Author Topic: The Ford on Bay  (Read 18830 times)

heights unknown

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #195 on: February 16, 2020, 11:49:30 PM »
Miami went through a similar experience but thousands of units went under construction. When the market blew up, many lost their shirts and new buildings initially sat empty. However, one man's loss is another's gain. Those empty units got filled for reduced prices and when the market improved, that downtown had a base in place to justify and drive more development. Now it is unrecognizable from what it was in 2000.
Tell me about it.
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bl8jaxnative

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #196 on: February 17, 2020, 05:53:22 PM »
Miami went through a similar experience but thousands of units went under construction. When the market blew up, many lost their shirts and new buildings initially sat empty. However, one man's loss is another's gain. Those empty units got filled for reduced prices and when the market improved, that downtown had a base in place to justify and drive more development. Now it is unrecognizable from what it was in 2000.

They've had a nice run thanks to Latin American buyers.  Those buyers have largely dried up.  They may have built themselves right back into another bubble.

thelakelander

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #197 on: February 17, 2020, 06:02:33 PM »
Interesting. It's likely better to be in a bubble with 100k downtown residents already in hand than headed into a recession with 5k spread across 4 square miles and still having to subsidize stick frame garden style apartments.
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MusicMan

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #198 on: February 17, 2020, 06:27:57 PM »
Let's stop comparing Miami to Jacksonville.That's like comparing bananas to sour oranges!

Didn't some dude pay $25 million for a one acre waterfront parcel in Brikell 2 years ago?

heights unknown

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #199 on: February 18, 2020, 12:38:36 AM »
Interesting. It's likely better to be in a bubble with 100k downtown residents already in hand than headed into a recession with 5k spread across 4 square miles and still having to subsidize stick frame garden style apartments.
LOLOL
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heights unknown

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #200 on: February 18, 2020, 12:40:27 AM »
Let's stop comparing Miami to Jacksonville.That's like comparing bananas to sour oranges!

Didn't some dude pay $25 million for a one acre waterfront parcel in Brikell 2 years ago?
Yeah, there's no comparison, none. Miami has the 3rd densest skyline in the nation for a city of close to 500k.
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thelakelander

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #201 on: February 18, 2020, 06:50:49 AM »
Pretty crazy that the skylines were comparable in the 1980s. Same as Jax and Charlotte in the 1990s and Jax and Nashville in early 2000s. Even Orlando, which had a significantly smaller skyline in 1995, looks dramatically different. In Jax, not much has changed since the 1990s completion of the BOA Tower. After missing the fruits of two historic urban real estate boom periods in the first 20 years of the 2000s, the comparable list is looking pretty thin. So we're at a point where places much smaller 30 years ago are now in our peer group.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2020, 06:53:46 AM by thelakelander »
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thelakelander

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #202 on: February 18, 2020, 06:59:21 AM »
Let's stop comparing Miami to Jacksonville.That's like comparing bananas to sour oranges!

Didn't some dude pay $25 million for a one acre waterfront parcel in Brikell 2 years ago?
Yeah, there's no comparison, none. Miami has the 3rd densest skyline in the nation for a city of close to 500k.
There's close to 6 million in that MSA now and it's an international tourism destination. Yeah, it's in a different tier now. No doubt.
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jaxjags

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #203 on: February 18, 2020, 12:24:28 PM »
Question - With the zoning height restrictions along the river could the Ford on Bay buildings be much higher or not?

Steve

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #204 on: February 18, 2020, 12:28:02 PM »
Question - With the zoning height restrictions along the river could the Ford on Bay buildings be much higher or not?

Yes. The Overlay does discuss the stepping up in height as you get away from the river, but certainly it could be taller than 5 floors.

Kerry

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #205 on: February 18, 2020, 03:23:49 PM »
It is probably 5 floors for the same reason almost every other apartment building stops at 5 floors.  The fire codes change when you go above 5 floors.  It takes a lot of floors to cover the cost difference and there isn't demand for that many.
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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #206 on: February 18, 2020, 06:12:02 PM »
Five Floor is plenty.
Why alter/ further clutter visual scenery/ landscape with more concrete, sky view and light blocked? Plenty of “ Density/ Vibrancy”.( Other than $$$$)

Peter Griffin

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #207 on: February 19, 2020, 07:36:45 AM »
It is probably 5 floors for the same reason almost every other apartment building stops at 5 floors.  The fire codes change when you go above 5 floors.  It takes a lot of floors to cover the cost difference and there isn't demand for that many.

Some people on here seem to forget that a project ought to be profitable after construction. We got some people in here saying we ought to build skyscrapers (regardless of their profitability) just to... impress out-of-town investors? That kind of idea sounds like buying a new Cadillac because you wanna show off how good your MLM is doing. Ineffective and unsustainable, all for the sake of TALL BUILDING

thelakelander

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #208 on: February 19, 2020, 08:38:22 AM »
Which is why it is pretty foolish to blow up publicly owned skyscrapers with no real redevelopment plan in place. That's density, you'll likely never get back. You'd be better off giving away the building as the public incentive to help make redevelopment numbers work, as opposed to spending millions to raze and then millions more to replace it with a five story stick frame structure.
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Peter Griffin

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Re: The Ford on Bay
« Reply #209 on: February 19, 2020, 09:21:55 AM »
Which is why it is pretty foolish to blow up publicly owned skyscrapers with no real redevelopment plan in place. That's density, you'll likely never get back. You'd be better off giving away the building as the public incentive to help make redevelopment numbers work, as opposed to spending millions to raze and then millions more to replace it with a five story stick frame structure.

We all know that. You're preaching to the choir. What's done is done, though, I'm focusing on discussing the current situation and development, not lamenting the errors the city has made.