Who was Nathan Bedford Forrest?

[CityLife]

Was NBF ever charged or convicted of a crime?  Isn't this the USA where a man is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law and not in the court of public opinion? 

Fort Pillow took place 6 months prior to the adoption of the First Geneva Convention...so I don't think there were any legal standards to charge people for war crimes at that time.

There are plenty of public figures in history that weren't charged with crimes and aren't worthy of being celebrated...so that's really kind of a worthless point anyways.

[I-10east]

I'm not gonna get into the whole "Forrest name change" debate, but I will say this much; It seems like Southern named buildings, streets etc, that have controversial connotations for whatever reason (racial etc) are quickly denounced, while the Northern counterparts are completely let off the hook, and in some cases it would be blasphemous if anyone speaks out against.

Look at Tom Yawkey, who was a Boston Red Sox executive. He was known for being a racist by many (Jackie Robinson among others) and the Red Sox was the last team to have a black player. What do the ball club do? Name a street in his honor Yawkey Way, right by Fenway Park in one of the most liberal states today. No one says a peek. There are plenty of other examples too. So I'll try to get this through my head; Southern 'accused' racist = bad, Northern 'accused' racist = tolerable, okay...   

[thelakelander]

^I don't think so. Haydon Burns was a racist too and Isiah Hart was a plantation owner with 48 slaves. No one is talking about renaming the Haydon Burns Library or Hart Bridge.

Let's not group "Nathan Bedford Forrest" into the general term of "Southern".  The controversy surrounding this has little to do with South vs North, West or East and more to do with the acts of the guy in question and reason why the place was named after him locally.

[coredumped]

I've heard it said that Andrew Jackson never set foot in Jacksonville (I've not verified that).

Is the reason for renaming this school because there's no ties to him in Jacksonville? By that logic we should rename Jax, and anything in town with "Washington" no?

[Ocklawaha]

And as I've said, I'm a born-and-bred Jacksonvillian and 100% southerner.

Sounds to me like this gentleman is a bit closer to a "galvanized" Yankee to me, y'all.

[Tacachale]

^Sorry Ock, but it's a bit too convenient to paint all the opposition as not being "true Southerners". If "true Southerners" means "people who agree with Ocklawaha on this issue", there's going to be a continually decreasing stock of them.

[coredumped]

And as I've said, I'm a born-and-bred Jacksonvillian and 100% southerner.

Sounds to me like this gentleman is a bit closer to a "galvanized" Yankee to me, y'all.

It's all a LIE! Everyone knows that people from Jacksonville are JAXONs, not "Jacksonvillians!" Grab your pitchforks boys!

[thelakelander]

I've heard it said that Andrew Jackson never set foot in Jacksonville (I've not verified that).

Is the reason for renaming this school because there's no ties to him in Jacksonville? By that logic we should rename Jax, and anything in town with "Washington" no?

No, that's the reaction to the response of those like Ock who claim it's "our" history.  The school was not named after Forrest because of our region's history.  It was done in the height of the Civil Rights era as a show of disrespect to the idea of equal rights for all races and desegregation. In other words, the only thing we're honoring is an act of supreme local ignorance and elitism by a small group of Jaxons in the 1950s.

[Demosthenes]

You are correct, however, he was the military Governor of Florida at the time. Jacksonville Fl has the distinction of being the only city/town to be named after the man before he became President in 1828. No, he didnt come here, but he certainly did have an impact on the region.

I've heard it said that Andrew Jackson never set foot in Jacksonville (I've not verified that).

Is the reason for renaming this school because there's no ties to him in Jacksonville? By that logic we should rename Jax, and anything in town with "Washington" no?

[Demosthenes]

The Red Sox paid for this with 30 years of futility. Also, nobody is suggesting we rename Bay Street Yawkee Way, though a large number of local neighborhoods were built, or named for the much maligned northern yankees. Riverside, for example, was largley developed by Massachusetts native John Forbes.

Also, by giving your opinion, you are defacto "getting into the whole" discussion.

 (

I'm not gonna get into the whole "Forrest name change" debate, but I will say this much; It seems like Southern named buildings, streets etc, that have controversial connotations for whatever reason (racial etc) are quickly denounced, while the Northern counterparts are completely let off the hook, and in some cases it would be blasphemous if anyone speaks out against.

Look at Tom Yawkey, who was a Boston Red Sox executive. He was known for being a racist by many (Jackie Robinson among others) and the Red Sox was the last team to have a black player. What do the ball club do? Name a street in his honor Yawkey Way, right by Fenway Park in one of the most liberal states today. No one says a peek. There are plenty of other examples too. So I'll try to get this through my head; Southern 'accused' racist = bad, Northern 'accused' racist = tolerable, okay...   

[I-10east]

Also, by giving your opinion, you are defacto "getting into the whole" discussion.

Blah blah blah, be that obligatory 'overly protective and sensitive of my hometown' guy; You're like a dime a dozen around here....Too bad the truth hurts....

[thelakelander]

What's the truth that hurts?

[I-10east]

^^^Tom Yawkey was a racist as I said earlier, and Demo had to stick up for his beloved city, Boston. I have the reputation of being overly-defensive of Jax; I admittedly use to be that way, but now I try to refrain from doing that; The only exception is when I think someone is treating Jax unfairly.

Everytime that I make ONE critique about ANY city outside of Jax, someone ALWAYS come to it's defense, no matter what! Just like a knight in shining armor or something. It's cool to say WHATEVER about Jax though.... *sigh*   

[kbhanson3]

IMO - When it comes to standing by our history, be it a Nazi submarine, the lovely Jean Harlow and her affair with Al Capone at the Casa Marina Hotel, the Barkers, a Creature From The Black Lagoon or General Forrest, standing up is always a stronger position then bowing to pressure to forget it.

Noone is suggesting that we forget our history.  History is not static.  It is a constantly unfolding story.  Changing the school's name would simply be the next chapter in the history of NBF.  Personally, I hope we never forget the story of people like NBF and how we as a society have become more enlightened and constantly strive to move beyond intolerance, oppression and racism. Changing the name of the school, and the reasons for making the change, would be something remembered by generations to come.  So rest assured that history would not be forgotten.

[Demosthenes]

^^^Tom Yawkey was a racist as I said earlier, and Demo had to stick up for his beloved city, Boston. I have the reputation of being overly-defensive of Jax; I admittedly use to be that way, but now I try to refrain from doing that; The only exception is when I think someone is treating Jax unfairly.

Everytime that I make ONE critique about ANY city outside of Jax, someone ALWAYS come to it's defense, no matter what! Just like a knight in shining armor or something. It's cool to say WHATEVER about Jax though.... *sigh*

I didnt stick up for Boston. I said that Yawkey being a racist retarded the RedSox ability to compete in baseball. Furthermore, while I do love that city, they have a pretty horrendous reputation as a racist city, including being where bussing started, and furthermore, I love Jax. I dont love some of the backwards bullshit, like trying to justify the continued name of a predominantly black school after the first grand-wizard of the KKK through manipulation of history, but Jax is a pretty awesome city in most ways. I dare you to try to find me a city without its warts.