Author Topic: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal  (Read 2961 times)

jaxnyc79

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #15 on: September 16, 2018, 10:33:15 AM »
I took a Greyhound to Miami around 1980 for a cruise.  (In those days, when the Caribbean market was in its relative infancy, Miami was the only regular cruise port in Florida.)  Even then, it was an "experience" seeing some members of society I wasn't regularly exposed to  8).  Was kind of glad the trip was only a few hours as my girlfriend was leery of some of our fellow passenger's manners and hygiene.  The best part is it was cheap and we didn't have to worry about parking a car in Miami.  The cruise line even picked up passengers then at Greyhound.  (I don't recall that they had parking lots for cruise passengers like they do today.)

I did like the Jax terminal's period architecture and the iconic Greyhound and "BUS" neon signs.  I hoped they salvaged those.  Seems the building would have made a great food court or home to boutique retailers so badly needed in downtown.  Also, maybe as a home to a colony of creative types.  The lack of imagination in re-purposing downtown buildings is striking and sad for our history and real character.  How charming is a new glass and steel building with no street level interaction?  Demolition is such a cop out, especially when there are no immediate plans for a replacement structure.  Jax has no real strategic and coherent plan for saving its past, just leaving it to a few scarce, random and disjointed outcomes.  That lack of synergy is why downtown doesn't do better.

I tend to agree with this.  I don't understand why buildings downtown can be demolished without permitting for new, replacement construction.  Downtown doesn't need more surface lots.  Actions occur which create voids and vacancies and, in essence, shoot downtown's efforts in the foot, and then the city cobbles together expensive incentive programs to try and rectify.  It's really a complete circle of insanity.  Frankly, the city really hasn't shown itself deserving of a vibrant downtown.  Outsiders come in, tear down structures and buildings, leave surface lots and building carcasses behind - and in the name of limited government (I suppose), the city does little to defend its heritage, its sense of originality, its written plans (adherence to Brooklyn Design Codes, e.g.)...in other words, its integrity.   
« Last Edit: September 17, 2018, 06:02:18 PM by jaxnyc79 »

Gunnar

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #16 on: September 17, 2018, 06:55:41 AM »
I took a Greyhound to Miami around 1980 for a cruise.  (In those days, when the Caribbean market was in its relative infancy, Miami was the only regular cruise port in Florida.)  Even then, it was an "experience" seeing some members of society I wasn't regularly exposed to  8).  Was kind of glad the trip was only a few hours as my girlfriend was leery of some of our fellow passenger's manners and hygiene.  The best part is it was cheap and we didn't have to worry about parking a car in Miami.  The cruise line even picked up passengers then at Greyhound.  (I don't recall that they had parking lots for cruise passengers like they do today.)

I did like the Jax terminal's period architecture and the iconic Greyhound and "BUS" neon signs.  I hoped they salvaged those.  Seems the building would have made a great food court or home to boutique retailers so badly needed in downtown.  Also, maybe as a home to a colony of creative types.  The lack of imagination in re-purposing downtown buildings is striking and sad for our history and real character.  How charming is a new glass and steel building with no street level interaction?  Demolition is such a cop out, especially when there are no immediate plans for a replacement structure.  Jax has no real strategic and coherent plan for saving its past, just leaving it to a few scarce, random and disjointed outcomes.  That lack of synergy is why downtown doesn't do better.

I tend to agree with this.  I don't understand why buildings downtown can be demolished without permitting for new, replacement construction.  Downtown doesn't need more surface lots.  Again, steps are taken which appear to shoot downtown's efforts in the foot, and then the city cobbles together expensive incentive programs to try and save downtown.  It's really a complete circle of insanity.  Frankly, the city really doesn't deserve a vibrant downtown - the regional culture doesn't appear to be imbued with the special sauce of what would make for a vibrant downtown district.  Outsiders come in, tear down structures and buildings, leave surface lots and building carcasses behind - and in the name of limited government (I suppose), the city does little to defend its heritage and sense of originality.

+1

could not agree more. I mean, there are so many empty lots, why does anyone even need to demolish one of the few existing structures to build something new - they can just take their pick of one of the many abandoned lots.
I want to live in a society where people can voice unpopular opinions because I know that as a result of that, a society grows and matures...” — Hugh Hefner

Dapperdan

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2018, 03:38:37 PM »
It was a huge eyesore. Demoing it makes the lot way more attractive to developers. It is in a central location and will not be empty for long. Empty lots are just that until they aren't anymore. At the rate downtown is going, these empties will start filling in just like in Lavilla. That was moonscape forever and seems like every week a  new apartment facility is going up.

