Author Topic: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C  (Read 2992 times)

jaxlongtimer

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2021, 05:37:37 PM »
They are confident that they will figure out solutions to all of these issues, in terms of what they want for their own system.

Confident or cocky?  Confidence without foundational support is cockiness in my book.

I don't see any specific evidence from JTA regarding how they will solve currently unsolved or unresolved AV issues before others, in the time frame they have laid out for themselves or for the $400 +/- million budget they have proposed.

The Emperor is naked here and it needs to be called out.

jaxlongtimer

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #16 on: April 19, 2021, 06:39:53 PM »
In covering the accident this week of two dead in a Tesla car accident, CNBC reported the below in which Tesla confirms they do not yet have autonomous vehicles.  I am sure Elon Musk and Tesla will be impressed that JTA thinks they do and are prepared to pack up to 15 persons (or more in their fabled "platoons") in their vehicles, not just two.  Who volunteers to be a JTA guinea pig?

Quote
Tesla Autopilot and FSD are not capable of controlling the electric vehicles in all normal driving circumstances.

In a letter to the California DMV late last year, according to records obtained by CNBC and others, Tesla lawyers said that “neither Autopilot nor FSD Capability is an autonomous system.” And in their owners’ manuals, Tesla cautions drivers: “The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/18/no-one-was-driving-in-tesla-crash-that-killed-two-men-in-spring-texas-report.html

Update from CNN:

Quote
...There have been numerous criticisms of the Tesla Autopilot system from safety experts, including the use of the name "Autopilot," which some of those critics say encourages owners to believe the car can actually drive itself.

The National Transportation Safety Board, when issuing a report on a 2018 fatal crash involving a Tesla using Autopilot, said that the car maker was not doing enough to ensure that drivers remained aware of their surroundings and ready to take control of the car in order to avoid accidents.

"This tragic crash clearly demonstrates the limitations of advanced driver assistance systems available to consumers today," said NTSB Chairman Robert Sumwalt in a February 2020 report on the 2018 crash in Mountainview, California. "There is not a vehicle currently available to US consumers that is self-driving. Period. Every vehicle sold to US consumers still requires the driver to be actively engaged in the driving task, even when advanced driver assistance systems are activated."...

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/19/business/tesla-fatal-crash-no-one-in-drivers-seat/index.html

I don't think it is too much of a stretch to assume that the last comment also applies to commercial applications as well.  Maybe JTA needs to stop calling its vehicles "autonomous" at this time.


WAJAS

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #17 on: April 19, 2021, 08:20:44 PM »
JTA doesn't need something that is fully autonomous for this system. They only need something close to level 4. Level 4 autonomous systems have environmental detection, can perform all driving tasks under specific circumstances (known route), but require the ability for a remote human override in case of unforeseen circumstances. This is because it's a fixed route service, which means the technology can be tailored to the specific route conditions on that fixed route. Tesla's point is that we are far off from being able to just take any car and autonomously drive on any road wherever I end up.

Level 4 AVs already exist commercially. For example, Waymo in Arizona is running a taxi service without a safety driver in the seat.

A good reference on the levels of vehicle autonomy: https://www.synopsys.com/automotive/autonomous-driving-levels.html

thelakelander

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #18 on: April 19, 2021, 08:28:39 PM »
All they want is Level 4.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

fsu813

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #19 on: April 19, 2021, 08:43:14 PM »
I think I have a solution, combining the latest trends in tech and Jacksonville transit into one perfect game changer:

Autonomous Scooters.

Full speed ahead! (pun intended)
« Last Edit: April 19, 2021, 09:08:45 PM by fsu813 »

marcuscnelson

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #20 on: April 19, 2021, 09:09:39 PM »
We'll be on Melissa Ross today to talk a bit about this.

Figured I’d link it here for anyone who missed it this morning.

https://news.wjct.org/post/proposed-gas-tax-suddath-wjct-s-earth-day-national-stress-awareness-month
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

thelakelander

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #21 on: April 19, 2021, 09:13:26 PM »
I just came from a Cosmo community meeting where Councilman Al Ferraro spoke briefly. He's a firm no to the gas tax....period.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

marcuscnelson

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #22 on: April 19, 2021, 09:24:13 PM »
I just came from a Cosmo community meeting where Councilman Al Ferraro spoke briefly. He's a firm no to the gas tax....period.

