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Community => News => Topic started by: Metro Jacksonville on July 11, 2008, 05:00:00 AM

Title: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: Metro Jacksonville on July 11, 2008, 05:00:00 AM
A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor

(http://www.metrojacksonville.com/photos/thumbs/lrg-1008-dcp_9862.JPG)

This weekend, the Jacksonville Chapter of The American Institute of Architects will host the First Annual Architecture Design and Planning Charrette.  For its inaugural effort, the AIA has selected A. Philip Randolph Blvd, a major thoroughfare in the Sport Complex that may have the potential to be a thriving post-event destination with entertainment, restaurants, and other attractions.

Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/content/view/839
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: Steve on July 11, 2008, 10:14:55 AM
This could be interesting - the main problems I see is the physical divide of the expessway, and lack of builsing fabric south of the expressway.  I can't wait to see what these guys come up with.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: thelakelander on July 11, 2008, 10:21:41 AM
If I didn't have things to do before heading out to New York, I'd RSVP and attend.  I hope they recommend retrofitting those new Sports District parking garages with retail space.  At least then, you would give people a reason to walk down the street.  Unfortunately, because of poor planning, whatever sprung up there would compete against East Bay and you would most likely end up with two subpar districts, instead of one vibrant one (at least until downtown densified).
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: BridgeTroll on July 11, 2008, 10:23:27 AM
It is a cool looking street... A little clean up... and probably police protection... and it could be a very walkable entertainment district.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: Ocklawaha on July 11, 2008, 12:44:32 PM
I will be hauling "The Streetcar Show" up to Randolph tomorrow... I'll remember my able assistant "GEORGE". Hope some of my friends are there!

http://jacksonvilletransit.blogspot.com/

Ocklawaha
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: Pavers on July 11, 2008, 01:33:02 PM
The Jax Children's Commission is the "anchor" tenant at the north end of that stretch, at the corner of Randolph and 1st.  They will probably be a key to supporting any efforts - is anyone from JCC attending?

I'd be curious to hear a download of the AIA findings - will metrojacksonville give us readers a follow-up report on the event and any insights?

Thanks,
Pavers
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: RiversideGator on July 11, 2008, 02:05:35 PM
I have always felt that this corridor has tremendous potential.  Plus, there are existing historic and attractive brick buildings there.  You just need to rehab them, rejuvenate the surrounding neighborhood and it could be a heck of an entertainment destination.  Of course, this is a 10-20 year project but it is doable.

As for streetcars, a Bay Street line could head east down Bay from Main, take a left on Randolph and then another left onto 1st and finally come back down Main to form a circle line.  This would feed people to the sports district and could be a key catalyst the revitalization of this area.

On a somewhat related topic, I wish the City had kept this street as "Florida Avenue", it's historic name. 
A. Phillip Randolph" was an historic figure but it doesnt exactly flow as well as "Florida Avenue".  Perhaps another way could have been found to honor him.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: thelakelander on July 11, 2008, 02:24:18 PM
On a somewhat related topic, I wish the City had kept this street as "Florida Avenue", it's historic name. 
A. Phillip Randolph" was an historic figure but it doesnt exactly flow as well as "Florida Avenue".  Perhaps another way could have been found to honor him.

In the form of a museum showcasing his works would have been nice.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: RiversideGator on July 11, 2008, 03:08:50 PM
Agreed (as to both Lake and SDare)
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: Ocklawaha on July 11, 2008, 07:22:56 PM
(http://lcweb2.loc.gov/wpaintro/manbar.jpg)
Name unknown.... NOT GEORGE.

Of course I'll muddy this up. Phillip Randolph deserves the Street named for him and the City should shout its pride in his achievements. Florida Avenue was once a busy Streetcar line, and so I'm partial to the old street name as well. Consider if you will that we have several "Stupid" street names, like HIGHWAY AVENUE, or BOULVARD AVENUE. Might as well call it Street-Street! So if Highway became Florida Avenue, would that make Randolph acceptable? What if Highway became Randolph, then where the hell do we build the monuments and museums?

(http://www.aliciapatterson.org/APF2102/Tye/Tye01.jpg)

The museum? Oh you better believe it's got to be a fairly grand affair, as their MUST BE a couple of PULLMAN CARS there. BTW, historical community, I know where there is a bunch of them.  


Ocklawaha
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: rjp2008 on July 12, 2008, 04:00:14 PM
I attended the event this afternoon.

There were several teams gathered that focused on different areas of development.
Some focused on creating more entertainment venues/hotel/attractions near the stadiums, while others considered essential needs of nearby community (post office, grocer, and other essential retail). Most of them hit on the need for a multi-modal transport hub at the base of the street (near the water). They mentioned other possibilities for the fairgrounds and nearby open space. The historical considerations were important to all obviously. They talked about a farmer's market near the overpass, something that could be immediately implemented. One made a pitch for a real rail streetcar.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: thelakelander on July 12, 2008, 04:20:02 PM
I attended the event this afternoon.

There were several teams gathered that focused on different areas of development.
Some focused on creating more entertainment venues/hotel/attractions near the stadiums, while others considered essential needs of nearby community (post office, grocer, and other essential retail). Most of them hit on the need for a multi-modal transport hub at the base of the street (near the water).

