Author Topic: Retail garage project proposed for downtown  (Read 8270 times)

Metro Jacksonville

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Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« on: January 16, 2018, 05:40:02 AM »
Retail garage project proposed for downtown



A block long surface parking lot in the heart of Downtown Jacksonville could soon be replaced by a six-level parking garage with street level retail space.

Read More: https://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2018-jan-retail-garage-project-proposed-for-downtown

Murder_me_Rachel

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2018, 07:32:46 AM »
Retail garage project proposed for downtown



A block long surface parking lot in the heart of Downtown Jacksonville could soon be replaced by a six-level parking garage with street level retail space.

Read More: https://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2018-jan-retail-garage-project-proposed-for-downtown

Oh Man! This might be my favorite downtown parking garage taking up valuable space yet! Hard to choose between the one by the Landing, the one by the library, the two by the Wells Fargo building, and the deserted lots by the courthouse, but, man, look at all that PARKING. If there is one thing downtown is lacking, it's big parking garages. So glad to see someone taking a bold initiative and giving the people what they need.

vicupstate

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2018, 08:11:17 AM »
I thought the Laura Trio was building a garage in it's block. Is this in addition to that?

The garage that is behind this proposed one is the ugliest garage in North America. I wish they would look at making this garage bigger so that that one could be demolished. It is is a prime location that needs to be replaced with something more urban friendly.   
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thelakelander

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2018, 08:16:21 AM »
This is the proposed Trio garage.
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KenFSU

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2018, 08:24:13 AM »
Love the inclusion of retail, but for such a large garage, I wish there was more of it, not just along Laura.

You could barely squeeze something like a Panera Bread into 5,000 square feet.

Another net win though.

Ennis, quick heads up that the "Next Page" link in the article directs to page one, not page two.
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MusicMan

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2018, 09:01:46 AM »
I like this way better than cramming something onto the existing Laura St Trio footprint.

Also 5000 sq ft works great if it is 5 1000 sf spaces (or 4 at 1250). Much easier to fill with smaller businesses, way cheaper rent, and if the space goes vacant at 5000 it could sit empty for a year (or more) waiting to find a new tenant.

Steve

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2018, 09:09:05 AM »
I thought the original site plan had the garage not going all the way to the corner to allow for future retail.

Can the Main St Frontage be converted to retail based on market conditions (or for that matter, any of the Forsyth st. Frontage? That really is a long boring block.

I realize this is the key to the Barnett and Trio which I've believed above all else are the more important projects for the core of downtown. With that said, this is uninspiring.

Steve

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2018, 09:21:46 AM »
Just clicked on one of the pics and there is the schematic for the garage itself.

 - The retail space is 2 stories, which is better as it gets you over 5k SqFt
 - It looks like you COULD convert the Main St. area to Retail, but it's not the easiest thing in the world - at the expense of 27 spaces (which I believe is worth it. The Courthouse and Library Garages had a much easier conversion path I believe (outside of the fact that they didn't make them tenant ready and the conversion was expensive).

I wouldn't mind them moving the stairwell on the corner of Forsyth and Main to somewhere else. If you did convert to retail, it would be a situation like Sake House in 5 Points - 2 entrances on side streets, but the corner isn't part of the unit.

(yes, I realize in 5 points it's a pharmacy on teh corner, but that's the easiest comparison).

Steve

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2018, 09:31:57 AM »
Also (sorry for the rapid posts):

The Garage Schematic doesn't match the Garage and Trio Site Plan. The Site plan shows a Garage Exit near the retail space at Forsyth and Laura. The Schematic shows the Exit by the entrance near the corner at Main. I get the exit in the site plan, as it helps with the one-way street situation.

With that said, is this for Conceptual or Final approval? Again, I know this project is important for the Barnett/Trio, but let's get it together.

thelakelander

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2018, 09:34:10 AM »
I thought the original site plan had the garage not going all the way to the corner to allow for future retail.

Can the Main St Frontage be converted to retail based on market conditions (or for that matter, any of the Forsyth st. Frontage? That really is a long boring block.

