Author Topic: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020  (Read 67270 times)

marcuscnelson

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #525 on: December 03, 2020, 12:37:49 PM »
This meeting is just… such a mess.
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey

Steve

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #526 on: December 03, 2020, 12:56:13 PM »
However, he did repeat that the full assessment for the stadium ask won't be ready until 2023. Which to me introduces the possibility that they didn't want those negotiations to happen under Curry.

Not sure I have that same take. Curry hasn't exactly been a shrewd negotiator here. Why WOULDN'T you want them to be under Curry?

thelakelander

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #527 on: December 03, 2020, 01:12:57 PM »
What's the deal with Hazouri and Bowman?
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jaxlongtimer

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #528 on: December 03, 2020, 01:28:11 PM »
What's the deal with Hazouri and Bowman?

Bowman works for the Chamber (and future mayoral candidate and Curry friend, Daniel Davis) so you can take it from there.

jaxlongtimer

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #529 on: December 03, 2020, 01:48:31 PM »
Looks like Hardin/Lamping are backing up some on more concessions and possibly the timeline for approval.  Hazouri is deferring any action today.

If this passes, it will be quite a bit different than what Curry and team negotiated if still not a good deal for taxpayers.  Shows that Curry's posture that this was best and a well negotiated deal that was fair to taxpayers and had to be rushed through was way off the mark just like his JEA pronouncements.

As a CPA, Curry is an embarrassment both to his profession and as our mayor.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2020, 01:50:54 PM by jaxlongtimer »

Charles Hunter

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #530 on: December 03, 2020, 01:51:43 PM »
As a CPA, Curry is an embarrassment both to his profession and as our mayor.

What's the CPA equivalent of being disbarred?

jaxlongtimer

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #531 on: December 03, 2020, 02:09:19 PM »
As a CPA, Curry is an embarrassment both to his profession and as our mayor.

What's the CPA equivalent of being disbarred?

I believe the State Board of Accountancy pulls your license  8).

Ken_FSU

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #532 on: December 03, 2020, 02:24:57 PM »
Looks like Hardin/Lamping are backing up some on more concessions and possibly the timeline for approval.  Hazouri is deferring any action today.

If this passes, it will be quite a bit different than what Curry and team negotiated if still not a good deal for taxpayers.  Shows that Curry's posture that this was best and a well negotiated deal that was fair to taxpayers and had to be rushed through was way off the mark just like his JEA pronouncements.

As a CPA, Curry is an embarrassment both to his profession and as our mayor.

Even if additional concessions are made, I still think what we're left with is ultimately a worse deal for taxpayers that what we started with.

As one member of the DIA best put it, the project denominator has decreased, but the public numerator hasn't. We're still putting up the same $208 million+ in cash as we were in the beginning, but we're getting a significantly smaller project than what first came to City Council in terms of hotel rooms, residential units, office space, surface parking, and structured parking.

And most of the "concessions" have played out like a children's shell game.

The $65 million grant turned into a $65 million broadbox loan where the Jags heroically agreed to put up the $13 million initial deposit. But the cash remained the same, as the hotel's $12.5 million rev grant was then quietly switched to a $12.5 cash completion bonus.

The Jags agree to parking concessions, but quietly, insfrastructure savings are shifted from being returned to the city to being put in a capital maintenance fund for the developer.

Adding a $1.50 surcharge to hotel rooms doesn't cost the Jags a dime.

Meeting was largely a disgrace AGAIN today, and was almost a mirror image of the meeting two weeks ago that went so badly off the rails. Hazouri and Bowman screaming at each other. Hazouri going wildly off agenda. No one quite sure how procedure was supposed to work.

Whole thing was punctuated by Tommy Hazouri (with the help of Carlucci) blatantly stalling out the clock and making a unilateral decision to defer a vote.

As a resident of this city, the Mayberry act is just embarrassing.

We know where the major pieces of the deal are going to fall.

