Author Topic: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?  (Read 8238 times)

02roadking

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2007, 08:34:16 AM »
From the   http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/index.php

  The Port Authority, it’s recent agreements with major Asian shipping lines seem to have helped its financial health, as evidenced by Fitch Ratings and Moody’s Investors Services awarding the Port Authority A and A2 designations, which are among the financial industry’s highest seaport ratings. Moody’s and Fitch examined extensive financial records, including the Port Authority’s revenues, expenses, debt service coverage and other business data. The agencies based the designations on JaxPort’s position as a container port, especially with the addition of the new TraPac terminal at the end of next year and the recent contract talks with Korea’s Hanjin Shipping. Moody’s and Fitch are leading global providers of credit ratings, research and analysis for debt instruments and other securities.
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pwhitford

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #16 on: November 02, 2009, 02:15:28 PM »
Here is a dose of reality from Lloyd's List, the authority in the shipping industry.  We need to get way out in front of this, now.  Jaxport is currently our only viable, long term engine of economic development and we can either bite the bullet and upgrade the port and the rails (and to a lesser extent, the roads) that serve it now or we can weep later as Savannah and other ports attract record Panama Canal traffic away from us

US ports will not be ready for Panama expansion

US east coast and Gulf of Mexico hubs told to step up preparations for 12,600 teu vessels that will call from 2014

Roger Hailey - Monday 2 November 2009

US EAST coast and Gulf ports need to step up their preparations if they are to handle larger container vessels transiting an expanded Panama Canal from 2014 onwards.

Panama Canal Authority vice-president Rodolfo Sabonge told a US maritime audience: “One of the things that has to be taken very seriously by ports on the [US] east coast and in the Gulf has to do with making sure that they are able to receive the larger vessels, which require at least 45 ft of draught, meaning they will need at least 47 ft to 50 ft of depth in the navigable channel.”

Although the 4,400 teu capacity container vessels today transiting the 50 mile lock controlled waterway can call at most east coast ports, the situation will change dramatically when vessels of 12,600 teu start entering the Atlantic in five years time. Currently, only Norfolk and Charleston are able to host such larger vessels.

Mr Sabonge said that although the larger vessel sizes will also affect dry bulk and tanker operations, the primary changes will be on the container trades, not just for main call vessels but also for the feeder networks on the US east coast and Gulf.

He added: “When you have a larger vessel, you are reducing the ports of call at the origin to maybe two or three, and at the destination to maybe two.”

Mr Sabonge said that such vessel calls would be broken down to a principal US port, where 12,000-plus teu ships can call fully laden, followed by a secondary port, where they can call with less of a draught requirement, because they are not fully laden.

“We have gathered from the shipping lines that the principal port of call will be in the northeast, either New York/New Jersey or Norfolk. But New York/New Jersey has to deal with the Bayonne Bridge problem. The second port will be somewhere in the southeast, at either Charleston, Savannah or Jackson.”

Lloyd’s List reported in September that the New York/New Jersey Port authority is looking at ways of dealing with the problem presented by the 78-year-old Bayonne Bridge, whose current air draught limits ships calling at terminals to 7,000 teu.

Jacking up the bridge, building a new one or digging a tunnel will cost at least $4bn, according to recent studies.

According to Mr Sabonge, the principal port of call in the US Gulf will be in the Houston area, due to factors such as population density and because a large number of logistical distribution centres are located in the region. “The secondary could be on the west coast of Florida,” he added.

The webinar was sponsored by the US Federal Highway Administration‘s National Highways Institute. During the webinar, it was emphasised that port connectivity, primarily US doublestack road rail connections, would also be a critical aspect of ensuring that containers do not build up at the ports, but keep flowing inland.

One of the main US railroad companies, Norfolk Southern, has undertaken a massive investment programme for building or upgrading freight train links to the US port network, although rivals CSC and Canadian National have also been active.

