Author Topic: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?  (Read 1552 times)

thelakelander

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 30472
    • Modern Cities
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #30 on: January 26, 2020, 10:22:42 AM »
Yep - and Khan is a fraud.

He's just a businessman looking to maximize investment profits. Hard to blame him for making a mockery of the mayor's team's negotiating skills.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

bl8jaxnative

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 338
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #31 on: January 26, 2020, 12:07:07 PM »
Skyway ridership has improved a lot.  Every time I drive past their cars always have people in them now.

When it's cold, a lot of homeless people use it to warm up.

bl8jaxnative

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 338
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #32 on: January 26, 2020, 12:49:42 PM »
If it's concentrated and that critical mass is established, it will pull people from surrounding areas the same way that Riverside and San Marco's cluster of businesses do today. What the residents earn would play a real strong role in the type of businesses. You'll either get a Dollar General or DGX.

As a side note, don't underestimate Dollar General's push to sell to higher income households.  Their biggest area of growth right now in zips with household incomes above $80K.

Anywhooooooo.......... Riverside and Marco are great examples.  When you stop and look-look at San Marco, there isn't really a lot there.  NOthing is really big.  There's no anchor tennant of stores pulling people in.  There's a mix of things with a focus on food.  It works well.


It may be counter intuitive to some.  This old piece works really well for explaining the need for clustering.   The chess store owner thought a new chess store across the street would cut into his sales.  It didn't.  It grew them.

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=121304873

"
JOFFE-WALT: Well, it was that way. And then one day, Laurence Nash, the owner, says one of his employees, actually a protege of his, stabbed him in the back. He set up a shop right across the street.
"

"
JOFFE-WALT: The fancy term for this is economies of agglomeration. It means that sellers make this basic calculation.

DAVIDSON: Sure, you lose a lot of customers to the chess store across the street, but getting more traffic evens things out. Village Chess is no longer one specialty shop on its own, it's now part of New York's chess district.

JOFFE-WALT: New York has a lighting district, a plants district, a kitchen supply district, an Indian restaurant district and then there is this.
"

tufsu1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11037
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #33 on: January 27, 2020, 09:24:13 AM »
The only new residential units that have come online in the Northbank since 2006, have been from the Barnett Bank building rehab (107 market rate units) and the former Lerner Building rehab (58 college student communal suites configured in 3 and 4 bedroom layouts).

in the Northbank core, yes - but there are the buildings in LaVilla
« Last Edit: January 27, 2020, 10:59:43 AM by tufsu1 »

thelakelander

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 30472
    • Modern Cities
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #34 on: January 27, 2020, 09:48:29 AM »
Yeah, I wouldn't count LaVilla as being a part of the Northbank core.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

Tacachale

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7751
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #35 on: January 27, 2020, 09:55:47 AM »
Yeah, I wouldn't count LaVilla as being a part of the Northbank core.

Yes, that's part of the point of the article. That said, LaVilla is much closer and better connected to the Northbank core than the other neighborhoods.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

tufsu1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11037
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #36 on: January 27, 2020, 11:01:01 AM »
^ agreed - was just noting that fieldafm seemed to be talking about the Northbank as a whole - it is clear that the units in LaVilla have done very little so far to enhance downtown vibrancy

Steve

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3225
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #37 on: January 27, 2020, 11:31:30 AM »
^ agreed - was just noting that fieldafm seemed to be talking about the Northbank as a whole - it is clear that the units in LaVilla have done very little so far to enhance downtown vibrancy

Yep. I think the issue is that even if those folks wanted to grab dinner at Bellwether or something, it's a long walk. Those people would just drive.

thelakelander

  • The Jaxson
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 30472
    • Modern Cities
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #38 on: January 27, 2020, 12:53:55 PM »
Yeah, if considering Hemming Park as the center of the Northbank, everything in LaVilla falls outside of the 1/4 mile pedestrian walkshed. This basically means people are more likely to drive than walk between the two since there's nothing worth walking to in the gap between them.





"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

Tacachale

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7751
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #39 on: January 27, 2020, 01:53:47 PM »
This is an area where more specific data on the individual neighborhoods would be helpful. Right now, there's no way to know how many people live in the Northbank core vs. LaVilla vs. Brooklyn, etc., or whether the individual units are clustered or walkable within those areas. I suspect that LaVilla doesn't have nearly enough people, let alone people in close distance, to have an impact on the Northbank.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

Non-RedNeck Westsider

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4662
  • Politically Agnostic
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #40 on: January 27, 2020, 02:18:13 PM »
If only there was an alternative transit option to get all of those Lavilla residents into the core or to a grocery store or...
A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.
-Douglas Adams

Peter Griffin

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 200
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #41 on: January 27, 2020, 02:21:02 PM »
If only there was an alternative transit option to get all of those Lavilla residents into the core or to a grocery store or...

Yeah, all the sudden the Skyway doesn't exist? People on the forum seem to think walking or driving are the only two methods of transit. Skyway, bus, car, Uber, the closer the better no matter which method of transit you're using, and LaVilla does well to capitalize on that and put lots of people in very close proximity to all of Jax's best neighborhoods and the core of Downtown.

Non-RedNeck Westsider

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4662
  • Politically Agnostic
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #42 on: January 27, 2020, 02:53:35 PM »
TBF, it will take riders to Hemming, but without a spur into Brooklyn's Fres Market, theres still no connectivity with a true grocery store.   And unless things have changed, it doesn't operate after 8pm or on weekends. 

JTA basically waited for residential to be built in proximity of a station before essentially scrapping the entire thing while moving forward with an untested UTC option.

My comment was more TiC than anything.
A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.
-Douglas Adams

Peter Griffin

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 200
Re: Will 10K residents really revitalize Downtown Jax?
« Reply #43 on: January 27, 2020, 02:59:42 PM »
theres still no connectivity with a true grocery store.   And unless things have changed, it doesn't operate after 8pm or on weekends. 

Those are good points I forgot about