Author Topic: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents  (Read 5031 times)

Metro Jacksonville

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2644
    • MetroJacksonville.com
America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« on: November 07, 2013, 03:01:32 AM »
America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents



America's 100 largest downtowns ranked by residential population. Find out where Jacksonville makes the list.

Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2013-nov-americas-downtowns-ranked-by-number-of-residents

simms3

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3473
  • Time has come
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2013, 03:26:58 AM »
I think it must be pointed out that the following cities are heavily "penalized" by being on or surrounded by large bodies of water:

New York (mainly Lower M)
Chicago
Miami
San Francisco
Seattle

The following cities are also penalized for having relatively TINY downtowns compared to their larger counterparts (very large or massive as in DC, Atlanta, Miami etc):

Lower Manhattan
Center City Philadelphia
Chicago
San Francisco


I think it goes without saying that DC having 173,000 residents within 1 mile of the borders of its expansive downtown is not equivalent to Lower Manhattan having the same downtown population within 1 mile of the borders of its teeny tiny downtown surrounded on 3 sides by water.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2013, 03:39:46 AM by simms3 »
Bothering locals and trolling boards since 2005

simms3

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3473
  • Time has come
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2013, 03:39:10 AM »
By the way the official group's website has maps of lots of the cities (Jax map not yet created) if people are curious about their definitions and what the scope of all the land area is.

http://definingdowntown.org/maps/


Below are some equivalent apples to apples screenshots of what I'm talking about - DC's screenshot is 3 separate CBD areas, but it's clear that DOwntown DC is still HUGE.



Contrast with Philly's - Visible is Center City on right and University City on left, which has something like 119,000 residents around its borders if I recall correctly.

Bothering locals and trolling boards since 2005

simms3

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3473
  • Time has come
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2013, 03:49:14 AM »
You can play around with maps - toggle off layers (I found looking at Downtown in red and +1 mile in blue interesting without Census tract outlines).  I also found it interesting to switch background to Satellite/Earth as opposed to Street - with some cities their density and geographic boundaries become more visible, like the water around Lower Manhattan.
Bothering locals and trolling boards since 2005

jcjohnpaint

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1530
  • Jason John- www.jasonjohnart.com
    • Jason John Website
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2013, 09:43:51 AM »
very interesting.   Thanks for passing on

tufsu1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11412
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2013, 11:13:38 AM »
I think it must be pointed out that the following cities are heavily "penalized" by being on or surrounded by large bodies of water:

New York (mainly Lower M)
Chicago
Miami
San Francisco
Seattle

I would somewhat disagree.  While these downtown may be "limited" by water, it is also a major attrcator for residents.  So, at best it is a wash

JayBird

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1045
  • Back in home state - After living in Jax 10 years
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2013, 04:37:29 PM »
I agree about water being an attraction.

Also, I would think the density of residents per square mile would be more of an asset and informative than the whole number.
Proud supporter of the Jacksonville Jaguars.

"Whenever I’ve been at a decision point, and there was an easy way and a hard way, the hard way always turned out to be the right way." ~Shahid Khan

http://www.facebook.com/jerzbird http://www.twitter.com/JasonBird80

Scrub Palmetto

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2013, 07:50:10 PM »
Since it looks like they just pulled clunky census tract population data from the Census Bureau, that figure definitely includes the Duval County jail, which is, what, 3,000-4,000 people?

JayBird

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1045
  • Back in home state - After living in Jax 10 years
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2013, 08:04:01 PM »
Well the PreTrial Detention Center has a capacity of 2,189 but there is also the Community Corrections Center a few blocks north, don't know that capacity off hand. If that's the case, would also have to include the shelter populations which hover around 1,500
Proud supporter of the Jacksonville Jaguars.

"Whenever I’ve been at a decision point, and there was an easy way and a hard way, the hard way always turned out to be the right way." ~Shahid Khan

http://www.facebook.com/jerzbird http://www.twitter.com/JasonBird80

Scrub Palmetto

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2013, 09:23:56 PM »
I have no idea why, exactly, but the 2010 Census shows a population of 3,740 for the block containing the Pre-Trial Detention Facility (Census Tract 10 - Block 2034, bounded by Liberty, Adams, Marsh, & Bay.) The block containing the Community Corrections Center shows a population of 0. It's possible they use the Pre-Trial Detention Center as an address location on the census for inmates at other facilities, but that's just a guess.

Whether shelter populations should be counted, I couldn't say. They are at least free citizens. Plus, they're more or less a staple in most city centers, so they don't skew comparisons quite as much as a massive jail.

JayBird

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1045
  • Back in home state - After living in Jax 10 years
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2013, 09:30:49 PM »
^ good point about homeless and yes that must be what they do for jail population ... I wonder if they are double counted at their personal residence too, not that 3,000 makes a big difference compared to 850,000
Proud supporter of the Jacksonville Jaguars.

"Whenever I’ve been at a decision point, and there was an easy way and a hard way, the hard way always turned out to be the right way." ~Shahid Khan

http://www.facebook.com/jerzbird http://www.twitter.com/JasonBird80

simms3

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3473
  • Time has come
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2013, 11:14:17 PM »
I agree about water being an attraction.

Also, I would think the density of residents per square mile would be more of an asset and informative than the whole number.

It attracts, but it also limits the land area that can be developed on around a downtown, obviously.  Speaking for San Francisco, most of the waterfront around downtown is either public (the Embarcadero) or office/hotel.  Chicago has lots of residential highrises lining the waterfront, but arguably they'd be there if there were no water just because it's downtown (case in point Atlanta and Denver).  I guess the question becomes would fewer people live in Downtown Chicago if it weren't on the lakefront?  Or would more people live downtown because there would be that much more land available around the commercial cluster to develop on?

You have to assume that if Lake Michigan didn't exist and Chicago were landlocked, then the "appeal" of Lincoln Park to Evanston and points north would be diminished, and perhaps due to traffic and the likelihood of superior parks and public spaces (by virtue of being DT) that downtown could even be more desirable and much more populous than it is now, with more land to develop on in an even pattern in all directions AND fewer outside desirable neighborhoods to compete with.
Bothering locals and trolling boards since 2005

thelakelander

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34794
    • Modern Cities
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2013, 11:38:31 PM »
I don't think Chicago would be half its current size without Lake Michigan and the Chicago River.  That connection was the major reason for the city's growth.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

Tacachale

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8287
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2013, 11:47:34 PM »
^Yeah, it's pretty much the only reason there's a Chicago at all.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

Scrub Palmetto

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
Re: America's Downtowns Ranked by Number of Residents
« Reply #14 on: November 11, 2013, 11:58:47 PM »
Most large cities of any substantial age owe their existence largely to being adjacent to a navigable waterway, some larger than others of course, and it's as impossible to guess what their timelines would have been like had that water never existed as it would be to guess what cities like Denver or Atlanta would be like if large navigable bodies of water existed at their locations as well. I don't really think it can be argued that Chicago suffers a penalty by having the lake right by downtown, as without the lake, it might be penalized with being a metro area of the size and importance of Indianapolis, if it existed at all.