Author Topic: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works  (Read 11183 times)

Metro Jacksonville

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A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« on: September 10, 2015, 03:00:02 AM »
A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works



Who says the age of the enclosed shopping mall is dead? Intended to break ground later this year, The Mall at Miami Worldcenter will challenge that notion.

Read More: http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2015-sep-a-mall-for-floridas-premier-downtown-in-the-works

jaxnyc79

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2015, 03:06:36 AM »
You don't have to be a rich and heavily populated metro to have a vibrant downtown.  We need downtown retail density of the kind that Jax residents can afford.  If city leaders aren't thinking about how to make that happen all the time, then it won't.  Consolidated Government really needs to be revisited.

Adam White

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2015, 03:09:02 AM »
I think an enclosed mall makes sense, really. Much like in Toronto (for example), where the downtown buildings are connected by subterranean walkways that are essentially shopping malls, I can see things like this working in areas where the weather is harsh (too hot, too cold, too wet).

It might be that the era of the large enclosed mall in the suburbs is over - who knows. But an enclosed mall in an urban setting like this might flourish.

The renderings look a lot like Westfield Stratford City, the mall complex built before the Olympics in London. That is still doing very well, although it's only been open for about 4 years.
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Adam White

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2015, 03:11:56 AM »
Consolidated Government really needs to be revisited.

You know, I never even thought about that. While I'm sure there are benefits of consolidated government, it probably does mean that parts of the city get the shaft. There isn't a local government to really look after the "urban core's" best interests.
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I-10east

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2015, 06:40:45 AM »
It might be that the era of the large enclosed mall in the suburbs is over

We have two in the Jax area that are fine. It's not about 'indoors versus outdoors' you can have an outdoor 'town center-esque' mall that goes to crap if the neighborhood becomes run down. Many people on here are in love with these urban outdoor mall around the country, but no one talks about the crime at many of them. If an area goes to crap, then the mall does to, simple as that.

Adam White

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2015, 06:45:43 AM »
It might be that the era of the large enclosed mall in the suburbs is over

We have two in the Jax area that are fine. It's not about 'indoors versus outdoors' you can have an outdoor 'town center-esque' mall that goes to crap if the neighborhood becomes run down. Many people on here are in love with these urban outdoor mall around the country, but no one talks about the crime at many of them. If an area goes to crap, then the mall does to, simple as that.

I agree (more or less). I think the health of the mall is dependent on the health of the area is serves. For example, a downtown mall in Jax wouldn't likely work as barely anyone lives there.

Plus - people often move on to the next new/better thing that comes along. I bet Regency (for example) would still be doing okay if the Avenues (and then the Town Center) hadn't come along and poached their customers.
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avonjax

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2015, 07:55:16 AM »
I know we are not Miami, and most people don't want us to be, but how in the world did Jacksonville fall so far behind the rest of Florida? Every city in Florida makes us look old, worn out and tired. Just saying.

The_Choose_1

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2015, 08:13:48 AM »
I know we are not Miami, and most people don't want us to be, but how in the world did Jacksonville fall so far behind the rest of Florida? Every city in Florida makes us look old, worn out and tired. Just saying.
One way this happens is the people behind the eight-ball. The very powerful "First Baptist Church" that owns a lot of the buildings in Downtown Jacksonville. When you're a Non-Profit and have a lot of powerful & rich church members. Buying old buildings and turning them into church property can kill the growth of what Jacksonville Downtown could really be. IMO. ;)
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Adam White

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2015, 08:29:02 AM »
I know we are not Miami, and most people don't want us to be, but how in the world did Jacksonville fall so far behind the rest of Florida? Every city in Florida makes us look old, worn out and tired. Just saying.
One way this happens is the people behind the eight-ball. The very powerful "First Baptist Church" that owns a lot of the buildings in Downtown Jacksonville. When you're a Non-Profit and have a lot of powerful & rich church members. Buying old buildings and turning them into church property can kill the growth of what Jacksonville Downtown could really be. IMO. ;)

I'm not a fan of FBC, but I think they're unfairly used as a whipping boy. There is no reason why downtown Jax couldn't be prosperous AND have a large church in the middle of it. In fact, it might even help in some ways.
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Captain Zissou

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2015, 08:53:06 AM »
I know we are not Miami, and most people don't want us to be, but how in the world did Jacksonville fall so far behind the rest of Florida? Every city in Florida makes us look old, worn out and tired. Just saying.
One way this happens is the people behind the eight-ball. The very powerful "First Baptist Church" that owns a lot of the buildings in Downtown Jacksonville. When you're a Non-Profit and have a lot of powerful & rich church members. Buying old buildings and turning them into church property can kill the growth of what Jacksonville Downtown could really be. IMO. ;)

You couldn't be more wrong.

There has been no new large scale commercial development downtown recently because there has been no need for it.  As Ennis posted a couple weeks back, acquisitions and relocations of downtown companies have left vast amounts of unused space downtown over the past couple decades.  That oversupply brings down the market rate and makes new construction impossible because they won't be able to make back their investment at the average rental rate per square foot.  As downtown occupancy continues to rise and landlords are able to increase rents, it will make downtown a viable market for new construction and we will start to see some tower cranes on the horizon.

RattlerGator

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2015, 12:11:20 PM »
I know we are not Miami, and most people don't want us to be, but how in the world did Jacksonville fall so far behind the rest of Florida? Every city in Florida makes us look old, worn out and tired. Just saying.
Wow, navel-gaze much? I think this is nonsense. *Every* major city in-state has distinct advantages and disadvantages vis-vis the rest. Jax is no different.

tpot

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2015, 02:15:46 PM »
http://youtu.be/olIVBSb5lA8

Here is a video of the condo tower that will be located there. This is going to be an amazing complex. This investment into the city is on top of the billion dollar Brickell City Center that is close to completion......

thelakelander

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2015, 04:16:13 PM »
About an hour ago, I had the opportunity to see Brickell City Center and get the background story of its evolution from Swire Properties. What they are developing is astonishing. DT Miami will look radically different in another five years.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2015, 04:17:46 PM by thelakelander »
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avonjax

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2015, 11:29:13 PM »
I know we are not Miami, and most people don't want us to be, but how in the world did Jacksonville fall so far behind the rest of Florida? Every city in Florida makes us look old, worn out and tired. Just saying.
Wow, navel-gaze much? I think this is nonsense. *Every* major city in-state has distinct advantages and disadvantages vis-vis the rest. Jax is no different.

Have you looked at the cities in Florida lately? We look the oldest and most drab. Yes every major city does have advantages and disadvantages but as far as downtowns we have a lot of disadvantage at least in my opinion. I'm not talking about the advantage of the beaches, or great neighborhoods like Avondale, Riverside and San Marco etc, just our downtown.

Keith-N-Jax

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Re: A mall for Florida's premier downtown in the works
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2015, 03:14:17 AM »
Avonjax is right,