Walkable Commercial Districts: Edgewood Village

[Ocklawaha]

The problem here, of course, is that Murray Hill like EVERY OTHER suburb in Jacksonville was designed for AUTOMOBILES! 

[Fallen Buckeye]

My wife and I spend a lot of time in Murray Hill. We were looking to buy a house there, but just couldn't find the right one so we ended up down the road off Normandy. One of the things that surprised me was the lot sizes on a few of the houses to the west of Edgewood Village. They were a lot bigger than I would have expected to see in-town. The other thing I love is that a lot of Murray Hill is still your classic mom and pop operations like Flowers by Pat and the Dreamette. Except the banks, I can't think of national brand company along that corridor.

[mtraininjax]

As a poster mentioned earlier, the Edgewood strip can pull from the wealthier areas due to its proximity. Its got available stores for reasonable prices and it has the potential to develop much like Park and King.

Maybe that is the case at Edgewood and Plymouth, but head up Edgewood North and the stores get more desolate, and by the time you reach Bank of America, its a ghost town. Not much Avondale/Riverside influence up that way.

Just for kicks, how many convenience stores are there between Plymouth and Lenox. A lot more than in Avondale/Riverside, a sign that the area is not as wealthy as Avondale/Riverside.

[cline]

As a poster mentioned earlier, the Edgewood strip can pull from the wealthier areas due to its proximity. Its got available stores for reasonable prices and it has the potential to develop much like Park and King.

Maybe that is the case at Edgewood and Plymouth, but head up Edgewood North and the stores get more desolate, and by the time you reach Bank of America, its a ghost town. Not much Avondale/Riverside influence up that way.

Just for kicks, how many convenience stores are there between Plymouth and Lenox. A lot more than in Avondale/Riverside, a sign that the area is not as wealthy as Avondale/Riverside.

Actually no.  Just for kicks- there are 3 convenience store on Edgewood between Plymouth and Lenox (Mayflower @ Edgwood, Post @ Edgewood and Lenox @ Edgewood).  Hell, there's 3 convenience stores just on Park St. near Ingleside and Dancy.  Plus the one at Oak and Stockton, and the ones on King St. and the ones in 5 points.  So no, there are not more convenience stores on strip of Edgewood between Plymouth and Lenox.  But the point is, no one said that the area is not as "wealthy" as RA, the point was that the area can pull from R/A.

On a different note, the seafood shop on the corner of Lenox and Edgewood, it's called Swimming Yesterday, is a good joint.  Very nice people there with reasonable prices.  I get Apalachicola oysters there frequently.

[mtraininjax]

there are 3 convenience store on Edgewood between Plymouth and Lenox (Mayflower @ Edgwood, Post @ Edgewood and Lenox @ Edgewood).

Yes there are, but these are tied to other needs and commercial businesses, the dance studio, Yesterday's coin laundry, Orsay, hair stylist. The CS on Plymouth, yes it is close to Moon River, same as the gas station at Post and Edgewood. The difference is that as you head North on Edgewood, the commercial district does not pull from anything other desolation. By the time you get to Lenox and Edgewood, you'd swear you were in another part of town. A lot of the commercial at this end has left and moved on, and the neighborhood has not been the same since. This area pulls from nothing, so the R/A effect is limited in scope and effect.  North Riverside is a good example too.

[WmNussbaum]

I see no sign of a TacoLu. Where is it supposed to be going? Across from Moon River, the "for rent " signs are still up.

[Charles Hunter]

I remember going to the Edgewood Theater for those matinees WmNussbaum talked about, getting sodas at the drug store, and going to Toy Town, that was somewhere in that block, I think.

[PeeJayEss]

Any thoughts on how the transition of Edgewood from 2 lanes to four lanes at Mayflower affects the vibrancy of the corridor further out? Just observation, it would seem that 2 lanes > 4 lanes. The corridor is pretty great for the first block to Mayflower. Antisdale to Jasmine or Kerle is also in pretty good shape, despite the four lanes, but that may just have to do with how good those few anchor businesses are there (Crazy Egg, the bakery, and Dreamette could all probably stay in business where ever you put them). Seems the problem is the 4 lanes and/or the blocks in between these two areas, where you essentially have dead space for a good portion. The bank (Compass, I believe?) on the SW side of the street, then the church, Edgewood Condominiums, and Florida Christian Apartments on the NE side that make it a very long walk between activity centers.

Even with these dead spaces, that first half of the corridor toward Lenox isn't too bad. You can walk around there at night without much fuss. Definitely could be infilled and improved, and its probably a good investment.

[cline]

^I think that may have been mentioned in a different thread.  It would create a more pedestrian-friendly environment.  It may not have a huge effect on the vitality of the commercial vitality of the area though.  I have no idea what the traffic counts are for that stretch but I would doubt it warrants 4-lanes.  Could be a good candidate for a road diet.

[thelakelander]

I don't think the roadway lanes are as big of a problem on foot.  From a pedestrian scale standpoint, the lots with suburban site layouts are the major problem in that stretch.  There are also a number of empty buildings in that stretch.  Activating those buildings would most likely change the vibe of the corridor without one red cent invested in improving the street.  In other words, I think how some of the land uses meet the street are a more significant factor than Edgewood being four lanes. 

Nevertheless, I agree with Cline.  The next time its scheduled to be repaved, it would be a great candidate for a road diet (going down to 2 lanes and adding wide bicycle lanes).

[thelakelander]

I have no idea what the traffic counts are for that stretch but I would doubt it warrants 4-lanes.

The 2011 AADT was somewhere between 6,500 to 7,000. 

For those who may not be familiar with "AADT" it means:

Annual average daily traffic, abbreviated AADT, is a measure used primarily in transportation planning and transportation engineering. It is the total volume of vehicle traffic of a highway or road for a year divided by 365 days. AADT is a useful and simple measurement of how busy the road is. It is sometimes incorrectly reported as "average annual daily traffic"

Road diets are typically successful on roads carrying less than 19,000 cars a day.  So Edgewood would be ideal for a road diet project.

[cline]

With those low counts it could easily go down to 2 lanes and maintain and acceptable level of service.

[Tacachale]

^I totally agree with that.

[cline]

I just took a look at the COJ Murray Hill Town Center Vision Plan (from 2004) and it recommends decreasing Edgewood from 4 lanes to 2 from Falmouth Street to Mayflower with landscaped medians.  It also has intersection improvements (8 foot crosswalks etc.) at the intersections in between.  Cost estimate for the improvements was about 1.1MM (in 2004).