »
Unfortunately, they're almost forced to be there instead of work.  If someone is actively trying to create legislation to harm the thing that keeps your lights on, food on your table, and a roof over your family's head, one of the best things you can do is to attempt to have a seat at the discussion/lobbying table before shit hits the fan.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

ronchamblin

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #263 on: March 13, 2014, 09:14:33 PM »
Bill Gulliford's comments about the food truck issue allows me to understand that he is more of a politician than I had suspected -- a typical politician .... which disappoints me.  I was hoping for a tendency to leadership, and not to political show.

In any case, I can see that most everyone is against almost everything I say regarding the food truck issue.  A momentum of emotion ... a crowd mentality ...   has shaped a solid front against anything I say.  I find it difficult to understand how can so many people be wrong. ;D

Many seem to assume I am against food trucks in general, even though I've attempted to clarify that I am only concerned about the quantities, locations, and hours in the core -- along with the solution as to restrooms. 

I will rest, so I can determine how best to proceed in my effort to enlighten these emotional individuals to my actual position on the food truck issue.

thelakelander

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #264 on: March 13, 2014, 09:43:19 PM »
^I don't see your argument as against food trucks.  To me, it comes off more as a lack of understanding how the dynamics of urban revitalization works and being in close contact with neighboring B&M restaurant owners who fear consumers having more choices in downtown of where they can spent their money at.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

Keith-N-Jax

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #265 on: March 13, 2014, 10:26:31 PM »
I will rest, so I can determine how best to proceed in my effort to enlighten these emotional individuals to my actual position on the food truck issue.

What are you, the elf lady from Lord of the rings?

ssky

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #266 on: March 14, 2014, 12:55:34 AM »
What are you, the elf lady from Lord of the rings?

No...he's Yoda.

"Rest I need. Yes, rest."

ronchamblin

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #267 on: March 14, 2014, 12:57:59 AM »
I never saw the film or films.  Hope these are good creatures.

ronchamblin

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #268 on: March 14, 2014, 01:00:25 AM »
Actually I meant .. rest my case.

 



ronchamblin

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Re: Food Trucks To Be Legislated Out of Existence?
« Reply #269 on: March 14, 2014, 02:48:58 AM »
From BT .. (the green type)

Lol... sorry Ron... unlike most I try to limit my "online" life.  I much prefer face to face interaction and therefore turn off devices at various times.

Don't know who you are.  That's good, as my ignorance allows focus only on the ideas at hand.

The answer to your question is of course ...True.  Of course this answer literally has nothing to do with "Mobile food vendors".  These vendors are a part of life in every city around the world.  They add vibrancy... they add choice... they add competition... they add employment... they add a touch of creativeness and whimsy not otherwise found during our dreary boring workdays.

Thank you BT.  We have your agreement so far on the first point.  You did say ... "true".  So, let's move on to the next objective, which is to get you to admit that the food trucks are very much related to the first point.

Your comment saying that "These venders are a part of life in every city gourd the world." is very true.  And ... as you say, they do add vibrancy, choice, competition, employment, creativity, in an otherwise boring environment in which we work. I totally agree with all of what you are saying.  But there is more to the story ... and that "more", will show you that the scenario is much like one giving a tasty soup for another to eat.  The one enjoying the soup wants more, all the while not realizing that there is small doses of poison within.  You and others wish to poison, not intentionally, but by ignorance that the soup recipe ... somehow...  has poison within.       

You and others are attempting to legislate against a problem a few seem to percieve but really does not exist.  There is no evidence that I am aware of that shows the trucks are a detriment to business downtown.  In fact... some of the B&Ms downtown seem to embrace and encourage the trucks. 

And me and others wish to enlighten you and others .... so that you can perceive.  It is not as simple as saying that the "trucks are a detriment to business downtown."  Their existence in the core is not the issue, as I actually "want" the trucks in the core.  Again, me and others actually see the benefit to the core by having these trucks.  But the quantities, locations, and the times for their existence "is" the issue.  My objective is to illustrate why I and others hold this opinion.

You have presented theories and lengthy dissertations full of assumptions... but no more.

Call them theories, or lengthy.  Call them assumptions.  The only way I know to have a discussion is to digest the opinions of others, to weigh them, and then to offer ideas for consideration by my fellow debaters.  Should I remain silent?

I think that, although the specific issue on this thread, according to the title, concerns the food trucks -- it concerns much more than some are willing to admit.  I always accept the possibility that I might be wrong in much of what I say.  But I cannot believe I am wrong until somebody can convince me of it by way of sound argument.  To say that I am a fu*kg nut will not do.  To say that I am an idiot will not do.  To ban me from the forum will not do.

My concern is fundamentally the state of the core.  We have all seen ... and let's admit it ... the relative stagnation over recent decades.  The lack of significant movement toward vibrancy means that either it is impossible, or that there exists some fundamental causes -- perhaps habits of thinking by many involved -- for the lack of movement. 

The food truck issue involves more than statements like: "Food Trucks add choice and competition, and satisfy customer demand for variety."  Of course they do.  But there is more to the story.  And that's why I am engaging BT in further discussion. 

Many are saying that freedom for food trucks is what is needed, as we have  a free market economy, and that anyone not wishing freedom for the trucks is simply afraid of competition.  Sounds good .. but is it all good, or is bad mixed within?There is more to it.   

If excessive freedom is given to the food trucks in the core, we will see just one more mistake, as tendered by our city council and mayor .... and by all those wishing for total freedom for the trucks. The mistake will exist via a lack of perception as to the consequences of total freedom.  The mistake will further impede any efforts for progress in the journey to real vibrancy.  The mistake will provide candy for the immediate, but perpetuate a silent and hidden disease over the long run.

But it is not enough to simply say that total unrestrained food trucks in the core would be a mistake.  One must convince others of it, via solid argument.  That is why I began the specific discussion with BT. 

I think that basically, the individuals on both sides of the argument are assuming that their opponents want the extremes of either full freedom, or heavy restrictions.  And these assumptions are causing a rise of emotions, which ultimately tends to impair logic and one's ability to perceive the opponent's position.  As with most things in life, the middle ground is the answer ... moderation is the solution.  There cannot be total freedom, nor can there be total or heavy restrictions. 

I doubt if anyone wants total freedom regarding food truck quantity, locations, and times.  I doubt if anyone wants a total ban of food trucks.  As for me, I "want" food trucks in the core, whether spaced strategically and individually in certain locations, or in "food truck parks".  However, I realize the danger to the core's progress toward revitalization, if we allow excessive freedom to the food trucks.  And this realization is why I engage the subject.

Rest. zzzzzzzzz


   

   
« Last Edit: March 14, 2014, 03:06:13 AM by ronchamblin »