Transit has turned into a huge issue for many in our city today.  When we first started the site, a few years ago, it seemed like we were the only ones out there.

Quote
They mentioned other possibilities for the fairgrounds and nearby open space. The historical considerations were important to all obviously. They talked about a farmer's market near the overpass, something that could be immediately implemented. One made a pitch for a real rail streetcar.

That must have been Ock's group.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: Ocklawaha on July 12, 2008, 09:03:58 PM
Correction, all but one group mentioned a streetcar line, either on the North, South or the whole of Randolph.
One group sort of focused on just doing a neighborhood sort of thing with a Walgreens, Dollar store and a few infills.

ITEM NUMBER ONE as to times it was mentioned was the streetcar.

CLOSE SECOND a full farm market, usually on the waterfront, but some groups set it north of the freeway.

THIRD was the MASS TRANSIT HUB, with most calling for SKYWAY, STREETCAR, BUS, BRT

HOTEL ENTERTAINMENT complex would be third, with locations around the Randolph and Freeway interchange.

MICRO-BREWERY was very popular

STREETCAR BARN-MUSEUM very popular


RANDOLPH-PULLMAN museum popular

NEGRO LEAGUE Popular

The tour of the neighborhood was excellent, so was the lunch and complete agenda, eveything was in place, outlined and ready for crayons by the time we were seated. The streetcar was explained as NOT A PCT but Development Oriented Transit.

Most every group wanted to use it as the springboard for development.

Streetcar first... then the rest.

Yes I was there, but I wasn't in but ONE group of maybe 8...

STRONG TRANSIT SUPPORT at/on

RANDOLPH

RANDOLPH AND UNION

RANDOLPH AND BAY

RANDOLPH AND FIRST

Several plans to move the child thing out and go mixed or college with it. Several more to locate anchor museums at RANDOLPH and FIRST or WATERFRONT or both as anchors.

Mr. Blaylock? WE NEED TO TALK!


Ocklawaha
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: I-10east on July 13, 2008, 11:23:28 PM
Great pics Ock like always. 8)
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: ariane77 on February 07, 2011, 10:13:50 PM
What was the citizen/resident feed back, if any?
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: peestandingup on April 10, 2011, 02:28:41 PM
Well, 3 years later & I see nothing's changed with this corridor. Which is a shame because it's awesome (I drive through there all the time just to look at it). The housing fabric is neat too. http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2010-oct-urban-neighborhoods-the-eastside

I'm sure at this point, resources have been concentrated elsewhere.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: duvaldude08 on April 10, 2011, 06:18:08 PM
This is interesting. I actually made this recommendation about this being an entertainment district in a previous thread and of course everyone told me how dumb I was. LOL But to me its common sense. The area of town is the best, however lets look at how dangerous New Orleans. And that does not stop anyone from going to bourbon street to party. LOL It will be interesting to see what they come up with.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: Garden guy on April 10, 2011, 06:27:44 PM
If there's not alot of money to be made quickly it's very hard to get any investors in jax..quick money is all they are looking for and that is another of the many reasons why the over building and limitless building permits are happening. These rich boys come in and try to make the most in the shortest amount of time...long term investments dont do well here apparently.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: peestandingup on April 10, 2011, 08:34:56 PM
This is interesting. I actually made this recommendation about this being an entertainment district in a previous thread and of course everyone told me how dumb I was. LOL But to me its common sense. The area of town is the best, however lets look at how dangerous New Orleans. And that does not stop anyone from going to bourbon street to party. LOL It will be interesting to see what they come up with.

I seriously doubt anyone's coming up with anything for this area. It actually looks more dead now than it did in these 3 year old photos. There's people out & about, but not exactly what I'd call "productive looking" people. And there's hardly any businesses open.

But that entire area is pretty amazing IMO. And it's in a good area, adjacent to the sports complexes, downtown & Springfield. Walkable, urban, historical, most the housing/building stock still remains, etc. Can't understand why that area hasn't had more focus put on it.

Well, actually I can (it's in Jacksonville). And it's like GG said, apparently they see no value in working with what you have & preservation.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: buckethead on April 10, 2011, 09:50:13 PM
Let's put our moneys where our mouths are.

These properties can likely be had for reasonable prices. They are lovely. Ready to look just like so many pictures we've seen presented here. Bustling with visitors and customers. Beautiful brick facades with classic awnings over inviting doors. Shady, grand oaks... Pavers for walkways and cobblestone streets.

We complain about the GOB's who incidentally, like to manage businesses which tend to prosper. (i.e. turn a profit rather than a loss) Profitability is the determining factor in the feasibility of economic venture. There's always room for a non profit, but as an exception, rather than the rule.

This area is far from desirable from a business standpoint, at least through the eyes of someone who has lived in Ponte Vedra for the last 15 years. Foot traffic is there, but as someone mentioned earlier, not necessarily the kind of foot traffic a business needs to survive. (people hanging out looking quite unproductive, homeless, predatory) *come and git me... I can only calls ems likes I sees ems*

Sporting events can prop up a business during their respective seasons. (Jags especially, while the Suns, minimally) A business needs more than a few months of steady business to keep it's doors open for the entire year.

