Author Topic: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered  (Read 24836 times)

Jason

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St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« on: June 11, 2009, 02:40:04 PM »
Quote
Train depot restoration considered

By KATI BEXLEY   |   More by this reporter  |  kati.bexley@staugustine.com   |   Posted: Monday, June 8, 2009 ; Updated: 12:34 AM on Monday, June 8, 2009

City commissioners will review today a nearly $2 million plan to restore a late 1800s building that was St. Augustine's first train depot.

City staff hired architect Dave Mancino to research the history and restoration of the building located on San Marco Avenue. The building, adjacent to the main branch of the St. Johns County Public Library System, is closed because it is so dilapidated.

Mancino is recommending the city restore the brick building to its orginal 1883-1885 style, which could cost between $1.2 million and $1.8 million, according to city staff. The building also once was the North City Waterworks Building.

Mancino is proposing the building become a community center with a large hall, a side terrace and an addition in the back for restrooms and a catering kitchen.

The commission will also discuss a couple of controversial topics in today's meeting, including a resolution requiring all new construction in two downtown historic areas to be Spanish or British colonial architecture.

This measure would replace a 2003 resolution allowing new buildings in those areas to be any architectural style that is similar to adjacent or nearby homes.

This resolution could also affect another agenda item -- a proposed boutique hotel to be built at 180 St. George St. that is up for final approval from the commission.

Architect Don Crichlow, also a city commissioner, designed a re-creation of the old brick Bishop Building that stood at 180 St. George St. and Cathedral Place until it was torn down in the 1960s.

The project has been criticized for its modernistic look.

Source: http://www.staugustine.com/stories/060809/news_060809_040.shtml

Jason

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2009, 02:40:48 PM »
Do you train gurus know anything about St. Augustine's railroad and streetcar history?

Lunican

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2009, 08:52:07 AM »
Here is a photo of the station:


thelakelander

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2009, 09:59:58 AM »
Do you train gurus know anything about St. Augustine's railroad and streetcar history?

Ock knows a ton.  We took images for a St. Augustine railroad article a little while ago.  We're just waiting for the text to go with it.
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thelakelander

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2009, 10:09:34 AM »
The image above is one of the last station, which is where San Marco Avenue meets US 1.  The station mentioned in this article is the one just north of the merry-go-round.
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Jason

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2009, 10:22:11 AM »
I was looking for the image above on the maps around the Library and couldn't find it.  Plus it doesn't look like turn of the century architecture either.  :)

Thanks for clearing that up Lake.

The depot mentioned in the article must be the small building between the Library and the Armory.  If so that is a pretty small train station.  I wonder where the tracks cam in and how far they went?

Jason

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2009, 10:28:20 AM »
The T. Gregory Imports building on Dismukes St. (a block north of the Library) actually looks more like that of an old train station, especially because of the angle it sits at with relation to the tracks and US-1.  a short spur could have easily branched off and terminated in front of the long building.

Ocklawaha

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2009, 10:29:26 AM »
Do you train gurus know anything about St. Augustine's railroad and streetcar history?

Silly question! Ha! Ha!


This is the older station but still not the 1880s version. This depot has been RECONSTRUCTED pretty close to the same identical lines, by the St. Augustine Fire Department, in it's ORIGINAL location right off US-1. All they did was change the pillars a bit, and add the fire truck house behind the depot. If you stop to visit, they are very kind and have a nice marker on the wall telling the story. From the front porch the restored FEC park is just as it would have looked to winter visitors stepping off the train in 1925.

This photo is not the 1880's station, it is in fact the 1960's prototype for all of the stations on the FEC. Sadly the strike hit just a couple of years after it was complete and the railroad built by the passenger train went FREIGHT ONLY. The Florida Public Utilities Commission stuck Ed Ball's feet in the fire and told him, if he wanted to keep the charter, he WOULD run passenger trains. Ball might have been the meanest SOB on the planet, but he could also be a class act. He restarted the passenger trains which typically were a single engine, coach and a FIRST CLASS, round end Tavern Lounge Observation Car. Trains #1 and #2 ran for another 4 years or so until the case went to the higher courts and the train came back off. Almost overnight the whole railroad did a house cleaning and EVERY depot was torn down except for an isolated few that could be leased. I well remember South Jacksonville, Yelvington, Ormond, New Smyrna Beach and Daytona Beaches beautiful Spanish arched, court yard like station. Daytona was the last to go lasting until about 1990. One day there was a historic station and the NEXT day a lumber yard!

