Author Topic: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail  (Read 2746 times)

acme54321

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2018, 10:39:40 AM »
The only major real estate FEC has left in Jax I'm aware of are around the Bowden yard (right by JTB, wouldn't be a bad spot for a station really) and a few areas south.

fieldafm

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2018, 10:55:56 AM »
There are quite a few parcels around Prime Osborne (including the Prime Osborne itself) that either COJ or JTA control. Create a by-right TOD zoning Overlay and setup a LaVilla BID... and you have room for easily more than 1mm square feet of potential commercial/residential space on ready-to-market sites with built-in infrastructure financing at your disposal (along with historic tax credit financing and all sorts of creative incentives for the reuse of Prime Osborne site).... all with direct interstate highway access and rail infrastructure already in place. A company like Brightline would find that very attractive.

That potential blows the doors off anything at Shipyards or District.

Tacachale

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #17 on: September 12, 2018, 10:59:00 AM »
There are quite a few parcels around Prime Osborne (including the Prime Osborne itself) that either COJ or JTA control. Create a by-right TOD zoning Overlay and setup a LaVilla BID... and you have room for easily more than 1mm square feet of potential commercial/residential space on ready-to-market sites with built-in infrastructure financing at your disposal (along with historic tax credit financing and all sorts of creative incentives for the reuse of Prime Osborne site).... all with direct interstate highway access and rail infrastructure already in place. A company like Brightline would find that very attractive.

That potential blows the doors off anything at Shipyards or District.

That would be great - if the city were actively planning for it.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

thelakelander

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #18 on: September 12, 2018, 11:06:21 AM »
^Pretty much this. They don't own any track near downtown Orlando. Sunrail also already serves DT Orlando. The plan in Orlando is to connect Sunrail to Orlando International Airport and Brightline's stop there. I don't see how Orlando's Brightline stop location has any relationship to what may or may not happen in Jax.

That's just my own fear, based on the fact that Brightline has exclusively built their own new stations rather than going into old ones, and that's part of their business model.

I'll try to alleviate your fear somewhat. So far they've built 3 urban stations in Miami, Fort Lauderdale and West Palm Beach. There were no historic stations to take advantage of. Nevertheless, Miami's station (cool place, I visited it last night) is at the site of that city's original station. As for Orlando's station, that's an Orlando airport intermodal center. The airport built it. Brightline is just one of the modes tapping into it. Sunrail will be another transit system served by the airport project. To address Jax, while there is a portion of the old terminal complex remaining, new facilities will have to be built anyway.

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It's much more of a real estate project than a transportation project. And unlike other cities, Jax has given no sign that it's working with Brightline or even preparing for the possibility that they may come here.

Im the South Florida examples, other than Miami (FEC already owned the land), land was purchased for the station sites and surrounding development. In Orlando, that's an airport project, so I'm not sure their coordination has been super extensive. In Jax's situation, the station is owned by the city and is a development site, moreso than anything else along the FEC corridor outside of Bowden Yard (much of this is more suitable for industrial development and wet).

Nothing is on the horizon in Jax takes development out of the equation around the terminal. In fact, the JTA and DIA are working on a LaVilla development strategy right now to better facilitate TOD in the area.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

thelakelander

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2018, 11:11:18 AM »
There are quite a few parcels around Prime Osborne (including the Prime Osborne itself) that either COJ or JTA control. Create a by-right TOD zoning Overlay and setup a LaVilla BID... and you have room for easily more than 1mm square feet of potential commercial/residential space on ready-to-market sites with built-in infrastructure financing at your disposal (along with historic tax credit financing and all sorts of creative incentives for the reuse of Prime Osborne site).... all with direct interstate highway access and rail infrastructure already in place. A company like Brightline would find that very attractive.

That potential blows the doors off anything at Shipyards or District.

That would be great - if the city were actively planning for it.
Efforts are underway now on the creation of a development strategy. The first public meeting was last week. I don't know what the outcome will be but it does seem that an effort for TOD is being made as we speak.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2018, 01:09:22 PM by thelakelander »
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Kiva

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2018, 04:50:07 PM »
I had to look up TOD. The most common results were: Transit Oriented Development and Transfer On Death. https://www.acronymfinder.com/TOD.html Hopefully we are talking about the former! ;D

fieldafm

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2018, 07:23:06 AM »
I had to look up TOD. The most common results were: Transit Oriented Development and Transfer On Death. https://www.acronymfinder.com/TOD.html Hopefully we are talking about the former! ;D

Here's a good look on how Brightline's inter-city passenger rail service is spurring transit oriented development (the fun kind of TOD) around the state
https://www.moderncities.com/article/2016-jul-floridas-higher-speed-rail-tod-takes-shape

ProjectMaximus

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2018, 07:19:31 PM »
They are back to negotiating a potential station in the treasure coast. The RFP for the station says 'walkable to an urban center/downtown.'

thelakelander

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #23 on: September 14, 2018, 07:06:32 AM »
Makes sense. There's no reason for them to build a station in a location where they can't benefit from being in a pedestrian scale environment with density.
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KenFSU

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #24 on: October 15, 2018, 02:47:42 PM »
Jax Chamber, along with the CEO of JTA and representatives from the mayor's office, were in Denver last week learning about Denver's downtown redevelopment efforts.

Apparently everyone was pretty blown away by Union Station, and there was a lot of discussion about how to turn the Prime Osborne back into a transit hub.

Doctor_K

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #25 on: October 15, 2018, 03:30:25 PM »
Well, at least they're talking about doing something like that after yet another trip to another city.  Maybe *this* is finally the beginnings of a turning point towards re-repurposing the P.O.?
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thelakelander

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #26 on: October 15, 2018, 05:22:48 PM »
Yawn. They've known about Denver's station for years. It was included in a 2014 study JTA paid for. Tired of talk. Implement.
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Tacachale

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #27 on: October 15, 2018, 05:57:22 PM »
Yawn. They've known about Denver's station for years. It was included in a 2014 study JTA paid for. Tired of talk. Implement.

One of the bad things about term limits is that institutional memory only lasts 4-8 years. There's no reason we can't have a rail station downtown and a working transit system, but it takes longer than 4 years to pull off.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

thelakelander

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Re: JBJ: JTA laying groundwork for downtown passenger rail
« Reply #28 on: October 15, 2018, 06:36:16 PM »
This one doesn't fall on city hall. It also isn't rocket science and we're over a decade talking about this. We have +10 year old threads on this forum with JTA renderings of Amtrak at that station. Nat Ford has decades of transit experience in cities like NYC, Atlanta and San Francisco as well. Let's get it done.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali

thelakelander

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"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life.” - Muhammad Ali