stephendare
Metro Jacksonville
Hero Member
Posts: 15132
truth beauty art and love
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« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2009, 05:11:03 PM » |
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For what purposes, Alex?
If the only way you can find them is by these methods, then the idea that they are a problem is a flat out lie.
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AlexS
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« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2009, 05:18:35 PM » |
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For what purposes, Alex?
If the only way you can find them is by these methods, then the idea that they are a problem is a flat out lie.
I edited my post. I meant a list of legal special use facilities (all other special use facilities would then be illegal). This should put the question to rest if there are 8, 10 or 12 of them. There was a difference in count between the SPAR list and Striders list. |
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sheclown
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« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2009, 05:52:34 PM » |
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I would say that Strider's list is probably more accurate.
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"And what is fear of need but need itself? Is not dread of thirst when your well is full, the thirst that is unquenchable?" Kahlil Gibran
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strider
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« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2009, 07:05:26 PM » |
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My list is accurate...less the one missing one. Ok, I found a way to find it and the list is now complete.
They are all grandfathered and licensed either by the DBPR or the Health Department.
Perhaps their list was an attempt at listing only rooming houses, otherwise I do not know why it is not accurate.
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"My father says that almost the whole world is asleep. Everybody you know. Everybody you see. Everybody you talk to. He says that only a few people are awake and they live in a state of constant total amazement." Patrica, Joe VS the Volcano.
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Springfield Girl
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« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2009, 11:28:14 PM » |
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I was told that the list of legal houses was obtained from the city and were the ones that had complied with all the requirements per the compromise last year.
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strider
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« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2009, 08:12:16 AM » |
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I know a couple not on their list did comply...... Also, the city never notified anyone, we had to and then add in the fact that no one even knew who to give the information too, we had to force the planning department to take it. In other words, do not think that if a facility is not on the "city list", as presented by SPAR Council, that it is illegal.
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"My father says that almost the whole world is asleep. Everybody you know. Everybody you see. Everybody you talk to. He says that only a few people are awake and they live in a state of constant total amazement." Patrica, Joe VS the Volcano.
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Springfield Girl
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« Reply #21 on: November 09, 2009, 11:06:01 AM » |
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It has nothing to do with SPAR council, the list was given to the org. by the city. We all have to go on info given as no one can read minds or pull the info out of thin air. The city gave it, SPAR council accepted it in good faith and that was passed on to us residents.
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ChriswUfGator
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« Reply #22 on: November 09, 2009, 12:52:47 PM » |
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It has nothing to do with SPAR council, the list was given to the org. by the city. We all have to go on info given as no one can read minds or pull the info out of thin air. The city gave it, SPAR council accepted it in good faith and that was passed on to us residents.
You've got a catch-22 problem there SG. SPAR has always been the ones making the big stink about this issue and "gathering evidence" and turning all the information over to COJ, plus orchestrating mass-complaint call-ins, etc. So "COJ's" list no doubt relied heavily on everything SPAR has been spoon-feeding them. If SPAR then runs around claiming "it's COJ's list...", that's kind of ridiculous, because it's been SPAR's issue right from the beginning and most of COJ's info came from SPAR. |
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Springfield Girl
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« Reply #23 on: November 09, 2009, 05:58:43 PM » |
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No Chris, you've got it wrong as do many people. Most of us know the legal houses and the illegal houses. The legal ones have not been the problem for the most part. The city gave SPAR the most recent list of legal houses (the ones that provided all the needed documentation) and that is the list they provided online. Suspected illegal houses are known because neighbors seeing suspicious behavior have reported them. I have an illegal boarding house a block down from my home. How do I know? I and all the other neighbors for three blocks know because the owner had no window coverings for a long time. Along with visible locks on the doors, including the living room which has been turned into a rentable room, it is a constant revolving door of lowlifes. They show up in cabs at all hours, get out with their suitcases and leave the same way. There is constant turnover. Some are there for days, some weeks and others months. The owner is a real gem that lives in Miami but figured the game out pretty quickly. People ask how this can be done and it's easy. Just start moving folks in. The bums spread the word fast through their street network. Most of these people living in boarding houses have moved in and out of several in the neighborhood. They stay in one for a little while, quit paying rent, get kicked out then move to another. Guys will come back after being away for years and return to places they have stayed in the past. Needless to say it's getting a little confusing for them as things have changed so much. They have to street network a little to find the newest flophouses.
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strider
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« Reply #24 on: November 09, 2009, 08:05:56 PM » |
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This is the actual state licensed rooming houses within the boundaries of Historic Springfield. It is a different list than SPAR Council posted.
