Author Topic: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?  (Read 6810 times)

thelakelander

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2024, 09:25:42 AM »
Here's another old thread that will provide some background information for you:

https://www.metrojacksonville.com/forum/index.php/topic,20968.0.html#msg367626
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CityLife

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2024, 09:34:41 AM »
Close 10 other ports in Florida and without a doubt, Jaxport would be significantly larger.

Agree with this. Data on size of ports is all over the place, but for numbers of containers in 2020 Miami had 735k, Everglades (FTL) 499k, Jax 236k, Palm Beach 139k, Tampa 76k, and Manatee 56k. By that measure, Florida has 6 of the largest 30 ports in the US.

For total tonnage in 2022, Tampa had 34 million, Everglades (FTL) 27 million, Jax 18 million, Manatee 10 million, Miami 10 million, Canaveral 6.5 million, and  Palm Beach 2.5 million. Savannah did 41 million in 2022. If you simply combine Tampa and Jax, you exceed Savannah. If you combine the 3 South Florida ports, you are almost tied with Savannah. Jax is definitely held back by so much competition in state.

To JaxDeveloper's earlier point, I-10 doesn't really help Jax much, since the 4 of the 5 largest ports by tonnage are Houston, Louisiana, Corpus Christi, and New Orleans. While Savannah is better situated along I-95.

A little off topic, but still interesting...For cruise passengers Port Canaveral had 4.2 million, Miami 4 million, Everglades 1.7 million, Tampa 400k, Key West 200k, Palm Beach 200k, and Jax 100k.

« Last Edit: April 16, 2024, 10:13:54 AM by CityLife »

CityLife

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2024, 10:15:51 AM »
^I got some of the data from this report. I don't have time to read or summarize the whole thing, but looks like a good read for anyone interested in the topic.

https://flaports.org/wp-content/uploads/Florida-Seaports-Mission-Plan-2023_FINAL-2-27_web.pdf


Jax_Developer

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #18 on: April 16, 2024, 12:51:39 PM »
Not to be nitpicky, but TEU's are a much more reliable method of measurement than others. TEU's are more reliable due to that measurement specifically relating to the capacity of cargo, not the type of cargo. 

In which, Savannah alone outpaces all of Florida combined. So, it really depends how you want to view it.

CityLife

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #19 on: April 16, 2024, 01:49:05 PM »
Not to be nitpicky, but TEU's are a much more reliable method of measurement than others. TEU's are more reliable due to that measurement specifically relating to the capacity of cargo, not the type of cargo. 

In which, Savannah alone outpaces all of Florida combined. So, it really depends how you want to view it.

You are right about the TEU's. Florida's total tonnage is skewed up by Tampa and Everglades processing a lot of liquids, which presumably weigh more than dry cargo. Florida's TEU's in 2022 were 1.3 million Jax, 1.2 million Miami, 1.1 million Everglades, 262k Palm Beach, 178 Tampa, and 177k Manatee. The total is 4.3 million TEU's, whereas Savannah did 5.8 million TEU's in 2022.

That said, the point still remains that there would be more parity between Jax and Savannah if not for competition in state. If the State of Florida had all of it's federal lobbying power, business development efforts, and state funding focused on one mega port, rather than several medium/large ports; it would inevitably be more successful.

Jax does have a big advantage right now over the South Florida and Tampa ports in terms of housing affordability, labor costs/availability, availability of developable land near the port, cost of warehouses/industrial space, and proximity to markets outside of Florida. It does seem like Jax has to make a move, or risk allowing Savannah to grow into a regional hegemon.

Jax_Developer

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #20 on: April 16, 2024, 02:35:10 PM »
Not to be nitpicky, but TEU's are a much more reliable method of measurement than others. TEU's are more reliable due to that measurement specifically relating to the capacity of cargo, not the type of cargo. 

In which, Savannah alone outpaces all of Florida combined. So, it really depends how you want to view it.

You are right about the TEU's. Florida's total tonnage is skewed up by Tampa and Everglades processing a lot of liquids, which presumably weigh more than dry cargo. Florida's TEU's in 2022 were 1.3 million Jax, 1.2 million Miami, 1.1 million Everglades, 262k Palm Beach, 178 Tampa, and 177k Manatee. The total is 4.3 million TEU's, whereas Savannah did 5.8 million TEU's in 2022.

That said, the point still remains that there would be more parity between Jax and Savannah if not for competition in state. If the State of Florida had all of it's federal lobbying power, business development efforts, and state funding focused on one mega port, rather than several medium/large ports; it would inevitably be more successful.

Jax does have a big advantage right now over the South Florida and Tampa ports in terms of housing affordability, labor costs/availability, availability of developable land near the port, cost of warehouses/industrial space, and proximity to markets outside of Florida. It does seem like Jax has to make a move, or risk allowing Savannah to grow into a regional hegemon.

Exactly this. And to your point above, I'm assuming that JaxPort is the only one Florida port that has a viable chance to compete with Savannah, in any way. After dredging, I'm surprised there hasn't been an effort to expand the existing footprint of the overall port's capacity.

