City Council prepares to Halt Mobility Fee

[JeffreyS]

Your response is better than mine Lake.  I give Mr. Lumb credit he seems to want to do right by the city.  I doubt it has occurred to him that the market may actually be correcting a problem with sprawl based construction.  I think he and most people still believe in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s type of development that went bust. Believing that our current situation is just a set back and the same old course should be plotted.

[jcjohnpaint]

My email has been sent to ALL-  It is time to stop the insanity!  The stone age was then, but his is now! We have a lot of catching up to do

[ChriswUfGator]

Here is my first non auto reply.  I respect his difference of opinion just wish he were better informed.

Mr. Sutton:

If you are going to reduce my service on City Council to this one vote then get out your checkbook and get ready to write a check to my eventual opponent(s).

Maybe you haven’t noticed but there’s a depression on in the construction industry. If a TEMPORARY waiver of Mobility Fees will cause some projects to move forward that would have otherwise been delayed then that is a very good thing. At least we can generate a few of the jobs that are so desperately needed.

Here are the defects in your arguments:

1.   If the waiver leads to a substantial uptick in construction then I am correct in arguing that Mobility Fees, at least in this very bad economy, are a job killer.
2.   If the waiver fails to generate a measurable increase in construction activity then there is no harm. Construction is already so anemic that there will be little revenue generated by Mobility Fees in the near or intermediate future.
3.   You assume that infrastructure is or will be overburdened. I don’t know that this is the case. Generally speaking the “fair share” regime that was just done away with had kept pace with our needs, albeit inequitably, and I certainly don’t think that “infill” projects would do much to strain the infrastructure that’s currently in place.   
4.   Those who focus on transportation infrastructure and argue that its direct costs place an undue burden on local governments ignore the substantial wealth effect that results from having an economy that prominently features private automobile ownership. The reality is that approximately 15% of all economic activity in this country is either directly or indirectly dependent on the private ownership of automobiles. This may create a need to spend on roads and highways but it also generates a very large amount of income and sales tax revenue that otherwise would not be available. It also creates a large portion of the wealth that sustains other sectors of the economy.

For the record very few of the citizens I hear from, even those who might suspect that my views run contrary to their own, threaten me by telling me they will oppose my re-election. Most of them understand that if the goal is persuasion then the best thing for them to do is to stick to the facts and to build a compelling case for their position.

If I caved in to you because you threatened to oppose my re-election then what kind of City Council member would I be?

My advice to you when you communicate with City Council members is to stick to the facts and to save the saber rattling for another day.

The challenges we face as a city over the next few years are substantial and it would be a mistake for any of us to declare that our city’s future hinged one particular issue or one particular vote, especially in light of the tremendous economic difficulties we face as a society.

I’m sorry to disappoint you but I will be voting for the TEMPORARY waiver of the Mobility Fees and I believe that the overwhelming majority of City Council members will be joining me.

Robin Lumb, City Council
Group 5 At Large
________________________________________

Holy sense of entitlement Batman. Someone's forgotten who butters their bread...

[Miss Fixit]

"A suspension or elimination of impact fees raises a general question of fairness and equal treatment between those who recently paid the full fee amounts and those who will now not pay the fees. Case law requires that impact fee payers receive a “benefit.” An important consideration is how the previous payers of the full fee amount receive their “benefit” if a community is not able to fully fund the growth-related capital improvements upon which the fees are based. Communities could face the choice of having to subsidize new development with General Fund dollars or refunding millions of dollars to previous fee payers in order to avoid equal protection challenges."


This is a real problem.  Developers who paid into Jacksonville's "Fair Share" program in the past will have good reason to complain.

Mr. Lumb's response reinforces my firmly held belief that Michelle Tappouni was by far the best choice for the council seat he is temporarily (kinda like the waiver of mobility fees) filling.

[jcjohnpaint]

First Response to my email concern:

Mr. John,

I appreciate your message. I know it's counterintuitive, but we are doing this in order to spur growth and create more tax revenue. Our main problem now is not a matter of needing capital improvement dollars, it's general revenue we need, which will come through increased property values.