I suppose it might be time to start putting together a Lot J-style list of where votes are likely to fall.

If I remember correctly (which is to say I could be wrong), they only need a simple majority in this case, which largely improves the chances. So far we have Diamond and Ferraro who are outright opposed to taxes in general. Then you have Carlucci and Cumber, who seem generally in favor of the tax but concerned about the U2C portion. Then Hazouri who from the sound of things is all in. So the question over the next few weeks is where the other 14 stand, and how those positions could change over the coming months as this is hashed out in public and behind closed doors. I’m thinking the ones to watch will be Carrico, Cumber, and Gaffney, whose districts are mentioned directly in the project list.
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

thelakelander

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #23 on: April 19, 2021, 10:45:05 PM »
Becton is also a no. I believe Carlucci is a yes and Cumber will likely be a no.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

Steve

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2021, 07:39:54 AM »
I think Carlucci is a Yes, but not a solid one. I think a major public backlash about the Skyway could sway him.

jaxjags

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2021, 10:17:03 AM »
I understand the opposition to the gas tax increase as it relates to the Skyway/U2C. But we need to remember this was to allow a reduction in the number of septic tank dependent neighborhoods.

We need to find and suggest an alternate funding approach. Water drainage/retention system non valorem  tax increase? This tax already exist. Increase it. This type of problem can no longer exist in a city of 1,000,000 people. Unacceptable.

thelakelander

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #26 on: April 20, 2021, 10:43:36 AM »
^The easiest thing with the gas tax proposal would be to reduce the percentage of funds proposed to be dedicated to the Skyway/U2C. If the LOGT covered a traditional local 25% match to what is currently not funded (remember the Bay Street Innovation Corridor is already 100% funded), that would only be $95 million. That means an additional $284 million in LOGT revenue would be available to fund a variety of needs around the entire city.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

thelakelander

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #27 on: April 20, 2021, 12:30:46 PM »
Another thing to consider is that much of the U2C proposal is not eminent. Looking through the documents on the JTA website, we could be a good decade away from seeing an extension to the stadium and Riverside actually completed. We're another 15 to 20 years away from seeing extensions to San Marco and Springfield completed. The vehicles being tested now will likely be obsolete by then.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

fsu813

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2021, 01:35:50 PM »
Autonomous shuttles, visibly similar to JTA's model, are coming to Yellowstone National Park next month:

https://www.nps.gov/yell/learn/management/automated-shuttle-pilot.htm

https://www.facebook.com/151418891540140/posts/4575317772483541/
« Last Edit: April 20, 2021, 01:37:29 PM by fsu813 »

jaxlongtimer

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Re: The Jaxson asks JTA 12 questions about the U2C
« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2021, 02:05:14 PM »
Autonomous shuttles, visibly similar to JTA's model, are coming to Yellowstone National Park next month:

https://www.nps.gov/yell/learn/management/automated-shuttle-pilot.htm

https://www.facebook.com/151418891540140/posts/4575317772483541/

Interesting although it is only limited to a Yellowstone campground, not the entire park.  At Yellowstone, the real test would be to survive the harsh winters there  ;D which could give Alaska a run for the money.  Would also be interesting to see how long the batteries last propelling these vehicles up and down steep and long grades found in many of these parks.  Finally, many park roads are narrow, curvy/have blind curves, and lack full markings that might serve as benchmarks for AV's.

Many major national parks already run shuttle buses (e.g. Denali, Grand Canyon, Zion, etc.) but they are regular sized so it would take quite a few of these to match their capacity.  Also, some run long distances (e.g. Denali's road is 90 miles long) so being slow moving could be a hindrance too.  Being electrified would be appealing to the NPS.  Yosemite has had issues with too many vehicle exhaust fumes getting trapped in its valley at certain times over the years.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2021, 05:45:10 PM by jaxlongtimer »