Steve

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2018, 04:28:47 PM »
Not sure I buy this. Developers wanting to make money don’t care what the building currently looks like. They look at what they want it to be (either through demo and rebuild or a renovation).

Under this argument, Savannah and Charleston would still be dumps.

DrQue

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2018, 05:16:25 PM »
Its the same guy that owns the everbank / tiaa building. Get ready for another parking deck.

I-10east

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #20 on: September 18, 2018, 10:37:21 PM »
I know that many want either a perfect repurpose of an old non-historic unadorned bus station, or for the space to be turned into a shiny new landmark hi-rise, but sometimes cities need utilitarian buildings like a parking garage, esp for TIAA Bank. There isn't a 'learning from Jax" city that doesn't have many garages. Now I would hate for that space to be a surface lot, any criticism of that would be totally justified.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2018, 10:39:34 PM by I-10east »

Steve

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2018, 06:39:23 AM »
I know that many want either a perfect repurpose of an old non-historic unadorned bus station, or for the space to be turned into a shiny new landmark hi-rise, but sometimes cities need utilitarian buildings like a parking garage, esp for TIAA Bank. There isn't a 'learning from Jax" city that doesn't have many garages. Now I would hate for that space to be a surface lot, any criticism of that would be totally justified.

Your last sentence is my point. Personally, I don’t have any love for the building. But, in practice I don’t love demolition for nothing. If they were committing to a development so be it.

And personally if it’s a garage then I’m content with it....so long as it’s designed properly.

bl8jaxnative

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #22 on: September 21, 2018, 10:34:44 AM »
I don't understand why buildings downtown can be demolished without permitting for new, replacement construction. 

a) Because it's their right; it's their property.
b) The existing structure is a liability. 
c) The existing structure had no significant historical value.
d) The existing structure was built as a bus terminal.  It had very little actual indoor building space on a very large footprint.  Don't let the outside walls trick you, 7/8th of the property was already little more than a surface lot.

thelakelander

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #23 on: September 21, 2018, 11:04:32 AM »
A few of these points could be considered opinion. In particular, b) what's makes it more of a liability than any other existing building downtown?, c) if enough research is done and the political support is there, an argument for preservation could be made, d) the existing structure had over 26,000 square feet of air conditioned space. The nondescript WPB warehouse repurposed as a food hall/public market in the recent Jaxson article (link and pictures below) was 14,000 square feet with less significance.

https://www.thejaxsonmag.com/article/west-palm-beachs-warehouse-district/

About the most sound answer to jaxnyc79's post is that the city allows it. As for the property owners, the WPB owner saw potential in their vacant structure because it aligned with a vision they had and the Jax property owner did not....likely because they view parking for their adjacent tower as a better use.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2018, 11:09:10 AM by thelakelander »
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jaxnyc79

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #24 on: September 21, 2018, 12:15:24 PM »
I don't understand why buildings downtown can be demolished without permitting for new, replacement construction. 

a) Because it's their right; it's their property.
b) The existing structure is a liability. 
c) The existing structure had no significant historical value.
d) The existing structure was built as a bus terminal.  It had very little actual indoor building space on a very large footprint.  Don't let the outside walls trick you, 7/8th of the property was already little more than a surface lot.

OK, if it is "their right and property" and to hell with urban design principles and planning, then Jax should get completely out of the downtown revitalization game and not spend one additional penny on incentives. 

Lunican

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #25 on: September 22, 2018, 02:52:01 PM »
Seems like there is a 1990's demolition boom going on downtown. We are about to get a whole new set of empty lots with the shipyards expanding west along the riverfront. Very exciting.

fieldafm

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Re: Old Greyhound Bus Terminal
« Reply #26 on: September 24, 2018, 10:31:20 AM »
I know that many want either a perfect repurpose of an old non-historic unadorned bus station, or for the space to be turned into a shiny new landmark hi-rise, but sometimes cities need utilitarian buildings like a parking garage, esp for TIAA Bank. There isn't a 'learning from Jax" city that doesn't have many garages. Now I would hate for that space to be a surface lot, any criticism of that would be totally justified.

There are no plans to build a parking garage on the site. It will be used as a surface parking lot to serve the TIAA Bank Tower.