State Rd 9B

[Mattius92]

First off, instead of spending over $250 Million on 9B and $1.8 Billion on the Outer Beltway, we should just rebuild all the crappy interchanges on our already built piece o' crap highways. I can name some of them off, Blanding, San Jose, 103rd, JTB at I-95 (completely retarded interchange), and maybe US-17 at I-295.

Second, apparently Jacksonville doesn't want to grow up (yep we wont grow up), but out (getting fatter with urban sprawl everyday). However maybe these developers should look at the current infrastructure before laying down several hundred homes in St. Johns or Clay.

Lastly, for everyone that is complaining about the traffic and crap in Jacksonville. Sorry to say, but you can LEAVE. Complaining about it isn't really going to do anything. Last time I complained about traffic, guess what. NOTHING HAPPENED.

Go figure I moved 45 minutes west of Jacksonville in a nice town called Maxville, no traffic there.

Matt (btw I am 17, and i lived in Jacksonville my whole life, loved it, but as soon as I graduate I am gone.)

[reednavy]

JTB & I-95 is being rebuilt right now.

[riverside planner]

JTB & I-95 is being rebuilt right now.

That interchange is not being rebuilt; rather it is being "improved".  A true rebuilding of that interchange would remove the cluster that is a traffic signal at the intersection of two limited access roadways.

[cline]

JTB & I-95 is being rebuilt right now.

There is currently a PD&E being done for a complete rebuild of the I-95/JTB/US1 interchange.  However, I do not believe there is funding for construction at this point. 

http://www.butler95.com/

[reednavy]

That interchange is not being rebuilt; rather it is being "improved".  A true rebuilding of that interchange would remove the cluster that is a traffic signal at the intersection of two limited access roadways.

Improved, rebuilt, tomato, tomatoe, to me it sounds too damn similar. That'd be like saying they're improving The Big I and not rebuilding.

They've at least partially rebuilt something, so it qualifies in my mind. However, they can't get started on total reconstruction soon enough.

[cline]

Improved, rebuilt, tomato, tomatoe, to me it sounds too damn similar. That'd be like saying they're improving The Big I and not rebuilding.

They've at least partially rebuilt something, so it qualifies in my mind. However, they can't get started on total reconstruction soon enough.

You're right, technically they are building something.  At this point they are adding more entrance and exit lanes onto I-95 which should significantly help matters.  They did the same thing at CR210 and I-95 in St. Johns County and it greatly improved congestion.  The total rebuild of the intersection is much more involved though.  If you look at the design alternatives on the website, some of them are pretty crazy.

[Mattius92]

See, when FDOT build an crappy interchange, and then find out. Wow this isnt going to support us anymore, lets add more lanes for even more cars to get congested in. Take Blanding or Roosevelt Blvd, those two exits are some of the busiest in Jacksonville. Yet, all they an do to fix it is add lanes, so you can still hit TWO lights before you can even drive. (sorry but I have a thing against the Blanding interchange, never liked it and never will unless they rebuild it, I will probably come back to J-ville in 20 years and it be the same)

Part of my family moved to Louisville, KY. Which is another lovely urban sprawl, however the interchange where I-264 and Shelbyville road meet. It is a massive interchange that has NO lights (its like a interstate/interstate interchange) and it supports the two massive malls on both sides of the highway and there is hardly any traffic. If Blanding was even close to this, there would be a lot more happy poeple in Duval and Clay. For me I think the interchange is the most important part of an highway. Because its usually where you go from around 60/70 MPH to Zero. If you can make an interchange that you never have to hit zero, you have an WAY better transition and less traffic and frustration.  

Tell me if I am wrong, and then I will shut up.

Matt

[Mattius92]

I just finished looking at the design alternatives for the JTB/I-95/US-1 hellhole, and I was pretty impressed by design A/A (http://www.butler95.com/docs/alternatives/AlternativeAA.pdf) I can just look at it and imagine how much better the whole system there would work. And afterwards JTB could actually be called an freeway as opposed to an Blvd.

The thing is, they have no money. That interchange by the looks of it will cost around $300-400 Million. Something at the cost well could take 10-15 years to fund, and by then it will be like the mega hellhole.

