Author Topic: Convention Center Wars  (Read 15082 times)

KenFSU

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #165 on: September 19, 2018, 06:59:14 PM »
Brian Hughes, Curry's Chief of Staff, announced as new interim CEO of the DIA.


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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #167 on: September 20, 2018, 11:41:34 AM »
Alrighty then. Make a damn choice and let's get this thing moving.
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ralpho37

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #168 on: September 20, 2018, 03:12:41 PM »
"Process Forward in Limbo"

Official tagline of Downtown Jacksonville!

KenFSU

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #169 on: September 20, 2018, 04:03:00 PM »
^One of the most important intentions of the RFP, if not the most important, was to test the waters and see what type of private investment, if any, that companies were willing to make in a Jacksonville convention center. As the DIA stated bluntly yesterday, the RFP plainly demonstrated that no one was going to come in and build a convention center for us.

Most of us would definitely agree that Jacksonville needs a new convention center, but the real question is, do we need it $1.4 billion bad? This is why the DIA is referring to the convention center as a generational decision.

Opportunity cost is enormous when you think of what else we could do with that money.

This is one decision we definitely don't need to rush into.

And to the point Ennis has made a few times, it's a situation where we need much more detailed information from the Jags about what they are proposing at the Shipyards.

Taking cost off the table, the Courthouse site makes a lot more sense from a downtown redevelopment perspective. But if the Jags agree to a 50/50 split on their $450 million proposal like they have in the past with other projects, versus the city fully funding and paying 30-year interest on a $780 million facility themselves, we're potentially looking at an $800 million+ cost savings by building at the Shipyards.

That money could do a ton of good supporting other downtown projects as well.

The smart play from the city would be to fully vet Iguana's proposal, figure out what the development agreement for Lot J might look like, put out a separate RFP for the Courthouse and Annex properties to see what type of mixed-use interest might exist, conduct enough environmental research to figure out exactly how much remediation of the proposed Shipyards site would cost, confirm if and when the Hart Bridge ramps can come down safely, and then make a fully informed decision.

Lunican

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #170 on: September 20, 2018, 04:34:12 PM »
Quote
Mousa said the properties will be graded and landscaped with grass.

Back to reality.

thelakelander

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #171 on: September 20, 2018, 04:51:57 PM »
^One of the most important intentions of the RFP, if not the most important, was to test the waters and see what type of private investment, if any, that companies were willing to make in a Jacksonville convention center. As the DIA stated bluntly yesterday, the RFP plainly demonstrated that no one was going to come in and build a convention center for us.

Most of us would definitely agree that Jacksonville needs a new convention center, but the real question is, do we need it $1.4 billion bad? This is why the DIA is referring to the convention center as a generational decision.

No one builds convention centers for anyone. We didn't need to go through an RFP to figure that one out. I also don't like the narrative of bloated criteria resulting in the solution costing over one billion. Scrap the extras and combine with what we already have in the Hyatt and the dollar figure easily drops more than 60%. Get a realistic no frills solution on the table and go from there. In such a scenario, we would actually be in position to get something done.

Playing with the crazy numbers will only end up with us burning more money with Iguana than we have to for something that's highly questionable on if this market can support at such a scale.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2018, 04:54:47 PM by thelakelander »
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thelakelander

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #172 on: September 20, 2018, 04:57:39 PM »
Quote
Mousa said the properties will be graded and landscaped with grass.

Back to reality.
Lol so true, so true
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vicupstate

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #173 on: September 21, 2018, 10:47:32 PM »
^One of the most important intentions of the RFP, if not the most important, was to test the waters and see what type of private investment, if any, that companies were willing to make in a Jacksonville convention center. As the DIA stated bluntly yesterday, the RFP plainly demonstrated that no one was going to come in and build a convention center for us.

Most of us would definitely agree that Jacksonville needs a new convention center, but the real question is, do we need it $1.4 billion bad? This is why the DIA is referring to the convention center as a generational decision.

No one builds convention centers for anyone. We didn't need to go through an RFP to figure that one out. I also don't like the narrative of bloated criteria resulting in the solution costing over one billion. Scrap the extras and combine with what we already have in the Hyatt and the dollar figure easily drops more than 60%. Get a realistic no frills solution on the table and go from there. In such a scenario, we would actually be in position to get something done.

