Brightline ready to expand rail system to Tampa

[CityLife]

In the off chance Disney builds new offices ( aka moving their HQ ), they'll not  be linked by Brightline unless:

a) Disney builds a new HQ at an currently planned Brightline station.  e..g. MCO
b) Disney builds a new HQ at a location at which Brighline would then add a stop

If we're looking at B, it's hard to understand why they'd do that.  Very, very, very expensive to do that.

It's not an off chance. Disney is actively evaluating opportunities there. And yes, they would be linked by Brightline:

The existing 401,000 square foot Team Disney building is located within walking distance of the Disney Springs Brightline stop.
Lake Nona is right next to the Intermodal Center (south of the airport), ergo, a new Disney office would be right next to the Brightline stop at Lake Nona/MCO.

It would be extremely easy for the bulk of Disney's corporate employees to use Brightline to travel between the two office hubs in Orlando.

[bl8jaxnative]

Thank you for clarifying that.

Question - Any rumors or insight into if Disney is serious about moving their _entire_ headquarters?  Or is it just a group or three?

I thought their cruise line group was already out there.  Maybe there's just a group or two where it'd make sense.  Maybe not?

[Lunican]

Brightline Cocoa Tunnel and State Road 528 Construction - February 14, 2021

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSnGGMe8ecA

[thelakelander]

It's nice to see progress continues to be made.

[marcuscnelson]

Seems the state is being a bit of a hassle for some reason.

https://www.railwayage.com/passenger/intercity/florida-transportation-officials-place-brightline-under-the-gun/

[Adam12]

Seems the state is being a bit of a hassle for some reason.

https://www.railwayage.com/passenger/intercity/florida-transportation-officials-place-brightline-under-the-gun/

They just want money: "Brightline must prepare a study calculating how much toll revenue would be lost to the state if they expand to Tampa and compensate the government for it, according to a March 1 letter from FDOT to the company."

https://www.thenextmiami.com/fdot-demanding-compensation-for-lost-tolls-if-brightline-wants-to-expand-train-service-to-tampa/

[thelakelander]

It really sounds crazy to talk about becoming more environmental friendly and then want compensation for lost potential toll revenue if something that's more environmental friendly, ends up taking some traffic off the highways.

[marcuscnelson]

So… extortion? That's where we are? The state is extorting a private company to subsidize an uncompetitive project?

It won't happen, but if Brightline were to decide to buy up new ROW elsewhere between Orlando and Tampa, would this still apply to them? Like, is this a condition of building the line in the highway corridor, or a condition of building non-car infrastructure in general?

[thelakelander]

This is the condition of needing ROW along a toll road corridor. The owner of the toll road wants to be compensated.  If Brightside attempted to use CSX ROW, they'd likely have to compensate CSX.

[tufsu1]

This is the condition of needing ROW along a toll road corridor. The owner of the toll road wants to be compensated.  If Brightside attempted to use CSX ROW, they'd likely have to compensate CSX.

I've said from the beginning that Brightline could add a surcharge on ticket prices to Orlando (and now to Tampa)...it should be shown as a CFX/FTE fee...and then give the authority the revenue - similar to airport departure fees.

[bl8jaxnative]

For the good of the public, Brightline needs to piss or get off the pot when it comes to Tampa.  Either they're ready to make a meaningful commitment ( $$$$$ ) or not.

And if they're not, that reopens the possibility of others with the means doing it.  Moderator: **Removed content due to language***

[thelakelander]

No one else is coming. If the numbers don't add up, they should walk. Give it a few years and the new administration in DC would probably give them tax money to extend the system.

[bl8jaxnative]

No one else is coming?


No one else can.

The -- very tiny -- window for other bids has come and gone.

Since then we've seen several private proposals in the US.  They're out there and right now they're not allowed to bid.

Brightline's had several extensions that they've failed to meet.  In the meantime they've been running around Miami playing with commuter rail and had a few failures at their Las Vegas to a Cali-high-desert-town-where-no-one-lives project.

Oh, and Virgin's suing them for a quarter of a billion dollars.


FDOT may not be saints.  But Brightline's track record is a D+.  There's a bad chance they can't complete the Tampa route negotiations because they don't have the cash to do it.  Not to build the line, but what would be needed to complete the agreement.


I wish them well.  But it doesn't look good at this point.

[thelakelander]

I'd selfishly prefer they skip the expensive Tampa extension for a no frills, no ROW needed route to Jax. But I get it that Jax will generate lower ridership than a connection to Florida's second largest metropolitan area.

[WAJAS]

No one else is coming?

No one else can.

The -- very tiny -- window for other bids has come and gone.

Since then we've seen several private proposals in the US.  They're out there and right now they're not allowed to bid.

Brightline's had several extensions that they've failed to meet.  In the meantime they've been running around Miami playing with commuter rail and had a few failures at their Las Vegas to a Cali-high-desert-town-where-no-one-lives project.

Oh, and Virgin's suing them for a quarter of a billion dollars.

FDOT may not be saints.  But Brightline's track record is a D+.  There's a bad chance they can't complete the Tampa route negotiations because they don't have the cash to do it.  Not to build the line, but what would be needed to complete the agreement.

I wish them well.  But it doesn't look good at this point.

I'm optimistic. Brightline West is negotiating ROW access for a station at LA Union, which gives the route great feet. The Orlando extension can easily be blamed on the coastal counties that forced them to go through a few rounds in the courts. The Tamp extension problems are then COVID-related.

I don't think the Virgin lawsuit goes anywhere. If it does, my optimism for Brightline will start plummeting.

Check out "The Roaming Railfan" Youtube channel to get an idea of how far they are on the Orlando extension. They're about 50% through construction. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbr6nOYIcuf9HbWQ4XX2bAg

I'd selfishly prefer they skip the expensive Tampa extension for a no frills, no ROW needed route to Jax. But I get it that Jax will generate lower ridership than a connection to Florida's second largest metropolitan area.

Honestly, Jacksonville will likely happen when an extension north of Florida occurs to Atlanta. I don't think Jacksonville would have enough traffic to justify its own construction.