1214-1216 N. Main St.—Lone Palm Guest House
0
Is this the blue house next to the used car lot? I believe so.. Mr. Geisel (corrected per Sheclowns post) also owns the one on Laura and used to have others. I believe if you ask people like Phil Neary, you will find those places were always nice. It was a family enterprise for years. |
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« Last Edit: November 09, 2009, 08:15:37 PM by strider »
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"My father says that almost the whole world is asleep. Everybody you know. Everybody you see. Everybody you talk to. He says that only a few people are awake and they live in a state of constant total amazement." Patrica, Joe VS the Volcano.
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sheclown
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« Reply #25 on: November 09, 2009, 08:09:31 PM » |
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Ray Geisel
They have been in his family since the 60s, I believe. He remembers running around Valerios when he was a little boy and Valerios was a convenience store.
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"And what is fear of need but need itself? Is not dread of thirst when your well is full, the thirst that is unquenchable?" Kahlil Gibran
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strider
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« Reply #26 on: November 09, 2009, 08:14:13 PM » |
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It has nothing to do with SPAR council, the list was given to the org. by the city. We all have to go on info given as no one can read minds or pull the info out of thin air. The city gave it, SPAR council accepted it in good faith and that was passed on to us residents.
SG, I said: I know a couple not on their list did comply...... Also, the city never notified anyone, we had to and then add in the fact that no one even knew who to give the information too, we had to force the planning department to take it. In other words, do not think that if a facility is not on the "city list", as presented by SPAR Council, that it is illegal. If someone looks at the list provided to SPAR Council by the city and calls in complaints on a legally licensed facility because it isn't on that list, it will mean nothing except that the owner will be getting a visit and the state or city will waste more of our tax dollars. If they are licensed and in business today, they are legal. As to pulling it out of thin air or reading minds to get it, try searching on the DBPR site and then PM me and I can tell you how to find it on the Heath Department site. Pretty darn easy actually....all you have to do is care enough to get the true information for yourself. Are you trying to say the people over at SPAR Council aren't up to the task? |
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"My father says that almost the whole world is asleep. Everybody you know. Everybody you see. Everybody you talk to. He says that only a few people are awake and they live in a state of constant total amazement." Patrica, Joe VS the Volcano.
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AlexS
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« Reply #27 on: November 10, 2009, 12:10:44 AM » |
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SG, I said: I know a couple not on their list did comply...... Also, the city never notified anyone, we had to and then add in the fact that no one even knew who to give the information too, we had to force the planning department to take it. In other words, do not think that if a facility is not on the "city list", as presented by SPAR Council, that it is illegal.
If someone looks at the list provided to SPAR Council by the city and calls in complaints on a legally licensed facility because it isn't on that list, it will mean nothing except that the owner will be getting a visit and the state or city will waste more of our tax dollars. If they are licensed and in business today, they are legal.
That is truly sad. Which means the overlay and zoning code means nothing as the city truly does not have the means or record keeping to enforce it. So why even bother to pass the overlay amendment ? But then the City really does not have to notify any one. Not knowing the law or being ignorant to it does not keep you immune. |
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strider
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« Reply #28 on: November 10, 2009, 12:41:33 AM » |
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Alex, in this case, the fact that the places hold licenses that can be traced back many years sort of has the same effect as "complying" as that was the intent to begin with. The same places that were grandfathered before 1046 are still grandfatherd today.
You are right, in a way, about the notification of the law, however, as this is a zoning issue and not criminal, once they do notify, they must give "reasonable time" to comply. And "reasonable time" could be a long time, depending on circumstance.
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"My father says that almost the whole world is asleep. Everybody you know. Everybody you see. Everybody you talk to. He says that only a few people are awake and they live in a state of constant total amazement." Patrica, Joe VS the Volcano.
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ChriswUfGator
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« Reply #29 on: November 10, 2009, 08:59:14 AM » |
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No Chris, you've got it wrong as do many people. Most of us know the legal houses and the illegal houses. The legal ones have not been the problem for the most part. The city gave SPAR the most recent list of legal houses (the ones that provided all the needed documentation) and that is the list they provided online. Suspected illegal houses are known because neighbors seeing suspicious behavior have reported them. I have an illegal boarding house a block down from my home. How do I know? I and all the other neighbors for three blocks know because the owner had no window coverings for a long time. Along with visible locks on the doors, including the living room which has been turned into a rentable room, it is a constant revolving door of lowlifes. They show up in cabs at all hours, get out with their suitcases and leave the same way. There is constant turnover. Some are there for days, some weeks and others months. The owner is a real gem that lives in Miami but figured the game out pretty quickly. People ask how this can be done and it's easy. Just start moving folks in. The bums spread the word fast through their street network. Most of these people living in boarding houses have moved in and out of several in the neighborhood. They stay in one for a little while, quit paying rent, get kicked out then move to another. Guys will come back after being away for years and return to places they have stayed in the past. Needless to say it's getting a little confusing for them as things have changed so much. They have to street network a little to find the newest flophouses.
Before I got back to the thread, Strider had already addressed this better than I could. |
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