JTA's JRTC Design Showcase

[arb]

Guys and Gals,

Longtime reader here -- I was on the JTA's website last night to look up a bus schedule and I stumbled upon information pertaining to the regional transportation center that is being planned. The JTA is hosting a design showcase on Monday, April 18 at 4 p.m. If you're interested in attending, contact the JTA for the location as it wasn't given. Three design concepts are listed on the JTA's website, and here is the link to view them:

http://www.jtafla.com/blueprint-2020/jrtc/jrtc-designs/

I'm no genius, but after following MJ for a long while and learning so much, I feel like I could give my thoughts. In my opinion, aesthetically, all three push the design envelope with unordinary architecture. Price wise, the most expensive of the three concepts is less than half the cost of the original, sprawling $125 million RTC. All three concepts assume that the convention center is staying at the Jacksonville Terminal. The concept from Via Designs is nice to look at but still is too sprawled. The Pond-Michael Baker design renders a skyway extension to Brooklyn Station, which makes me happy. There is a rental car kiosk in KBJ's rendering. I like the idea of a cafe/convenience store space that were included in two designs. I also like the idea of TOD surrounding the JRTC; however, I wish the design firms had included a light rail/streetcar hub of some sort into the design of the JRTC. Finally as always, concepts are concept to change (who likes my corny pun? ).

So MJ, what are your thoughts on the designs? Which of the three do you prefer?

[CCMjax]

I like the green space incorporated with the Pond design.  It makes it more inviting.  I think Via's concept is too airporty and not very inviting.

[thelakelander]

Great proposals. All three are 110% better than what was proposed a decade ago. They are worthy of their own front page article and since the competition is on Monday, that means I have some extra work to do this weekend.  I haven't gone through the details but here's my initial ranking, based off my quick scan of all three.

1. Pond

Pond appears to have created a design that incorporates the needs of the greater area. With the central park space, the iconic architecture and the consideration of links to other areas (like the bike trail/linear park on Park Street and under the Skyway), it's the best design. However, it's also the most expensive.

2. KBJ

From an architectural standpoint, KBJ's proposal is pretty nice and iconic as well. It is something that would definitely standout in Jax's bland architectural landscape. I rank it second because it doesn't illustrate how it could enhance the sense of place and development potential of the surrounding parcels.

3. Via

Via's skyway loop into Brooklyn is an interesting idea. It's also the cheapest of the three to build. My concern is the spread out nature of the facility. Assuming passenger rail comes back to the terminal in the future, this layout would result in the JRTC being as spread out as the initial concepts years ago. Because of that concern, I'll rank it third until I can get into the meat of all three design concepts.

[Westside Guy]

Pond is by far the best. I love the integration of the skyway, the space it provides that the area really needs, and the fact that the design doesn't sprawl across four city blocks. So as far as I'm concerned, let's do the groundbreaking tomorrow, I'll provide the shovel if needed.

[hiddentrack]

Great find! For me, I'd order it as Pond, Via, and KBJ.

Pond had the nicest building design to me, and I especially like that the lattice grid on the exterior breaks up what would otherwise be a lot of glass. I really like the Skyway Greenway and think it would be great to see the entire length of the system. The only thing that's gnawing at me is the giant JAXIS sign in the front plaza. Not a fan of it, it just doesn't seem necessary.

Via and KBJ both felt like they were inspired by airports. Nothing wrong with that, they just felt a little out of place. I was least-inspired by KBJ.

[Tacachale]

Pond looks the best to me too. Both of the others have good features of their own.

[spuwho]

There are components of all three I like and I don't like.

I agree with Lake for the most part. I like the KBJ iconic architecture which means the Via proposal looks a little too 70's airportish to me.

I don't like the connectivity to JT in any of them. Even if it stays a convention center, I still don't like it. It's an afterthought and checkoff to a design requirement.

I will see if I can make the design walkthrough before commenting further.

[fliving]

VIA's feels too far away from JT, and looks like it expects more buildings for it.

I think KBJ's looks cool, but it doesn't seem to offer any way for the Skyway to be extended past it, or really anything in favor of future expansion.

Pond seems to offer the best design for the community while creating space for more in the future.

[jcjohnpaint]

Pond 1st
Via Last

[Live_Oak]

So the majority seem to like the most expensive one the most.  The Pond design will be even more expensive if they build everything they have in their plans. The $47.5 million estimated cost does not include the additional JTA admin floor that Pond wants to build.  That will be an additional $6 million. So now it's up to $53.5 when I think the budget that JTA provided the firms with was $40 million.

Besides all that, I like KBJ's design the best. Definitely the most interesting to my eye.  The other two look like suburban office buildings to me.

[thelakelander]

Personally, I'd prefer the office component being scrapped altogether. That would drop the cost significantly in all of them. Architecturally, I'm fine with all three concepts. What I specifically like about Pond's proposal is the public space and thought of how the project fits into the surrounding area.

[spuwho]

The JTA website was updated.  The showcase is at:

Monday, April 18 // 4 to 6 p.m.
 // 121 West Forsyth St., 2nd Floor

Join us at our administrative offices for an open-house showcase and tell us what you think. Ten minute presentations by each firm start at 4:45 p.m. You may preview the designs below. To send comments about the designs, email JRTCdesigns@jtafla.com. Comments will be accepted until 5 p.m., Tuesday, April 19. We look forward to seeing you there!

[Steve]

Agreed that all of these are better than the crap JTA tried to do about 8 years ago - that wasn't even a transportation center, but a few uses that happened to be within a few blocks of each other.

KBJ is typical KBJ: Great from a distance, but unimaginative at street level. Nearly all of their downtown buildings are that way. I'd rank this third.

My first reaction was actually to like Via as the best, mainly because of cost and the vertical aspects, like stacking the buses terminals. However, outside of the skyway extension to Brooklyn (which is an interesting concept the way they did it), it's like the Skyway and Train Station were an afterthought, almost like when they were designing this they forgot about it until the 11th hour. PArt of the reason that's it's cheap is the aesthetics - a little unimaginative. Someone else mentioned an airport - I agree.

What would be great is if they could put this thing on the same lot as the Convention Center, like that private dirt parking lot directly across from the skyway station.

The Pond one takes a little bit to digest. I love the road diet on Park St (no reason this road needs to be four lanes) as well as the concepts about Jackson St. It uses the land pretty well too and considers the pedestrian/walking as a component better than the other two. It too is a little spread out, but overall nice.

I'd actually be fine with either the Via proposal or the Pond proposal, but would probably lean towards Pond because of the pedestrian aspects.

Putting them all aside, I'd REALLY prefer the ability to use the grass lot adjacent to the Prime Osborne.

[Kerry]

Of the three I like Pond the best.  It looks to be the only where someone could walk to it.  One of them (don't remember which) doesn't even have sidewalks in most places.  It's like they expect everyone to arrive by vehicle and leave by vehicle.  I am also not a fan of all the skywalks which is why I prefer the Pond version.  As for green-space; downtown JAX already has too much green space and I wouldn't mind if every proposal dropped it from the their plans.  We can worry about a central park type open space when we have some semblance of density.  I am also not a fan of separating transportation types across multiple levels.  It is very Le Corbusier and I can't stand that guy.  Also, I agree with the above comment about Via's looking too much like an airport was spot on - I thought the exact same thing.

Think I will attend the 4PM meeting.

[CCMjax]

I would be concerned about KBJ's design aging poorly.  It is very Star Warsy which I don't really care for.  It is also an incredibly custom and unique structure with all the slanted and angled elements which would add a lot of cost so it may end up being more expensive than Pond's in the end.