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Author Topic: Lost Jacksonville  (Read 15373 times)

Ocklawaha

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #135 on: June 02, 2012, 10:37:36 PM »
Well I'd be screwed, because I couldn't possibly get the 1504 steam locomotive up in that hotel suite. She'd be great for a really hot night but I guess I'll just have to dream about it.


Timkin

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #136 on: June 03, 2012, 01:28:12 AM »
Well I'd be screwed, because I couldn't possibly get the 1504 steam locomotive up in that hotel suite. She'd be great for a really hot night but I guess I'll just have to dream about it.




The 1504 Needs to be protected from further deterioration from the elements.  I CANNOT believe the City cannot at least Cough up a  "Carport" type building to park the Locomotive under. Depressing when blocks away sits a multimillion dollar courthouse .  Something is wrong with this picture.

BackinJax05

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #137 on: June 03, 2012, 10:02:08 PM »
Well I'd be screwed, because I couldn't possibly get the 1504 steam locomotive up in that hotel suite. She'd be great for a really hot night but I guess I'll just have to dream about it.

Sex with a locomotive?? Why didnt I think of that! :)

1504 would sure beat a blow up doll. LOL

BackinJax05

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #138 on: June 03, 2012, 10:05:04 PM »
Well I'd be screwed, because I couldn't possibly get the 1504 steam locomotive up in that hotel suite. She'd be great for a really hot night but I guess I'll just have to dream about it.




The 1504 Needs to be protected from further deterioration from the elements.  I CANNOT believe the City cannot at least Cough up a  "Carport" type building to park the Locomotive under. Depressing when blocks away sits a multimillion dollar courthouse .  Something is wrong with this picture.

So true. And dont forget the Seaboard Coast Line pullman sleeper on Bay Street, incorrectly named Orange Blossom Special. She sits slowly rusting away, too. But the olive drab paint hides it better.

Ocklawaha

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #139 on: June 03, 2012, 10:28:22 PM »
Well I'd be screwed, because I couldn't possibly get the 1504 steam locomotive up in that hotel suite. She'd be great for a really hot night but I guess I'll just have to dream about it.

Sex with a locomotive?? Why didnt I think of that! :)

1504 would sure beat a blow up doll. LOL

Hey, it's the only machine ever created by man that not only responds to human touch, many machines can do that, but a steam locomotive breathes, inhales, exhales, heats up, sweats and has a raging inferno in its fire box. Yeah, I'm in love! LOL!

The Pullman is just another sad story in our rush to be the 'authentic' version of Orlando's plastic world. Orlando has 'a train' at Church Street Station, so Jacksonville has a locomotive and Pullman to decorate our temple of transportation turned garden show mecca. Doesn't matter what train the Pullman came off of? Doesn't matter that it's not properly restored? Who cares about fake lettering? This isn't a museum exhibit is it? Nobody would expect us to do it right and thus create an attraction would they? Why have an attraction when we can use it like a Christmas Bulb on a oak tree? Think anyone will know the difference? Imagine the thousands that have passed by and exclaimed, 'a train! a train!' isn't that good enough? Isn't Jacksonville 'good enough'? Do we really want to continue to be known as the city of 'good enough?'

Don't worry boys and girls, some consultant told the convention center people that if we recklessly threw some trains around the building, it would thus be 'authentic.' The consultant no doubt, couldn't tell a locomotive from a caboose, THANK GOD that he didn't get us a deal on some 4 wheel European wagons... what an exhibit THAT would be all lettered 'Atlantic Coast Line.' 

Timkin

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #140 on: June 03, 2012, 11:06:48 PM »
Perhaps we need to take matters into our own hands, as  kind hearted volunteers do from time to time, and go show the old Locomotive some love.  I would chip in on paint for it.  10 of us or more could do much to improve the  1504.  Anything is better than the city letting the thing sit there in the sun and elements and deterioration.   There is no good reason the city should object or stand in our way of doing something to improve the 1504.

BackinJax05

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #141 on: June 04, 2012, 03:29:21 AM »
Well I'd be screwed, because I couldn't possibly get the 1504 steam locomotive up in that hotel suite. She'd be great for a really hot night but I guess I'll just have to dream about it.

