Author Topic: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks  (Read 13429 times)

I-10east

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #45 on: June 11, 2015, 05:36:13 PM »
Margaret & Riverside is SUCH an arduous trek to DT... I'm so sick of this ongoing Starbucks barometer crap (whatever that is). If you wanted a Starbucks DT, you should've supported them (two) while they were here; Blame yourself. If you did supported them, obviously there wasn't enough of you.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2015, 05:44:22 PM by I-10east »

thelakelander

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #46 on: June 11, 2015, 05:46:53 PM »
^I guess we could say the same for Burger King, McDonald's, Wendy's, Firehouse Subs, JCPenney, Sears, Ruby Tuesday, GAP, Walgreens and a host of other businesses that have shuttered their downtown locations over the last 25 years.
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Adam White

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #47 on: June 11, 2015, 05:48:34 PM »
Margaret & Riverside is SUCH an arduous trek to DT... I'm so sick of this ongoing Starbucks barometer crap (whatever that is). If you wanted a Starbucks DT, you should've supported them (two) while they were here; Blame yourself. If you did supported them, obviously there wasn't enough of you.

I don't think the issue is that people necessarily WANT a Starbucks downtown. It's what it means - or rather, what the fact that Starbucks doesn't have a location downtown means.

I don't think any of us would argue that downtown Jax couldn't - or shouldn't - improve. Downtown used to be quite vibrant. And even after it started dying, it was still better than it is now. Is it wrong to point that out and hope it could be better?

“If you're going to play it out of tune, then play it out of tune properly.”

UNFurbanist

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #48 on: June 11, 2015, 06:11:03 PM »
At the end of the day you need a good number of people living in downtown 24/7 to make these types of businesses work. That is why projects like the LST and Barnett are so important. Despite what people on here might think there are a lot of young people that would live downtown (speaking as one myself) if there were more choices than like 3 complexes and maybe some variation in price. As it stands there are a lot of great bars and restaurants downtown right now but they just don't stay open as often as they should because everyone leaves after 5. If we could actually show progress on housing options and maybe get our sh*t together on marketing our downtown to attract not only the rest of the city but the rest of the country, we would see a Starbucks open up within months.

We have done a good job on having more events in the core and cleaning up some places like Hemming Park but that isn't enough. The city needs to continually build on each small achievement not just pat ourselves on the back and chill on it whenever we figure out something almost every other place already knows. I love this city and there is a growing excitement about the core but its going to take hard work, ingenuity and people keeping to their commitments.

I-10east

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #49 on: June 11, 2015, 06:15:27 PM »
Is it wrong to point that out and hope it could be better?

Search the topic 'Starbucks'. 40 links of info (10 pages). Is it wrong to talk about wanting/lack of etc DT Starbucks? (which is what this topic is) Maybe not. Is it very repetitive? Yes. I'm not even complaining about the constant 'DT is lagging' comments; That's only to be expected.   

ProjectMaximus

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #50 on: June 11, 2015, 11:23:25 PM »
^^^Well this article has nothing to do with selling or marketing the City of Jacksonville...and I doubt is anything you'd ever pass on to someone. 

You're right. I apologize for diverting the topic. It was a molehill and I didnt mean to make it more than that.
The article was indeed straightforward, but the sentence about city size was irrelevant, imo.

and if anyone ever gives it any sort of brainpower at all beyond reading a stupid arbitrary stat on paper, nobody is concluding that Jacksonville is bigger than Miami)

No, they go by stats on paper if that's all they have to go by. I HAVE heard people say that Jax is bigger than Miami. Obviously they're not about to make business decisions at that point, but it has been an initial misunderstanding on more than one occasion.

Adam White

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #51 on: June 12, 2015, 01:57:50 AM »
Is it wrong to point that out and hope it could be better?

Search the topic 'Starbucks'. 40 links of info (10 pages). Is it wrong to talk about wanting/lack of etc DT Starbucks? (which is what this topic is) Maybe not. Is it very repetitive? Yes. I'm not even complaining about the constant 'DT is lagging' comments; That's only to be expected.

Fair enough  ;)
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landfall

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #52 on: November 22, 2020, 10:55:23 AM »
Old article I know, but I was thinking about this the other day and came across the article/discussion via google search. Seems of the other cities posted, only Tuscon still doesn't have a DT Starbucks in some form in the five years since this was posted. Others such as Rochester also have presence of other big chains such as Dunkin and another local WNY chain Spot have a presence there.