Playing with the crazy numbers will only end up with us burning more money with Iguana than we have to for something that's highly questionable on if this market can support at such a scale.


The whole point of this RPF process was to eliminate the courthouse option, so that Iguana is in the driver's seat. With Curry's man in at DIA, that process will no doubt proceed at a slightlu faster pace now.   
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itsfantastic1

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #174 on: October 03, 2018, 12:10:37 PM »
Other than "We've referred it to Mayor Curry," is there any movement or timetable for a decision on this? Does the council get a say in the matter? Or do we just expect another surprise set of modified Shipyard renderings with an announcement from the Mayor's Office and the former Chief of Staff DIA CEO that the Shipyards have been chosen?

bl8jaxnative

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #175 on: October 03, 2018, 04:44:17 PM »
The glut of convention space has been long known and documented.  JAX should avoid putting much of anything into one.  The city should focus on it's strengths. 

https://www.brookings.edu/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/20050117_conventioncenters.pdf

Kerry

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #176 on: October 24, 2018, 04:35:43 PM »
You have to change the location.  Here is a site plan for the OKC Convention Center currently under construction for around $250 million.  Where in downtown Jax are you going put loading bays for 16 semis?

http://www.okctalk.com/showthread.php?t=26179&page=180
« Last Edit: October 24, 2018, 04:37:34 PM by Kerry »
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thelakelander

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #177 on: October 24, 2018, 08:34:35 PM »
Pretty cheap in comparison to the numbers we've seen locally. What's the size of the exhibition hall?
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Kerry

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #178 on: October 24, 2018, 09:08:40 PM »
https://www.okc.gov/Home/Components/News/News/2717/18

The MAPS 3 Convention Center’s total project budget of $288 million, including land acquisition and other related expenses, is the biggest in City history for a single project. The construction contract is $168.2 million, $20 million under budget.

The state-of-the art building will be located east of Scissortail Park along Robinson Boulevard between SW 4th and SW 7th streets. Like the park and many other important landmarks downtown, it will be served by the OKC Streetcar.

The convention center’s sleek and modern design features sweeping downtown views, and materials designed for energy efficiency and resiliency against the weather.

The 200,000-square-foot exhibit hall will dominate the ground floor, featuring three operable walls to divide it in up to four flexible spaces. About 45,000 square feet of meeting spaces are on all levels of the building, and many also have operable walls to make the spaces flexible. The rooms can be configured to provide up to 27 individual meeting spaces.

A 30,000-square-foot ballroom is the main space on the fourth level, complemented by 10,000 square feet of pre-function space and a 4,000-square-foot balcony.
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fieldafm

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Re: Convention Center Wars
« Reply #179 on: October 25, 2018, 08:20:35 AM »
https://www.okc.gov/Home/Components/News/News/2717/18

The MAPS 3 Convention Center’s total project budget of $288 million, including land acquisition and other related expenses, is the biggest in City history for a single project. The construction contract is $168.2 million, $20 million under budget.

The state-of-the art building will be located east of Scissortail Park along Robinson Boulevard between SW 4th and SW 7th streets. Like the park and many other important landmarks downtown, it will be served by the OKC Streetcar.

The convention center’s sleek and modern design features sweeping downtown views, and materials designed for energy efficiency and resiliency against the weather.

The 200,000-square-foot exhibit hall will dominate the ground floor, featuring three operable walls to divide it in up to four flexible spaces. About 45,000 square feet of meeting spaces are on all levels of the building, and many also have operable walls to make the spaces flexible. The rooms can be configured to provide up to 27 individual meeting spaces.

A 30,000-square-foot ballroom is the main space on the fourth level, complemented by 10,000 square feet of pre-function space and a 4,000-square-foot balcony.

45,000 square ft floor plates seem to be the definition of having a 'low bar for expectations' and 'dawdling along'. Coming from someone that used to put together events in convention halls across the US... having large swaths of contiguous space along one floor is the difference between being a true player in the convention center business, or being a second rate cousin.  But OKC is great at everything, so...

That is the exact response I was expecting and is the reason Jax is moving in slow motion.  We have a population with such a low bar for expectations that the City can just dawdle along - so it does.