I realize this is the key to the Barnett and Trio which I've believed above all else are the more important projects for the core of downtown. With that said, this is uninspiring.
Unfortunately, for some stange reason the developer was talked out of adding retail at Main and Forsyth by the DIA. What was told to me a while back was there was a concern about there being too much car traffic on Main. In all of my 16 years of architecture, commercial real estate development and planning experience, high vehicle counts are a great thing for commercial uses. Anyway, it doesn't appear it can be converted at a later date because the garage ramp is on that side. Lost opportunity to have to good corners on both sides and something that would complement the retail in 11 East and the old Woolworths building.
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thelakelander

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2018, 09:36:42 AM »
Also (sorry for the rapid posts):

The Garage Schematic doesn't match the Garage and Trio Site Plan. The Site plan shows a Garage Exit near the retail space at Forsyth and Laura. The Schematic shows the Exit by the entrance near the corner at Main. I get the exit in the site plan, as it helps with the one-way street situation.

With that said, is this for Conceptual or Final approval? Again, I know this project is important for the Barnett/Trio, but let's get it together.
It's up for conceptual approval this Thursday.
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Steve

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2018, 09:41:38 AM »
I thought the original site plan had the garage not going all the way to the corner to allow for future retail.

Can the Main St Frontage be converted to retail based on market conditions (or for that matter, any of the Forsyth st. Frontage? That really is a long boring block.

I realize this is the key to the Barnett and Trio which I've believed above all else are the more important projects for the core of downtown. With that said, this is uninspiring.
Unfortunately, for some stange reason the developer was talked out of adding retail at Main and Forsyth by the DIA. What was told to me a while back was there was a concern about there being too much car traffic on Main. In all of my 16 years of architecture, commercial real estate development and planning experience, high vehicle counts are a great thing for commercial uses. Anyway, it doesn't appear it can be converted at a later date because the garage ramp is on that side. Lost opportunity to have to good corners on both sides and something that would complement the retail in 11 East and the old Woolworths building.

The Ramp is on the back, not the side.

Tacachale

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2018, 10:52:22 AM »
I thought the original site plan had the garage not going all the way to the corner to allow for future retail.

Can the Main St Frontage be converted to retail based on market conditions (or for that matter, any of the Forsyth st. Frontage? That really is a long boring block.

I realize this is the key to the Barnett and Trio which I've believed above all else are the more important projects for the core of downtown. With that said, this is uninspiring.
Unfortunately, for some stange reason the developer was talked out of adding retail at Main and Forsyth by the DIA. What was told to me a while back was there was a concern about there being too much car traffic on Main. In all of my 16 years of architecture, commercial real estate development and planning experience, high vehicle counts are a great thing for commercial uses. Anyway, it doesn't appear it can be converted at a later date because the garage ramp is on that side. Lost opportunity to have to good corners on both sides and something that would complement the retail in 11 East and the old Woolworths building.

That was boneheaded. Of course there should have been retail at the Main corner. Major misstep by DIA. I think it's important enough that it should be in the article.
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thelakelander

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2018, 11:22:33 AM »
I think Jaxnyc79 may have mentioned it in another thread, but we really should identify what streets in the urban core should be retail oriented vs service oriented. One would think Forsyth would classify as a retail oriented street. Outside of this block and the hideous  metal garage across from 11 East, it pretty much is from Market to Pearl. Historically, it was all the way into LaVilla. If it is considered a retail corridor, then the future possibility of retail conversion on the northeast side of the structure should at least be seriously considered.  Otherwise, you do end up with a hodge podge mix of retail spaces and dead walls at the pedestrian level throughout downtown as infill continues to happen.
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Tacachale

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Re: Retail garage project proposed for downtown
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2018, 11:55:55 AM »
I think Jaxnyc79 may have mentioned it in another thread, but we really should identify what streets in the urban core should be retail oriented vs service oriented. One would think Forsyth would classify as a retail oriented street. Outside of this block and the hideous  metal garage across from 11 East, it pretty much is from Market to Pearl. Historically, it was all the way into LaVilla. If it is considered a retail corridor, then the future possibility of retail conversion on the northeast side of the structure should at least be seriously considered.  Otherwise, you do end up with a hodge podge mix of retail spaces and dead walls at the pedestrian level throughout downtown as infill continues to happen.

True, and I've said the same before. We need to determine retail corridors and stick to it, and Forsyth should certainly be one. But I'm ok with this garage as there's no other place for it without tearing something down or putting it on the SE Laura-Adams lot (both of which are also prime retail streets), or putting it farther away which would probably kill the whole project.
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