Touring the Northside: BRT North Corridor Photo Tour

[Metro Jacksonville]

Touring the Northside: BRT North Corridor Photo Tour



After years of protest by Metro Jacksonville, urban advocates, and concerned citizens, JTA has decided to alter their bus rapid transit plan.  Today, Metro Jacksonville provides the public with a photo tour JTA's proposed BRT corridor and the surrounding environment.

Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/content/view/972

[Bike Jax]

I wish we would stop calling this plan of JTA's a BRT. It is not a BRT. BRT's run in lanes physically separated from any other lanes of traffic. Those BRT lanes and stops look more like a something a train would run on than a lane of traffic. These Separated lanes are not affected by other traffic, be it crossing paths or delayed by accidents that block the BRT lane.

The house in the last picture is the home of a good friend of mine and knowing how much time, effort and money he has put into restoring his home. I would hate see what would happen to the value of his home should JTA start run their Express Buses down Pearl.

There is not one single example of a BRT anywhere in the world creating a positive impact on the surrounding land it travels through. A BRT here is a complete waste of time, money and resources and will only leave Jacksonville another 20 years behind the rest of country when it comes to mass transit.

[uptowngirl]

Amen! BRT does not run thorugh an already busy two lane residential area. What a JOKE! If the BLVD route is bad, Pearl is a Nightmare. IS the city intent on destroying our neighborhood? It appears they would like to drive down our housing value but continuing raising our taxes? Perhaps they want crack alley back?!!!!!

[tufsu1]

This article has been posted in another thread...but it clearly explains what is and is not BRT

http://www.planetizen.com/node/36406

[jtwestside]

Thank you for putting this photo tour up. It really helps me to visualize where the BRT is planned.

I can see that making a straight shot is what is most important, but I can't help but think that this will seriously hurt any residential development around it. Specifically in Springfield. I think avoiding residential should most important. Keep it on Main/8th at all cost. And I would say kill it if possible. There has to be a better solution to connecting the Northside with Downtown. This City is so backwards and short sighted sometimes. We should be demanding better.

The house in the last picture is the home of a good friend of mine and knowing how much time, effort and money he has put into restoring his home. I would hate see what would happen to the value of his home should JTA start run their Express Buses down Pearl.

Wasn't the home in the last photo was on the tour of homes? If so, tell your friend it was my favorite and it is indeed very nicely restored.

[JeffreyS]

This has nice potential for enhancing the Skyway. I still prefer rail but this looks like a route that overall could use mass transit.

[Doctor_K]

Regarding the part about running this 'BRT' up Main St:

Could it not start at Rosa Parks Station, jog down Union, turn north onto Main, then snake back over to 8th to take advantage of having the Shands complex as a route stop?

Or is that too 'snakey' of a route, and defeat the whole purpose?  Just a thought.

[thelakelander]

This route is not a replacement for rail.  Its to move existing buses through the Northside at a quicker pace.  Even with a rail system, some bus enhancement in this form will still be needed. 

Regarding Boulevard Street through Springfield, I'd urge everyone to consider the neighborhoods around Springfield as well.  The negative impact on Brentwood would be greater than that in Springfield's residential sections.

Imo, decent bus service in a city the size of Jacksonville is needed and it should not come in the form of dedicated busways (previous plan).  However, its better to keep express buses on commercial streets even if the route ends up 'snakey'. 

I also agree its time to call it what it is.  This is not a BRT system.  As indicated by tufsu1's link, its Rapid (Express) Bus.

The Rapid Bus

The remaining systems really are not really BRT at all. They are instead repackaged express buses. These lines run in traffic along regular bus lines but have limited stops and some of the special features of BRT including ITS, stations, low/floor level boarding, branded vehicles, and off vehicle ticket vending. Examples include the San Pablo Rapid Bus in Oakland, California and the Metro Rapid Bus system in Los Angeles. Both run on the street with regular buses that have red “Rapid” badges. Costs for these systems only include new buses, station canopies, and necessary technological changes such as GPS for real time arrival and signal pre-emption.