Commenting on transhipment opportunities, Mr Sabonge said: “In addition to direct ships calls, origin to destination, there will be a lot of changes happening especially with regard to transhipment. This is because these larger vessels are also not going to be able to call all the transhipment ports that you have right now.”

Drawing on research from London-based Drewry Shipping Consultants, Mr Sabonge said that the future container network will see “five or at most six transhipment hubs in the world”.

Although no port was named, a transhipment hub in the Caribbean will be critical for those ports to the east of the US Gulf that cannot handle post-panamax vessels.

Bruce Lambert, executive director with the Institute for Trade and Transportation Studies, agreed that the Panama Canal serves as “a very critical shortcut in the global logistics chain”, both for containers and bulks.

But he added: “The canal is really a critical bottleneck, an obstacle that is obsolete. There were a lot of studies on expanding the canal but it took a little time before the government moved on it.”

Mr Lambert continued: “Sometimes we forget the scale of cargo and just how big these ships really are. We tend to think of them as a unit and not as a sum total of a lot of activity.”

Among the factors which could detract from the efforts to widen and deepen the Panama Canal, Mr Lambert mentioned rail freight intermodalism from the US west coast ports, although this had to be set against shipper concerns over the dock strike record at the west coast ports.

Returning to the earlier theme of US port preparedness for the larger boxships, Mr Lambert said: “One of the challenges is that the ports in the east must be ready to receive these cargos, and there is also the question of parochial fighting.

“Can the ports in the region agree that they need to work together to attract these cargos? Let the cargo come to the region and then the market will determine which ports will win.”

“The issue really boils down to who will win between the railroads and the canal? Intermodal is a large part of the western railroads revenue streams, and it will still need investment in those trades to be able to provide those services going forward.”
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reednavy

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #17 on: November 02, 2009, 02:21:31 PM »
Dredge baby, dredge!
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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #18 on: November 02, 2009, 02:43:31 PM »
Dredge baby dredge (Jax Port Inferno).

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JaxBorn1962

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2009, 04:36:40 PM »
Dredge baby dredge (Jax Port Inferno).

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Hey If we Don't get a Nuclear Carrier we can turn Mayport into another Jaxport it would be closer to the Ocean and these large ships and Cruise Ships could get in and out of Mayport on a dime.

mtraininjax

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #20 on: November 02, 2009, 04:38:31 PM »
Quote
Cruise Ships could get in and out of Mayport on a dime.

I would dump the Cruise industry if we were the Pan-Am choice for the Southeast. Cruise ships really don't bring in the jobs you would think, but when you have 5,000 containers a DAY to move, you get more jobs here, for sure.
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JaxBorn1962

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #21 on: November 02, 2009, 04:48:18 PM »
Quote
Cruise Ships could get in and out of Mayport on a dime.

I would dump the Cruise industry if we were the Pan-Am choice for the Southeast. Cruise ships really don't bring in the jobs you would think, but when you have 5,000 containers a DAY to move, you get more jobs here, for sure.
True but Damn did Jaxport really make such a smart move with having its new terminal under the Dames Point Bridge? If we knew now that one day we would be getting more SUPER CARGO SHIPS we could have built the dames point bridge a lot higher oh well its only Money!

mtraininjax

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #22 on: November 02, 2009, 04:59:13 PM »
The Napolean Bonaparte Broward bridge (Dames Point) came A LONG TIME BEFORE CRUISE SHIPS docked here. Started in 85, finished in 89. Here we are 20 years later looking at ships needing more than 160 feet of space.

Super Cargo ships will be placed at Mayport, I don't have a good feeling about the "sleepy fishing village", when the number of jobs this will create will be staggering.
And, that $115 will save Jacksonville from financial ruin. - Mayor John Peyton

“This is a game-changer. This is what I mean when I say taking Jacksonville to the next level.”
-Mayor Alvin Brown on new video boards at Everbank Field

JaxBorn1962

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #23 on: November 02, 2009, 05:17:41 PM »
The Napolean Bonaparte Broward bridge (Dames Point) came A LONG TIME BEFORE CRUISE SHIPS docked here. Started in 85, finished in 89. Here we are 20 years later looking at ships needing more than 160 feet of space.