[stjr]

The question I have is when are the residents, businesses, and political leaders of DUVAL County that support 9B and the Outer Beltway going to realize:

(1) these highways mostly benefit and promote residents moving to St. Johns and Clay Counties
(2) cost Duval taxpayers in additional infrastructure and traffic burdens within Duval
(3) fail to deliver significant offsetting revenues to Duval to pay for such burdens as most of these road users live and shop in the adjacent counties
(4) negatively impact business and residents in Duval County by siphoning off higher income residents and new businesses to the adjacent counties
(5) divert state monies from Duval mass transit projects, road improvements, and other state funded programs such as education.

There is absolutely no SANE and RATIONAL reason for Duval County politicos, if they truly represent Duval residents, to support these projects and yet they are all lined up to do so.  Could it be due to campaign contributions?  Back room deals?

[fsujax]

and also they do not make money or pay for themselves! so we should stop investing in these insanely high priced highway projects!

[Mattius92]

The question I have is when are the residents, businesses, and political leaders of DUVAL County that support 9B and the Outer Beltway going to realize:

(1) these highways mostly benefit and promote residents moving to St. Johns and Clay Counties
(2) cost Duval taxpayers in additional infrastructure and traffic burdens within Duval
(3) fail to deliver significant offsetting revenues to Duval to pay for such burdens as most of these road users live and shop in the adjacent counties
(4) negatively impact business and residents in Duval County by siphoning off higher income residents and new businesses to the adjacent counties
(5) divert state monies from Duval mass transit projects, road improvements, and other state funded programs such as education.

There is absolutely no SANE and RATIONAL reason for Duval County politicos, if they truly represent Duval residents, to support these projects and yet they are all lined up to do so.  Could it be due to campaign contributions?  Back room deals?

I lived in Duval for 11 years, Clay for 6 years and St. Johns for 2 years. And the one thing you have to know that all these counties make of the Jacksonville Metro area. I dont support any county helping each other, but lets say Duval has a nice highway and then as soon as you go over the county boarder you hit this crappy 4-lane road that they call an highway. It wont help the the entire metro area as an whole. The key is a solid infrastructure.

Now I want to talk about another thing. Everyone is talking about going out is bad, so we should build up. Jacksonville has never been about going up. I am sure poeple move here because they dont have to share a building with anyone else. Of course this creates sprawl, but have you noticed all the proposed towers for downtown Jacksonville. Hardly any sold, or where even built.

Last is the importance of an proper mass transit system. I do agree with that, and if a Light rail system was to be built and the Skyway to be linked to it. And if downtown Jacksonville would actually get some major office towers then just maybe our urban sprawl agenda might be stopped. I would love to live in a residential tower in Downtown Jacksonville, but I am single. I dont think they are much help for families, families want their own home, in their own neighborhood. So looks like the residential towers are just for the retired and the single person families.

9B should be built, the Outer beltway not so much. It provides an direct link to Regency, JAXPORT, and the Beaches, three of Jacksonville's biggest assets.

Matt

[Mattius92]

and also they do not make money or pay for themselves! so we should stop investing in these insanely high priced highway projects!

Fact of life, if you are so against them. Then sell your car and house. Move next to your work, buy a bike and be happy.

[fsujax]

^^haha. I am not against them. I was simply pointing out an argument that is quite often used against investing in transit. I love to drive on highways, ramps and bridges. I believe we should have it all and give people choices.

[ProjectMaximus]

I would love to live in a residential tower in Downtown Jacksonville, but I am single. I dont think they are much help for families, families want their own home, in their own neighborhood. So looks like the residential towers are just for the retired and the single person families.

Matt

Fortunately, this is slowly changing. The allure of urban environments is methodically attracting new generations of FAMILIES away from suburban lifestyles. Not that it's gonna go away, but the overall attitude is changing, for reasons both romanticized and practical.

[stjr]

I would love to live in a residential tower in Downtown Jacksonville, but I am single. I dont think they are much help for families, families want their own home, in their own neighborhood. So looks like the residential towers are just for the retired and the single person families.

Tell this to all the families raising kids in NY City towers.  The problem in Jax is if you live Downtown, there are no Downtown walk-to (that excludes Metro Park) parks for families to take kids to play ball, ride bikes in a secure area, fly a kite, play in a sandbox or on a swing, play tag or hide and seek, etc.  If you look at my posts on Downtown threads, you will see that I believe this is a major contributor to why Downtown fails to attract residents, not just families, but people of all ages.

We might pick up Metro Park as a solution if JTA ran a 3 or 4x an hour run, 7 days a week, from Downtown but I don't see that on the drawing boards.  Maybe, with the Metro Park overhaul, that should be a required component.  I believe it when I see it.