Author Topic: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?  (Read 13791 times)

Metro Jacksonville

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Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« on: August 01, 2012, 03:00:24 AM »
Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?



Metro Jacksonville's Robert Mann presents an argument that years of planning for a 'Regional Transportation Center' have proved that Jacksonville Doesn't Get It!

Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2012-aug-is-the-jrtc-a-mistake-in-the-making

mbwright

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2012, 08:19:08 AM »
I grew up in Santa Ana, CA, and witnessed the building of the regional transportation center.  What a great, vibrant place it is.  There are many examples of good centers.  The goal should be to make everything as close and easy to use.  I really don't understand why the current plan is acceptable.  What ever happened to peer review?  Jacksonville always seems to get the worst designed, most expensive design, where it is predicted to fail, and then it does.  Just because you are a planner or PE, does not mean you have a clue.

jcjohnpaint

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2012, 08:45:58 AM »
And when are the people briefed on these plans.  I don't remember voting on the mobility fee moratorium either.  Hell I don't even remember hearing anything about it outside of MJ.  I think the same can be said about the movement taking place on this poor excuse of a TC.  I am for hiring from the inside of these people are competent, but that is not what we have here;  We need to start looking elsewhere. 

mbwright

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2012, 08:48:16 AM »
They need to scrap the current plan and start over.  MJ has posted much better, less expensive, and functional plans.  Give the people what they want, don't tell them what they want.

tufsu1

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2012, 08:59:33 AM »
^ the problem with that theory is a vast majority of people in Jacksonville probably see no need for the JRTC or transit at all.

as for the Greyhound Station, Mr. Blaylock told me last week that Greyhound really wants to be on Adams St..so they can get right onto I-95 NB....of course, never mind that being on Forsyth St would give them direct access from I-95 NB
« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 09:05:50 AM by tufsu1 »

wsansewjs

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2012, 10:04:09 AM »
"Oh for the love of the bloody poppycockies pippy pappy rubbish load of poppycock!"

JTA and its JRTC planners are the most stupidest organization on this planet. They want to blow our tax money for their own stupidity.

Do your part and tell them to SCRAP this plan, accept MJ's suggestion of their own plan, OR commission a new plan! Oh wait! They already wasted money on planning!

This frustrates me so much right now.

-Josh
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Tacachale

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2012, 10:13:44 AM »
Perhaps we can still consolidate the rest of the center even if Greyhound goes there. We still have time on the rest of it.
Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

JFman00

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2012, 10:29:48 AM »
It's an attempt,  but definitely not a very good one. I guess in Jacksonville sprawl terms, its a consolidated center. And the attempt at transit-oriented development is adorable.

But effort isn't enough. Cattle have experienced more rational and consolidated transportation center than the JRTC. And while the arrangement of the TOD doesn't look too bad, it's not going to be mixed-use? That guarantees another neighborhood that shutters its blinds after 5 pm.

chipwich

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2012, 10:46:07 AM »
Safe to say, the City doesn't need a transportation center that spans 4 entire blocks.   I'm not sure even NYC needs a transportation center that spans nearly 4 football fields.  Even worse, it's on the outskirts of downtown.  It is near nothing of significance.  Even worse, all those buildings they labeled "retail" will sit vacant for as long as they as they used for that intended purpose.

Good job Jacksonville!


Captain Zissou

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2012, 01:05:34 PM »
What exactly does the city think they are going to do with the rest of the Prime Osborn property once the convention center moves?  They might as well put it to good use and fill it with transit.

Also, is there currently any show/conference/convention that takes place in the Prime that couldn't fit somewhere else??  between the Hyatt, the area, the fairgrounds, metro park, not to mention facilities outside of DT, I am pretty sure we could service the current convention center schedule with other venues for a few years until the new one is built.

JFman00

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2012, 01:22:55 PM »
Why not put a lot of the retail-only development in the Prime Osborne and the actual terminal buildings and make the spaces labeled retail as mixed-use?

vicupstate

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2012, 01:53:12 PM »
What exactly does the city think they are going to do with the rest of the Prime Osborn property once the convention center moves?  They might as well put it to good use and fill it with transit.

Also, is there currently any show/conference/convention that takes place in the Prime that couldn't fit somewhere else??  between the Hyatt, the area, the fairgrounds, metro park, not to mention facilities outside of DT, I am pretty sure we could service the current convention center schedule with other venues for a few years until the new one is built.

I was on vacation recently and maybe missed it, but is relocating the Convention Center a 'done' or even 'close to done' deal?  Last I heard there was a plan to use the old courthouse site, but still very much a proposal at this point.   
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tufsu1

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2012, 03:21:47 PM »
Perhaps we can still consolidate the rest of the center even if Greyhound goes there. We still have time on the rest of it.

I think JTA actually wants to do that...but until the City decided whether the Prime will or won't be a convention center, JTA feels its hands are tied.

They also constantly bring up the fact that they already have environmental approvals...and changes now would require going back and amending those

Tacachale

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2012, 04:14:34 PM »
^Yeah, the convention center issue is something that needs to be solved, quick. We'll see.

On the environmental approvals, I'd rather stick JTA with a little more paperwork than stick Jacksonville with higher costs and second-rate buildings, but maybe that's just me.

Do you believe that when the blue jay or another bird sings and the body is trembling, that is a signal that people are coming or something important is about to happen?

Captain Zissou

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Re: Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2012, 05:23:08 PM »
What exactly does the city think they are going to do with the rest of the Prime Osborn property once the convention center moves?  They might as well put it to good use and fill it with transit.

Also, is there currently any show/conference/convention that takes place in the Prime that couldn't fit somewhere else??  between the Hyatt, the area, the fairgrounds, metro park, not to mention facilities outside of DT, I am pretty sure we could service the current convention center schedule with other venues for a few years until the new one is built.

I was on vacation recently and maybe missed it, but is relocating the Convention Center a 'done' or even 'close to done' deal?  Last I heard there was a plan to use the old courthouse site, but still very much a proposal at this point.   

It is not, but strong arguments have been made that the convention center is not worth its investment.  Regardless of what we do in the future, I think we need to quite using the PO as a convention center.