Super Cargo ships will be placed at Mayport, I don't have a good feeling about the "sleepy fishing village", when the number of jobs this will create will be staggering.
Funny ::) I didn't say anything about the Cruise Ships and the Dames Point? I had the Cruise Ships up at Mayport check my postings. Look at Blount Island we don't do a lot of New Cars like we once did. Blount island could be turned into a better Cargo area then it is sure we will have to Dredge anyway for the Super Cargo Ships. But Blount is better then the Dames Point Area unless Mayport can't be done.

Ocklawaha

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #24 on: November 02, 2009, 05:48:35 PM »
Super cargo ships? I think you guys are referring to the Panamax ships, and Panamax II, which will be even bigger. I would suspect that the North side of the Ferrylanding would be just about right but turning would require some sort of basin, perhaps at the San Pablo. It would be a LONG skinny port facility. A good deal of these baby's will need a 40 foot channel. 42 feet is a limiting factor due to a lake they will pass through in the Canal zone.  I also predict since it looks as if we are THE choice for the Atlantic Panamax crowd, we could dredge and build right up to North Jax Baptist Church at Main and the Trout River.
 
The Navy needs 252' clearance to come up river with the big stuff.



Bridge of the America's is the limiting factor for the future, built around 1959, this Hart Bridge, "look alike" has a 201 foot high center span from High Tide, over the Panama Canal.

The maximum dimensions allowed for a PANAMAX ship transiting the canal are:

Length: 965 ft (294.13 m)
Beam (width): 106 ft (32.31 m)
Draft: 39.5 ft (12.04 m) in tropical fresh water (the salinity and temperature of water affect its density, and hence how deep a ship will float in the water)
Air draft: 190 ft (57.91 m) measured from the waterline to the vessel's highest point  JTA strikes Again!
A Panamax cargo ship would typically have a DWT of 65,000-80,000 tonnes and a maximum cargo intake of 52,500 tonnes.

BIG... Huge! Me thinkith Captain Broward, hath a problem, just as the Maritime Interests said he would back in the 1980.


OCKLAWAHA
« Last Edit: November 02, 2009, 05:56:29 PM by Ocklawaha »

reednavy

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #25 on: November 02, 2009, 07:26:17 PM »
I wish they could utilize Mill Cove as a turning basin.
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mtraininjax

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #26 on: November 02, 2009, 08:04:39 PM »
Blount island is coveted by the Marines. Obama is dumb enough to give the whole thing to them, by serious imminent domain.
And, that $115 will save Jacksonville from financial ruin. - Mayor John Peyton

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JaxBorn1962

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #27 on: November 02, 2009, 09:02:36 PM »
Blount island is coveted by the Marines. Obama is dumb enough to give the whole thing to them, by serious imminent domain.
Was your Boy george w bush any smarter?

mtraininjax

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #28 on: November 02, 2009, 09:24:25 PM »
Quote
Was your Boy george w bush any smarter?

You could at least trust him to grow the economy. So far, we have 787 billion in spending and nothing to show for it, but we do have 11% unemployment in FLORIDA and GROWING.

Sort of like the old Clinton adage, you can trust him with your job, just not your daughter.
And, that $115 will save Jacksonville from financial ruin. - Mayor John Peyton

“This is a game-changer. This is what I mean when I say taking Jacksonville to the next level.”
-Mayor Alvin Brown on new video boards at Everbank Field

thelakelander

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Re: JAXPORT: How do we Rank?
« Reply #29 on: November 02, 2009, 09:31:13 PM »
I thought a carrier coming to Mayport had already been decided on?  Screw cruise ships.  Mayport is here to stay and provides for more economic benefit than using that property as a port or cruise terminal ever would.
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