[Bike Jax]

This route is not a replacement for rail.  Its to move existing buses through the Northside at a quicker pace.  Even with a rail system, some bus enhancement in this form will still be needed.

Lake, I totally agree that buses are needed and I'm not against a BRT system. I'm just against the JTA's system plan. We need buses. We also need trains, street cars, the skyway, and bikeways and we need them to all work together. What we need is a transportation master plan that has what runs where, when and how each integrates with the other.

Other wise we end up bits and pieces of transport that doesn't go anywhere or work with other types of transit. (Cough: Skyway)

[thelakelander]

I definately agree.  I don't think one penny should be invested on anything without an integrated master plan.

[zoo]

Main St already has bus, and will have trolley. This route should be on Jefferson where it disturbs no residential or commercial in historic Springfield, and does not separate the community's residents from the historic park system.

[thelakelander]

With out a doubt, a bus corridor connecting several northside neighborhoods is better suited for commercial strips (it can actually help these) than residential districts.  How often does the bus run down Main?  Is it really a negative if the existing bus service became more reliable (a bus every 10 minutes) running down Main, as opposed to Boulevard?

The problem with Jefferson is it dead ends into the Shands complex.  A run down Jefferson and shift over to Boulevard to continue north, still puts it in the middle of dense residential neighborhoods (New Springfield / Brentwood).  Whatever path is chosen should not put one neighborhood's fortunes or success at the downfall of another.

[zoo]

Jefferson meets 10th at a curved intersection in front of the UF Proton Therapy Institute (the BRT wouldn't even have to stop), so it could easily jog back onto Boulevard. Or better, yet, jog west onto Davis.

With out a doubt, a bus corridor connecting several northside neighborhoods is better suited for commercial strips

I disagree completely. The doubt factor is that part of the "commercial strip" goes through a National Historic District. More buses on Main would negatively impact the historic character of the community in the same way an increased bus load on Riverside Avenue (instead of the more historically-appropriate potato-chip buses, a.k.a. "trolleys") would.

As much of the historic district character that can be replaced or salvaged should be. Optimally, all buses (not the faux trolley variety) should be shifted out of the historic district, and shorter-line connectors that are sensitive to the history of the area should replace the sections of the routes within the main historic district area.

If the "BRT" were shifted to Jefferson, with a major stop at Jefferson & 8th, Shands complex is served, and connectivity through the historic district could be achieved with a trolley route that goes on 8th to Main (close enough to Rosa Parks to make major connections there), then all the way to Bay St. via Main, and the Landing via Laura. Then you've got historically sensitive connectivity throughout Jacksonville's historic core (even to Riverside/Avondale).

I don't want to see more buses in Springfield's historic district. There are at least 4 routes that operate on Main now, and they are a loud, belching hindrance to a pedestrian-friendly commercial corridor.

[uptowngirl]

When will the BRT be running in the middle of say Cherry St? Or how about along the lake front in San Marco? And what in the heck do all these people up north need to get downtown to do? OK, build a route to get people downtown (killing residential and commercial areas along the way). Once in our deadsville downtown they can go to Hemming Plaza and feed the homeless. Does the city just want everyone gettign to the downtown hub? And let's be honest the areas this is servicing are not your big spenders, so it isn;t as if this will bring more commerce to anyone. What a joke, another example of our idiotic city planning... oh wait, it will get people to the new courthouse if it is ever built and so quickly they won;t miss their trials, or to Shands emergency room for their childs cold or ear ache....silly me

[JeffreyS]

Utg I disagree I think it is a good route for transit over all. None of the lines will be perfect for transit at first as we expect development along transit lines. Since we have no mass transit no one has organized their life in order to take advantage of it.  Employers will move or open so employees and customers can use transit to reach them. Employees and shoppers will value property with access to transit. Now if any kind of bus will spur that I am still skeptical.