Anyone ever look at the concentration of sexual offenders in 32206? Plenty (and then some), with most north of 8th and east of Iona. (is there a halfway house on Evergreen?) (Yes, I checked PVB as well)

Yup... It's still early, even for urban pioneers, down that particular corridor. Too early for you???
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: mbwright on April 10, 2011, 09:56:01 PM
look quick, because the old grocery store, two story brick building, towards the south end of the street has a bright orange condemed/unsafe structure tag.  I also noticed a number  (too many in my opinion) not too far away in springfied, but I guess that is another issue.  It should be vvery clear that demolishing a historic area does not save it, nor revive it.  just look at LaVilla.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: peestandingup on April 10, 2011, 10:51:30 PM
Let's put our moneys where our mouths are.

These properties can likely be had for reasonable prices. They are lovely. Ready to look just like so many pictures we've seen presented here. Bustling with visitors and customers. Beautiful brick facades with classic awnings over inviting doors. Shady, grand oaks... Pavers for walkways and cobblestone streets.

We complain about the GOB's who incidentally, like to manage businesses which tend to prosper. (i.e. turn a profit rather than a loss) Profitability is the determining factor in the feasibility of economic venture. There's always room for a non profit, but as an exception, rather than the rule.

This area is far from desirable from a business standpoint, at least through the eyes of someone who has lived in Ponte Vedra for the last 15 years. Foot traffic is there, but as someone mentioned earlier, not necessarily the kind of foot traffic a business needs to survive. (people hanging out looking quite unproductive, homeless, predatory) *come and git me... I can only calls ems likes I sees ems*

Sporting events can prop up a business during their respective seasons. (Jags especially, while the Suns, minimally) A business needs more than a few months of steady business to keep it's doors open for the entire year.

Anyone ever look at the concentration of sexual offenders in 32206? Plenty (and then some), with most north of 8th and east of Iona. (is there a halfway house on Evergreen?) (Yes, I checked PVB as well)

Yup... It's still early, even for urban pioneers, down that particular corridor. Too early for you???

I honestly wouldn't mind buying a second home over there for cheap & spending some of my time with it. I don't know the crime stats right off, but I'm sure they got their fair share, so getting the wife & kid to join me would be another thing. ;)

The problem as I see it is that there just doesn't seem to be any interest in the area from really anyone, so I'd likely be sitting on a house for many many years until things got decent enough for "full time living status". They may never, who knows. That's sorta the problem with a lot of urban areas in Jax (little interest from the city & it's residents as a whole).

That's what's different from some similar rough neighborhoods in other cities (someone mentioned New Orleans). Places like that are a lot more condensed & not as spread out as Jax, so its easier for a bunch of people to move in & try to make the neighborhood better, while not being so isolated as you would be here. DC was the same way when I lived there. Many places are. But connectivity & condensity are a problem here. Hell, I didn't even know this neighborhood existed until I read it here. You could say that's my fault, but you could also say that Jax didn't make it easy for me to discover either.

Another problem is, like you mentioned, there's a lot of missions, shelters, projects & things of that sort here that the city sorta just peppered all through these downtown neighborhoods (Springfield too) because that's where they were needed at the time. Well, they were needed here because of working people & middle/upper class families abandoning the cores in the first place & then shoving all the poor into these inner-city neighborhoods. Basically putting all of the "bad elements" into one area so it doesn't bleed over into our beloved suburbs. ::) It's unfortunate, but it is what it is.

But hey, if a bunch of MJ readers wanna start buying up blocks of homes over here & setting up shops & stuff like that, I'm in. ;D
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: mtraininjax on April 12, 2011, 07:55:25 AM
Quote
hope they recommend retrofitting those new Sports District parking garages with retail space.

The "retail" spaces for the library parking deck have not even taken off after how many years? With less foot traffic than those spots, how are these retail spaces in the sports area expected to survive? Let's see if the Pub across from the arena/baseball park survives before we call this the new retail mecca of downtown.
Title: Re: A. Philip Randolph: Creating a Vibrant Corridor
Post by: peestandingup on April 12, 2011, 03:13:45 PM
Quote
hope they recommend retrofitting those new Sports District parking garages with retail space.

The "retail" spaces for the library parking deck have not even taken off after how many years? With less foot traffic than those spots, how are these retail spaces in the sports area expected to survive? Let's see if the Pub across from the arena/baseball park survives before we call this the new retail mecca of downtown.

I don't think anyone's saying that at all. In fact, the consensus is saying its probably the exact opposite these days (especially with the Jags' fate sorta up in the air). It's just the place has so much potential & history. But a lot of places in Jax had the same potential too & you see what happened to them (Lavilla for instance).

I think Jax as a whole can only consciously handle so much of these types of areas at a time. And Springfield sorta has that ball right now (and as awesome as it is, even its struggling in a lot of aspects nowadays). East Jacksonville is probably nowhere on the radar & likely won't be for some time. It's a shame, because if this were in a lot of other cities, it would get a lot of focus & be on its way to the greatness it deserves.