Best,

Ray Holt

[thelakelander]

The problem is no one can issue documentation that sprawl based property tax revenue covers the public subsidies needed to generate it.  The growth-based economic structure is a big ponzi scheme.  We've drunken so much kool aid in this place that we assume truth with several things that have been proven false, even when reality smacks us in our faces.  This is how we got into the economic mess we're in now.  It's the reason we're laying off cops, reducing library hours and poorly maintaining our parks.  As I mentioned earlier, I do believe council members mean well but they are way off base.  That off-base view stems from a lack of understanding on sustainable urban economics and current national trends.  Jax will fall further behind with this pending decision but it will be a good learning lesson for a community that continues to take two steps back after every forward step.

[dougskiles]

What are the chances of getting the civic council to study the sprawl issue?  And also the problems of a growth-based economy?  Could we trust the results?

[JeffreyS]

We need to keep it up on all fronts but the Mayors office may be our best hope for sanity. 

[acme54321]

I contacted city hall. 
The text of 2011-617 can be viewed at http://cityclts.coj.net/coj/Council/SEPTEMBER-13-2011-SUMMARY.pdf   just scroll down to viewer page 42. 

This bill is scheduled to be voted on in the Rules Committee on 10/17, then it will go to Council on 10/25.  The legislative aid at 630 1404 suggested a call to them on Tuesday 10/11 at 1:00pm or so to confirm the status of the bill in Rules Committee because it is possible they will discharge it from the committee (meaning agree to approve without a vote) and enable Council to vote on it on 10/11.

Tuesday 10/11 was 2 days ago?

No it is 10/6 today.  I am only correcting you so no one is confused and knows they still have time to call or email.

WOW I need to learn how to read a calendar better!!

[redglittercoffin]

So if this is to spur development, which will create more properties to tax, but in so doing, continue to flood the market with houses, won't we just have more property devaluation, and then eventually lower tax revenue all over again?

Why can these people not think past stage one?

[thelakelander]

Pretty much.  This is what happens when you invest your dollars in a ponzi scheme or you move to slow in the game of musical chairs.  At some point, someone is left holding the bag.  Unfortunately for Jacksonville, it will be you, me and the rest of the taxpayers.

[Kay]

Councilman Lumb is a smart guy with an open mind who will listen to voters.  He also is a huge supporter of the historic districts.  If we want to continue to effect change, then we need to go about it in a constructive way. 

You want to win elected officials over with factual arguments not emotional blackmail.  You need to build relationships instead of criticizing individuals on a blog.

So if there is a factual case to be made for what we believe, then let's spend some time putting it together.  We're talking about a year versus the long-term regarding the mobility fee moratorium.

And I will go on the record and say I am thrilled Robin Lumb is one of our councilmembers.  He lives in Riverside and is a former RAP board member.  Do we always agree--heck no.  Will he listen to you--heck yes.  I believe, given some time, he will be one of our most effective elected officials.

[JeffreyS]

Councilman Lumb is a smart guy with an open mind who will listen to voters.  He also is a huge supporter of the historic districts.  If we want to continue to effect change, then we need to go about it in a constructive way. 

You want to win elected officials over with factual arguments not emotional blackmail.  You need to build relationships instead of criticizing individuals on a blog.

So if there is a factual case to be made for what we believe, then let's spend some time putting it together.  We're talking about a year versus the long-term regarding the mobility fee moratorium.

And I will go on the record and say I am thrilled Robin Lumb is one of our councilmembers.  He lives in Riverside and is a former RAP board member.  Do we always agree--heck no.  Will he listen to you--heck yes.  I believe, given some time, he will be one of our most effective elected officials.

It is hardly emotional blackmail to tell the candidates I am keeping score on this one.  I do donate to people I want in office.  I posted the email I sent and it isn't very harsh.  Mr. Lumb responded with his reasoning and a little advice neither of which I agree with but way better than the auto and non responses I received from everyone else.

[thelakelander]

I'll vouch for Robin Lumb as well.  I had the opportunity to talk with him about Monroe Street a month or two ago.  I'm of the opinion that he and most of the council in general wants to do what's best for the community. 

However, there is an economic education process that needs to happen in Jacksonville.  We're going to have to learn to look outside of the borders of Duval County and the First Coast to see what is going on in the world outside of us.  Most of our leaders still believe in a ponzi scheme oriented growth based economic model that is currently being naturally corrected by today's market conditions.  The city's that have the ability to take advantage of a quality-of-life based economic model will be the ones to succeed going forward.  Many like Charlotte, Salt Lake City, etc. have recognized this years ago so we have some catching up to do.

[Kay]

So what does that quality of life model look like?