Wonder what would have happened had the depots all been completed. The day of the last train I sat on the bench for hours in the courtyard in your photograph, the station agent had given me sacks of anything not nailed down. Later they shifted the mainline from alongside US-1 to a location behind the massive old shops that once stood north of this depot. Miller Shops rivaled the famous Beech Grove, or Altoona, in sheer size and impression.

This depot is still accessable, there would need to be a new passenger track to spin off the mainline behind the adjacent strip mall, loop past the Cell Tower? and curve back south to rejoin the mainline south of the station. Otherwise, from my snooping around and talking to FEC folks, it really seems like they just locked the doors yesterday... God I miss those days.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2020, 10:08:17 AM by Ocklawaha »

Ocklawaha

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2009, 10:36:55 AM »


The St. Augustine and South Beach Railway, and the St. Augustine and North Beach Railway, both served as the City's horse car trolley lines. Both seem to have been toll bridge operators as well. The South Beach bridge was just South of the Bridge of the Lions and accounts for all the piles in the river on the West side by the Seafood Place.

Later the companies consolidated, the St. Johns Electric Railway took over and expanded up King into West St. Augustine, operations continued to both beaches using most all of the current older boulevards in the historic part of town.

It was an early victim of the automobile and a warning to Jacksonville Traction Comapny when it sold out to a "city bus line" and shut down the streetcars. An early visionary fought like hell to keep it preaching that it would someday become a unique attraction... As usual, Florida didn't listen... If I find his name, I'll post it somewhere... (Yes I know, and NO! I'm not THAT OLD ... YET!)

« Last Edit: January 15, 2020, 10:09:07 AM by Ocklawaha »

Jason

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2009, 10:41:29 AM »
Is the fire station you speak of the one right next to the FEC building?

And I assume Bridge St. is where the old South Beach bridge extended from?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2009, 10:45:32 AM by Jason »

Ocklawaha

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2009, 11:34:49 AM »
Yes, next to the Flagler College, former FEC offices, next building NORTH.

« Last Edit: January 15, 2020, 10:10:01 AM by Ocklawaha »

Cliffs_Daughter

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2009, 12:31:13 PM »
Forgive me for not knowing the proper site-citing here, but...

http://www.drbronsontours.com/bronsonunionrailwaystation.html
Ock, is this what you were talking about?
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Ocklawaha

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2009, 12:47:59 PM »

An OCKLA-SHOT of the new depot about 1960

Beautiful find Cliffs-Daughter! Yes, this is the depot. In your photo the little barn like building was for the railroads private cars/office and business. There was once a platform that ran along the west side of the current parking lot with 2 or 3 tracks serving it. These were the remains of the old depot days and were kept in use up through about 1963. Millionaires visiting town would have their own PV's (private varnish = Private railroad cars = so called because in the older wooden car [wild wild west movie or show] days the cars used GOLD LEAF and layers of sparkling varnish).

Your view looks South toward the office building. The station and tracks now long gone, replaced by the new depot about a mile north. The PARK is still in place and so is the fountain. St. Augustine/St. Johns County did a banner job of preservation and careful reconstruction. Laurels to whoever thought up the reconstruction of such a historic station for the fire department. EVERYONE should make a stop and go read the marker and take a few photos... Show our "leaders" that we really do give a damn about where we come from.


OCKLAWAHA
« Last Edit: January 15, 2020, 10:13:00 AM by Ocklawaha »

Jason

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2009, 12:51:23 PM »
So is the original depot in question (supposedly sitting adjacent the library) in fact the small structure by the armory.

Ocklawaha

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Re: St. Augustine: Train depot restoration considered
« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2009, 12:58:24 PM »
I won't answer that Jason until I do some more snooping around, if it is indeed the "DEPOT" then it would pre-date the 1880's, meaning it could be the oldest standing railroad station in the NATION! The St. Johns Railway ran from Tocoi Landing to St. Augustine (1829 early 1900's) and terminated in that area. The Jacksonville, St. Augustine and Halifax River (NARROW GAUGE RAILROAD) from JAX to ST AUGUSTINE, also predates Flagler. We need to find out which company built it.

OCKLAWAHA