Very interesting articles attached Lake & I'll dig into those this weekend. I'd like to figure out what differences surround the funds involved in making these large projects happen. My gut reaction is, we are due for something state or federal! Why dredge without expanding? The South Florida ports are great, but many of them are maxed or have immense land costs surrounding them. (Or a poor location). We seem to have the ability to expand, and have the right economics to do so. We are still a top warehouse market, and some of the larger projects locally do compete with Savannah's warehouse landscape. Between the two cities, I'm not sure there's a stronger warehouse belt in the country right now.

thelakelander

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #21 on: April 16, 2024, 04:00:07 PM »
When the feds did not provide adequate funding for the Savannah River's dredging (JAXPORT got some federal funding), the state of Georgia stepped in and funded the entire project. That's a great funding advantage. Barring a natural disaster, JAXPORT will likely always play second fiddle to Savannah and Charleston.
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Jax_Developer

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #22 on: April 16, 2024, 04:35:50 PM »
I'm not suggesting we won't ever be in their shadow. Simply, how can we leech off them more than we are now? They are projecting to grow their demand more by the end of the decade, than Jax currently services annually. It seems to be a combo of a lack of state funding, and the sheer amount of federal lands owned on the St. Johns that hinder our port's expansion.

thelakelander

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #23 on: April 16, 2024, 05:49:10 PM »
What do you think about Jaxport's current expansion plans? Crowley's, Keystone's or JEA's?
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Jax_Developer

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #24 on: April 16, 2024, 06:08:37 PM »
What do you think about Jaxport's current expansion plans? Crowley's, Keystone's or JEA's?

Crowley - Does this have a capacity increase? Never opposed to investment & improvement but does this "add" to JaxPort? LNG is a significant play for the future.

Keystone - Is this the only private market expansion right now? This seems to be one of the only large parcels that has traded with port capabilities & not intended for shipyards.

JEA - Can we get this one going?

Does Southeastern Toyota moving open up new capacity or is it the shifting of existing capacity?

thelakelander

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #25 on: April 16, 2024, 06:24:40 PM »
I don't know what all Keystone is doing but they are getting state money to elevate Wigmore Street/Talleyrand Avenue over their railroad tracks to accommodate expansion.

Quote
The project includes the planning, design, and construction of a vehicular overpass spanning a section of Wigmore Street
in Jacksonville. Wigmore Street is a two-lane roadway located in a heavily industrialized section
of Jacksonville; industries which include seaports, manufacturing, distribution, and related businesses. Wigmore Street is a
key transportation corridor for these industrial entities and connects these industries to other parts of Jacksonville and to
surrounding cities and counties. Expansion and addition of new industry at and near Wigmore Street is occurring and is
desired by the city. There are two existing at-grade railroad crossings at Wigmore Street, and two additional at-grade
crossings are already under construction. The proposed two-lane vehicular overpass will span all four at-grade railroad
crossings so as to alleviate expected vehicular congestion and rail to vehicle conflicts and safety hazards.

https://www.flsenate.gov/PublishedContent/Session/FiscalYear/FY2024-25/LocalFundingInitiativeRequests/FY2024-25_S3336.pdf

They also have a plan to build a new rail spur from the CSX line that runs through Evergreen Cemetery. That spur would also be elevated over Evergreen Avenue, just south of the cemetery and Long Branch Creek. I assume they must have or be acquiring the large tract of property south of Long Branch Creek between Evergreen Avenue and Wigmore Street, just north of the NS railroad line.


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thelakelander

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #26 on: April 16, 2024, 06:30:22 PM »
A new JAXPORT tenant will take over the 79-acre Southeast Toyota property off Talleyrand. This article states that Enstructure will become one of JaxPort's largest tenants, employing roughly 300 to 400 workers.

https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/local/2024/01/22/jaxport-approves-lease-with-enstructure-for-southeast-toyota-space/72286557007/

They'll develop an additional 200,000 square feet of warehouse space on the property. Cargo shipped will be a mix of breakbulk, dry bulk, vehicles and containers. I don't know the details of everything JaxPort is planning but it does appear that they aren't standing put.
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thelakelander

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Charles Hunter

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #28 on: April 16, 2024, 06:48:13 PM »
The North Florida TPO is proposing a study to look at the connections between Blount Island and Heckscher Drive in their Draft Budget (called the Unified Planning Work Program). The study would cost $100,000 and include
Quote
Task 5.6
This study will investigate different intersection and grade separation concepts and impacts for SR 105 from New Berlin Rd E. to W. of Blount Island Blvd (1.3 Miles). The study will evaluate transportation needs for the continued long-term development of JAXPORT's Blount Island Marine Terminal (BIMT) as well as future growth and opportunities to improve freight connections to existing and future freight clusters in the area. Furthermore, the study will evaluate opportunities to improve roadway and railroad safety along corridor by eliminating at grade crossings and sustain and enhance the ports strategic seaport military value and readiness to continue to support force deployment during contingencies and other national defense emergencies at BIMT & Marine Corps Support Facility Blount Island (MCSF-BI)

https://northfloridatpo.com/uploads/documents/North-Florida-TPO-2024-25-to-2025-26-Unified-Planning-Work-Program-Draft-3-15-24.pdf

thelakelander

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Re: Explosive Port Growth in Savannah, GA - How do we take part?
« Reply #29 on: April 16, 2024, 06:55:21 PM »
Here are the plans for Keystone's rail project along Long Branch Creek:

https://usace.contentdm.oclc.org/utils/getfile/collection/p16021coll15/id/3452
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