I guess its just a reflection of where the city is at and how businesses view it. You'd think with the likes of Vystar moving DT there would be the market for something. Maybe it'll be the karat dangled by Khan and Curry to get what they want!  ;D

thelakelander

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #53 on: November 22, 2020, 11:04:39 AM »
Khan and Curry's Lot J dream coming to fruition is a long term dream. At the earliest, nothing is opening there until closer to the end of this decade at best. I'd keep my eye on Brooklyn. Definitely can see a chain style coffee house type business opening on Riverside Avenue with FIS corporate headquarters coming in.
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Ken_FSU

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #54 on: November 22, 2020, 11:22:34 AM »
^On the plus side, Urban Grind reopened their downtown store, there’s a new coffee shop coming to the old Vagabond spot, and you can still get Bold Bean at Bellwether, Seattle's Best at Brick, and coffee/tea at Chamblins. Last I heard, Vagabond is still planning to open their downtown flagship in the Barnett post-demic when the foot traffic returns. And if you’re really jonesing for Starbucks, there’s always the Hyatt. And, VyStar will have speciality coffee from Martin on tap as part of the new Bread and Board marketplace.

Agree though that a Starbucks proper would be a fantastic get for DT Jax, less because of a need more coffee and more from a perception perspective. Laura Street would be my preference. Either adjacent to the park as part of MOCA (the MOCA cafe shut down last week) or in one of the main llbrary’s retail spaces (opened up to the sidewalk). Would be so nice to have an active space fronting Hemming Park and those sidewalks are wide enough to accommodate lots of outdoor seating. 

Spending what we need to spend to get that retail space reconfigured (and the retail space in the office towers that Lake always talks about), getting the Trio going, and continuing to invest in James Weldon Park (still no new signage or new uniforms for the staff) would do more to jumpstart our downtown, at a much faster speed, at a much lower cost, than anything at the sports complex.


landfall

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #55 on: November 22, 2020, 11:50:06 AM »
^On the plus side, Urban Grind reopened their downtown store, there’s a new coffee shop coming to the old Vagabond spot, and you can still get Bold Bean at Bellwether, Seattle's Best at Brick, and coffee/tea at Chamblins. Last I heard, Vagabond is still planning to open their downtown flagship in the Barnett post-demic when the foot traffic returns. And if you’re really jonesing for Starbucks, there’s always the Hyatt. And, VyStar will have speciality coffee from Martin on tap as part of the new Bread and Board marketplace.

Agree though that a Starbucks proper would be a fantastic get for DT Jax, less because of a need more coffee and more from a perception perspective. Laura Street would be my preference. Either adjacent to the park as part of MOCA (the MOCA cafe shut down last week) or in one of the main llbrary’s retail spaces (opened up to the sidewalk). Would be so nice to have an active space fronting Hemming Park and those sidewalks are wide enough to accommodate lots of outdoor seating. 

Spending what we need to spend to get that retail space reconfigured (and the retail space in the office towers that Lake always talks about), getting the Trio going, and continuing to invest in James Weldon Park (still no new signage or new uniforms for the staff) would do more to jumpstart our downtown, at a much faster speed, at a much lower cost, than anything at the sports complex.
I never realised there was a Starbucks in the Hyatt? Is it an actual Starbucks or do they just stock Starbucks products at their breakfast offerings, convenience/vending options or the like?

Edit: Another google search.....seemingly they do serve a limited Starbucks menu offering within their Market restaurant.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2020, 11:54:13 AM by landfall »

thelakelander

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #56 on: November 22, 2020, 01:33:53 PM »
Perhaps another example of a building where the ground level spaces need to be better integrated into the sidewalks surrounding it or at least have some permanent outdoor signing and seating. What was an easy win and apparently a big miss with the Coastline Drive project as better integrating  the Morton's space into the riverwalk. If there's a Starbucks (or anything else in these hotels that also accepts non hotel guest's money), they need to be better exposed to the street. It seems a lot of focus is on big ticket things that will take years and a lot of money to happen. We'd get so much further, cheaper and quicker, if there was some extra emphasis on the little things that maximize the businesses and amenities already in operation.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2020, 01:35:32 PM by thelakelander »
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marcuscnelson

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #57 on: November 22, 2020, 04:40:17 PM »
Morton's opened in 2017. Coastline Drive has somehow been going since 2015. That aside, absolutely true. I imagine it's one of the things that would be greatly improved by a well-developed master plan, with standards for street-facing public spaces.

It's been said before that our city is addicted to "game-changer" projects. No one wants to focus on getting the basic fundamentals right, because they're always chasing the next game-changer.
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thelakelander

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #58 on: November 22, 2020, 05:37:16 PM »
There's been a restaurant in the Morton's space since the hotel opened nearly 20 years ago. It may have been closed in 2015 but if we were planning to have a more vibrant riverwalk, that's a spot we should have treated differently. The new riverwalk is really uninspiring along Market Street. 
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marcuscnelson

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Re: America's Largest Cities Without A Downtown Starbucks
« Reply #59 on: November 22, 2020, 06:40:35 PM »
Fair point. I suppose a master plan for the riverfront would have covered that, but of course, Jacksonville.
So, to the young people fighting in this movement for change, here is my charge: march in the streets, protest, run for school committee or city council or the state legislature. And win. - Ed Markey