JRTC Greyhound Terminal Design Moving Forward

[duvaldude08]

I saw the JTA show, Making Moves last night. Micheal Blaylock was selling the greyhound terminal like it will be the greatest thing to come. And they also mentioned several awards they won for excellence, including an award for the Riverside Trolley Facebook page, There isn't even a Riverside Trolley anymore! Who the hell are they fooling with their propaganda? It's really scary that they have the ability to pull the wool over the eyes of many people. But we here know the truth!

If anyone here on MJ can help me with the process of doing petitions or whatever I must do, I beg for any advice or direction to make this a reality.

1. Some time ago I did a little check on this 'award winning' bunch... You should try it, it is a real knee slapper. Here is how it works. STEP ONE: Appoint someone director, officer, etc. at JTA.  STEP TWO: Put them on stage at one of the city's many award events (You know the type, nicest mailman, best lawn, most likely to serve 5 to 10 at Raiford, etc.) and you give them an award. BINGO! A REAL AWARD WINNING INSTITUTION.

2. I'm thinking we need an article on this and within the article a ready to print letter to both City Council and to the Federal Transit Administration. These letters should make it clear that:

The Jacksonville Terminal built in 1919 regularly handled 41,095  people a day or 15 Million per year
The original station is expected to be abandoned by the convention people.

JTA believes we need this, and 3 other 'stations,' covering as much ground as the Vatican to handle less then half of that many passengers.

By stringing out 5 stations over several blocks JTA is forcing intercity and intracity passengers into a long torturous walk in order to connect between modes.

That the JRTC will actually make the transfer situation in Jacksonville, the traditional surface transportation gateway to Florida, much more difficult.

With the Convention Center empty within 5-10 years, the City has an unprecedented opportunity to reinvigorate the old terminal into a true SEAMLESS intermodal terminal.
 
Any approval of the current scheme is a guarantees that Jacksonville will not have a true intermodal terminal, regardless of what they are calling this project, for decades to come.

Stop this plan.

Locally failure to stop this plan will result in citizen action to demand removal of any approving politician from office.

Then if you wish, add

'LOVE OCK'

Love it OCK! You the man!

[Ralph W]

Would it be safe to say that no one in the decision making process, no one in the planning process and no one in the operations process has actually used any of the transportation modes they are now espousing? This would appear to hold true not only for the local and state powers that be but also the good folks over at Greyhound and at Amtrac.

Taking your car to work, parking in close in reserved parking garages or being chaufered to and from your destinations apparently gives crystal ball insight into exactly how an intermodal system functions.

I have recommended each and every person involved be required to spend a week walking the routes it would take to implement tghe current plans. This includes our esteemed public officials as well as all the cloistered head honchos you can find.

[tufsu1]

Would it be safe to say that no one in the decision making process, no one in the planning process and no one in the operations process has actually used any of the transportation modes they are now espousing? This would appear to hold true not only for the local and state powers that be but also the good folks over at Greyhound and at Amtrac.

nope...that would not be safe to say...

the prioblem often is that JTA (and other entities) get an idea in their head, go down that path, and then believe it is difficult if not impossible to reverse course.....this is the case with the greyhound terminal.

[ricker]

1. Some time ago I did a little check on this 'award winning' bunch... You should try it, it is a real knee slapper. Here is how it works. STEP ONE: Appoint someone director, officer, etc. at JTA.  STEP TWO: Put them on stage at one of the city's many award events (You know the type, nicest mailman, best lawn, most likely to serve 5 to 10 at Raiford, etc.) and you give them an award. BINGO! A REAL AWARD WINNING INSTITUTION.

2. I'm thinking we need an article on this and within the article a ready to print letter to both City Council and to the Federal Transit Administration. These letters should make it clear that:

The Jacksonville Terminal built in 1919 regularly handled 41,095  people a day or 15 Million per year
The original station is expected to be abandoned by the convention people.

JTA believes we need this, and 3 other 'stations,' covering as much ground as the Vatican to handle less then half of that many passengers.

By stringing out 5 stations over several blocks JTA is forcing intercity and intracity passengers into a long torturous walk in order to connect between modes.

That the JRTC will actually make the transfer situation in Jacksonville, the traditional surface transportation gateway to Florida, much more difficult.

With the Convention Center empty within 5-10 years, the City has an unprecedented opportunity to reinvigorate the old terminal into a true SEAMLESS intermodal terminal.
 
Any approval of the current scheme is a guarantees that Jacksonville will not have a true intermodal terminal, regardless of what they are calling this project, for decades to come.

Stop this plan.

Locally failure to stop this plan will result in citizen action to demand removal of any approving politician from office.

Then if you wish, add
'LOVE OCK'

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++very well stated.

why why why
how how how can any true Regional Transit Center extend north of the SKYWAY station???

a parking garage (which i know many may say we should not need) could be built in the parking lot on the west side of the original Jacksonville Terminal with GREYHOUND operations on the first two levels.
max of 4 levels perhaps, 5 maybe if it would not visually compete with the grandeur of the beautiful original.