And we know the consequences of voting either way.

Put on your bigboy pants as a City Council, and vote yes or no, rather than potentially stalling this misery into 2021. If the breadbox loan is a deal-breaker, vote the entire bill down and let the cards fall where they may.

I tell you what though, Tuesday should be one of the most fascinating meetings in City history.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2020, 02:32:42 PM by Ken_FSU »

Steve

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #533 on: December 03, 2020, 02:37:23 PM »
Put on your bigboy pants as a City Council, and vote yes or no, rather than potentially stalling this misery into 2021. If the breadbox loan is a deal-breaker, vote the entire bill down and let the cards fall where they may.

I tell you what though, Tuesday should be one of the most fascinating meetings in City history.

Agreed. If that stupid "loan" were to go away, I bet this would pass 19-0. But that's a significant concession by the Jags.

JBTripper

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #534 on: December 03, 2020, 04:05:25 PM »
As a CPA, Curry is an embarrassment both to his profession and as our mayor.

What's the CPA equivalent of being disbarred?

Unaccounted For.

Charles Hunter

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #535 on: December 03, 2020, 05:39:12 PM »
As a CPA, Curry is an embarrassment both to his profession and as our mayor.

What's the CPA equivalent of being disbarred?

Unaccounted For.

Thank you for providing balance.

Tacachale

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #536 on: December 03, 2020, 07:13:31 PM »
What's the deal with Hazouri and Bowman?

Bowman’s a “company man” and kind of prickly, especially when he’s not getting his way. Hazouri is one of the few who has both the will and the juice to buck him, so it’s not surprising they clash. I have a hard time telling what Bowman’s even complaining about, let alone what he’s trying to do with these outbursts.
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jaxlongtimer

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #537 on: December 04, 2020, 05:46:02 PM »
Today, Nate Monroe riffs on the fallacies of the "breadbox loan," which in reality is a grant based on the analysis presented.  Another misleading characterization by the Lot J team.  Add a new twist, a 6 figure annual management fee paid by the City for a trust account owned by the City but negotiated by the Jags.  Go figure.

https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/columns/nate-monroe/2020/12/04/mayor-lenny-curry-and-jacksonville-jaguars-mislead-lot-j-loan/3825257001/
« Last Edit: December 04, 2020, 09:39:00 PM by jaxlongtimer »

landfall

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #538 on: December 04, 2020, 06:39:49 PM »
Just thinking, "The Banks" in Cincinnati looks pretty much almost to a tee what I'd expect for this "game changer." A half-finished cookie cutter project on the cusp of Downtown Cincinnati near the sports/events venues anchored by two large apartment blocks, a mid-upper end hotel and some chain bars/restaurants and a small number of convenience amenities. That looks a lot more like what I am expecting of this than Ballpark Village or Power and Light.  A lot for not a lot. Still, beggars cannot be choosers, or something like that....

Ken_FSU

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Re: Khan, Jaguars expect Lot J development to begin early 2020
« Reply #539 on: December 04, 2020, 07:12:38 PM »
Today, Nate Monroe rifts on the fallacies of the "breadbox loan," which in reality is a grant based on the analysis presented.  Another misleading characterization by the Lot J team.  Add a new twist, a 6 figure annual management fee paid by the City for a trust account owned by the City but negotiated by the Jags.  Go figure.

https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/columns/nate-monroe/2020/12/04/mayor-lenny-curry-and-jacksonville-jaguars-mislead-lot-j-loan/3825257001/

Really good stuff.

The more people know about what this project actually comprises and how the deal is actually structured, the better suited they are to make up their mind whether they think it's a good idea.

City Council included.

And going back to the unnecessary doublespeak and bad optics, I almost think the Jags were better off angling the $65 million as a grant from the get go, rather than pretending it's a loan. A $65 million grant to make the project viable for the developer is probably an easier sell to the public than giving a 50-year, interest-free, faux loan to a Forbes billionaire.