Author Topic: JTA's Inclement Weather Plan  (Read 2670 times)

Metro Jacksonville

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JTA's Inclement Weather Plan
« on: September 28, 2007, 11:27:47 AM »
JTA's Inclement Weather Plan

From the JTA Website...News ReleasesTuesday Transit Talk CancelledSeptember 18, 2007Due to bad weather, the Transit Talk scheduled this afternoon at River City Marketplace has been cancelled. It will be rescheduled in the near future.http://www.jtafla.com/news/news_selected.aspx?prID=176 (http://www.jtafla.com/news/news_selected.aspx?prID=176) Apparently JTA doesn't want to come outside during bad weather.  With that said, I wonder what it must have been like to wait for a bus under one of their non-existent bus shelters.

Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/content/view/599

Julie Anne

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Re: JTA's Inclement Weather Plan
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2007, 09:01:15 AM »
Well.. can you blame them? I mean half the streets downtown were either shut down or flooded. Klutho and Confederate lakes, oops I mean parks had taken over the surrounding streets. I wish I could have cancelled all my meetings and stayed home too  ;) Of course that would not have helped my poor car (less than 2yrs old) and sittign at Brumos for the past two weeks due to my own street flooding. Most cities shut down due to snow or ice storms, we shut down due to some rain  ???

fsujax

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Re: JTA's Inclement Weather Plan
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2007, 09:48:28 AM »
8 inches of rain in a short time, is pretty intense.  I live and Springfield and experienced the flooding firsthand.

Julie Anne

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Re: JTA's Inclement Weather Plan
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2007, 10:26:54 AM »
8 inches of rain in a short time, is pretty intense.  I live and Springfield and experienced the flooding firsthand.

yes, I live in Springfield too, not disputing the amount/timing of the rainfall, but coming from a city below sea level the flooding was about the same. Since Jacksonville is not below sea level why is this? This was more of a comment on the conditions of our infrastructure/drainage then weather ;)

fsujax

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Re: JTA's Inclement Weather Plan
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2007, 10:39:28 AM »
At the time the rain fell, we were having a Nor'easter (like now)....seas levels were 1-2 ft higher and therefore the river was higher, forcing the water up Hogans and McCoy's Creeks.  If you have noticed the past several days at high tides, there is flooding around Market St, this is due to the higher than normal tides. We sit right at sea level and anytime there is a persistent onshore wind this can happen.  We have no pumps like New Orleans to ease the flooding.  San marco experineces the same problems, even with pumps.   ;D

Ocklawaha

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Re: JTA's Inclement Weather Plan
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2007, 10:53:36 AM »
Quote
I live in Springfield too, not disputing the amount/timing of the rainfall, but coming from a city below sea level the flooding was about the same. Since Jacksonville is not below sea level why is this? This was more of a comment on the conditions of our infrastructure/drainage then weather

Old buildings tend to have very small pipes, old plumbing that requires expensive rebuilding. Cities are no different. If you are not from here, you should know that Florida has several different types of land forms, complete with unique vegetation, with only a slight change in elevation. Many of our older neighborhoods were built on "black" hammock land. Black (the color of the muck soil) Hammock (land with just enough elevation from water level to support pine and palmetto growth) was once the dominate land form in much of Duval County. It still is in Nassau County. As pioneer settlements came into the state and the Great Florida Boom of the 1920's took off, hundreds of land and drainage companies laid out plots in hammock ground. To some extent it still happens, St. Johns Town Center and Baymeadows, as late as 1960, were listed on area maps as one huge wetlands known as "Tiger Hole Swamp." So add to the question the older smaller pipe, the building on low ground, and 8" of rain or one good Tropical Storm and you have a recipe for disaster. The best thing a newbie Floridian can do is get out to Cary State Forest (Hammock) and take a good hard look at the soil and flora of the area. Next head to Goldhead State Park (Highlands), South of Middleburg, and compare what you have seen. You'll never buy property the same again in Florida, I promise.  




Native Hammock Land at Wekiva Springs and Florida Highlands in South Fl.

Ocklawaha
« Last Edit: October 02, 2007, 11:04:23 AM by Ocklawaha »

Julie Anne

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Re: JTA's Inclement Weather Plan
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2007, 12:05:02 PM »
Now that is some interesting information, I had no idea! I think in New Orleans, it isn;t just the pumps alone, but a combination of the pumps and the levy system. I guess if you pump the water you have to have some place to put it that will not eventually lead back to the area you are pumping  :)

Ocklawaha

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Re: JTA's Inclement Weather Plan
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2007, 12:25:27 PM »
Glad to help. Today, with all the rain and wind, it's like filling a glass with water, then blowing across the top of it. That water is going to leap out on the far side of the glass. Ditto with our current storm system (and many others). When the winds build, they blow that water into the coast. The result is beach erosion. The not so well known result is also pushing that water up the inland rivers. When it reaches the former hammock land, it just rolls over it. Like New Orleans, there is no place to put it. Like you said, sort of like digging a hole in the ocean...it doesn't work.

During a Tropical Storm or Hurricane, this is called the Storm Surge, on top of this you must add the tidal surge (that natural ebb and flow from the high or low tide). Then as New Orleans found, add to that any high surf (waves) over and above the surge. A storm surge, plus a tidal surge, plus high surf, plus a tsunami wave would probably pretty well wreck 1/2 of the City. Folks in the Highlands around Hecksher Drive, Ft. Caroline or Middleburg, will just be watching...unaffected.

New friends, also need to consider, lightning safety. It kills more people then all other natural disasters each year. Be aware, this part of Florida catches more tornado's then the rest of the State, with increasing frequency over the last 100 years. We also have had 4 recorded earthquakes, though none very serious, it does pose a question of threat. The faults are St. Augustine and Charleston. There are no known faults in Jacksonville, but we could still get the shakes.
 


Ocklawaha