[/quote]

[thelakelander]

It could.  The problem is the convention center is still there and it appears no one is willing to take a step back and resolve this convention center issue before moving forward with components of the spread out JRTC plan.

[Ocklawaha]

If we raise enough questions in minds of the FTA, we might have a shot at killing this, forcing a rethink. I'm willing to go a few more years without then to have another nationally internationally spotlighted fail.

Among the academia and transportation people of South America, those few who know where Jacksonville is, mention the name 'SKYWAY EXPRESS,' and the laughing begins. Play it again JTA...

OCKLAWAHA

[thelakelander]

JTA intends to break ground on their Greyhound bus terminal in LaVilla this August. JTA will use federal money to build it and Greyhound will lease space in it for 40 years.  When complete, the existing Greyhound station will be closed and listed for sale.



full article: http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/2013-04-29/story/jta-plans-summer-ground-breaking-new-greyhound-bus-terminal

[Charles Hunter]

Is the TU map wrong, or has the new Greyhound station moved a couple blocks to the east?

[PeeJayEss]

Cool, they are building the piece that is furthest from the Jax Terminal first, thereby ensuring the JRTC will take up an incredibly large footprint, even if JTA realizes the folly of their ways in the future.

[thelakelander]

^That's the highly unfortunate part. Bad urban design, worst location.  Considering it will probably be years before the rest of this spread out complex can find funding, the new bus station will be just as isolated as one can get.  It will suck if you're stuck there for a few hours on a layover.  At the old site, you at least had the option of walking to  businesses and restaurants in the heart of downtown.

Is the TU map wrong, or has the new Greyhound station moved a couple blocks to the east?

TU map is wrong. The station is still in the same proposed location.

[Seraphs]

This is reminiscent of that horrible train station debacle.  In fact that dreary little suburban building reminds me of the train station.

[thelakelander]

A revised Greyhound terminal plan is now moving forward:

The building is a bit smaller — 7,700 square feet down to 9,750 square feet — and has been shifted a little southwest from its original location. Now, the building will be on a block bordered by Forsyth Street to the south, adjacent to the Skyway’s Convention Center Station.

Eventually, the terminal will also house other bus companies, like Megabus, a low-fare intercity bus service which already stops at the Convention Center Station.

A combination of state and federal money are paying for the terminal, which was originally slated to cost about $6 million but, with the delay, will now likely cost between $7-8 million, Thoburn said.

The project will have to undergo some redesign and rebid for construction, which could start sometime near the end of 2016.

Greyhound is expected to occupy the building near the end of 2017 or early 2018.

The move will allow Greyhound to vacate its current downtown building — valued at $2.1 million, according to Property Appraiser records — and sell it. A company spokeswoman said Greyhound does plan to sell the building, though it doesn’t yet have a date when it will go on the market.

Full article: http://jacksonville.com/news/2015-08-26/story/future-greyhound-terminal-near-convention-center-back-track

[brainstormer]

We can all be thankful the original development plan wasn't built as intended 5 blocks away from the transportation center!

[Jagsdrew]

http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=548521

Take a look at Downtown’s new Greyhound station

"If you don’t see the sign on the building depicting a sleek, silver racing dog in full stride, you might not immediately identify the structure as a Greyhound bus station.
That’s the concept for Greyhound Lines Inc.’s new intercity bus terminal that will replace its decades-old station at Bay and Pearl streets.

“They’ll have elements with their brand. You’ll recognize it’s Greyhound,” said Brad Thoburn, Jacksonville Transportation Authority vice president of long-range planning and system development.

The new building is the first phase of the authority’s $33 million Regional Transportation Center that’s scheduled to be in operation in 2019.

The new station’s architecture will mirror the design chosen for the entire transportation complex and it’s scheduled to be considered for conceptual review Oct. 20 by the Downtown Development Review Board.

That’s not what happened in Nashville in 2011 when Greyhound built a new station in the SoBro mixed-use district adjacent to that city’s urban core.

Even after the building was under construction, Greyhound officials declined to comment on its appearance other than to say, in part, “Having a standard design allows our locations to be easily recognizable for our passengers,” according to an article published by The CityPaper, a Nashville news website.

That’s not how it works in Jacksonville.

Thoburn said JTA and Greyhound have been working together for some time to develop their new terminal as part of the transportation center complex that will combine long-distance bus transportation, JTA’s fixed-route, bus rapid transit and Skyway systems as well as administrative offices for the authority.

In fact, the location of the Greyhound station within the overall transportation center design was changed about 18 months ago to better fit with future development of LaVilla, he said.

Thoburn said submitting the design to the review board is “an important part of the process.”

The review board conducted a workshop Oct. 4 for the architects and engineers selected by JTA to design the transportation complex.

That should help ensure the conceptual design is approved next week, which would allow final approval in November, which will include review of building materials, colors and signage.

Final approval by the board is required before the city will issue building permits for the project.

Thoburn said construction of the Greyhound facility should take about 12 months. The second phase — JTA’s facilities — is scheduled to begin construction next fall and should be complete in September 2019."