Sex with a locomotive?? Why didnt I think of that! :)

1504 would sure beat a blow up doll. LOL

Hey, it's the only machine ever created by man that not only responds to human touch, many machines can do that, but a steam locomotive breathes, inhales, exhales, heats up, sweats and has a raging inferno in its fire box. Yeah, I'm in love! LOL!

True! AND steam locomotives never get tired or have headaches. (However, they ARE high maintenance and thats a headache of its own)

The Pullman is just another sad story in our rush to be the 'authentic' version of Orlando's plastic world. Orlando has 'a train' at Church Street Station, so Jacksonville has a locomotive and Pullman to decorate our temple of transportation turned garden show mecca. Doesn't matter what train the Pullman came off of? Doesn't matter that it's not properly restored? Who cares about fake lettering? This isn't a museum exhibit is it? Nobody would expect us to do it right and thus create an attraction would they? Why have an attraction when we can use it like a Christmas Bulb on a oak tree? Think anyone will know the difference? Imagine the thousands that have passed by and exclaimed, 'a train! a train!' isn't that good enough? Isn't Jacksonville 'good enough'? Do we really want to continue to be known as the city of 'good enough?'

As for the Pullman, restored it would make a great guest house or private car - if Amtrak certified.

The "train" at Church Street Station is gone. Yes, I know it was a fake ACL, too. (or was it SAL). As I recall it was sold to a private collector. Its a good thing, too. Sitting in the worst part of Orlando it was subject to lots of vandalism. I rode past it a few times on the Silver Star and couldnt help noticing tagging on the cars, along with broken windows, and holes punched in the floors. Makes me think of the poor caboose sitting & rusting out at Bruce Park, but thats another story.

At least the Pullman here hasnt been vandalized yet. Or maybe it has. I havent been down that way in awhile.

Don't worry boys and girls, some consultant told the convention center people that if we recklessly threw some trains around the building, it would thus be 'authentic.' The consultant no doubt, couldn't tell a locomotive from a caboose, THANK GOD that he didn't get us a deal on some 4 wheel European wagons... what an exhibit THAT would be all lettered 'Atlantic Coast Line.'

JerryS

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #142 on: July 06, 2012, 08:22:15 PM »
It's so sad to see those old building gone.  During the years of 1956 thru 1958 I was an usher at the Florida theather and I also rode  bike delivering  telegrams for Western Union.  I remember the train station leaving on the train for Chicago going to navy boot camp.  There was no mall back then every thing was down town. The only movie houses that I knew of back then on the west side was the lake shore, fairfax,edgewood and the Murray Hill and of course the Normandy drive Inn. Currently I live in Ocala and my wife and I drove to Jax the first time I have been back in twenty years.  I couldn't believe how far blanding blvd goes out.  When I was a kid as soon as you crossed cedar creek  the road was two lanes and you were in the boonies.  The only time anybody went to Orange Park back then was to buy beer on Sunday.  Well so much of my rambling from an old fart.

Ocklawaha

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #143 on: July 06, 2012, 11:36:05 PM »
Yeah, and when I was in school (JEB Stuart - Today) we had Pritchett's Kitchen right at the Cedar River Bridge, and Lum's hotdogs, boiled in beer... The first time I ever saw what would later be called 'N' scale trains, was at the old Pic-N-Save on Blanding. My best friend in school, Matt Skeins father owned the House of Bargains stores and they had a big one on Blanding. Do you remember Coopers Hardware?

ronchamblin

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #144 on: July 07, 2012, 01:31:01 AM »
Ock… do I remember Cooper’s?  When we moved from Baltimore to Jax in ’49, I was seven and Cooper’s Hardware was renting a space on the west side of Wesconnett Blvd about 150’ north of 103rd.  It was the closest thing we had to a Home Depot back then.  Western Auto was to some degree the neighborhood hardware.  For us tinkerers and builders, Sears downtown was a help.  I sensed that the Cooper fellows loved their work. 

 
There were no malls and no convenience stores until the mid to late fifties.  There were the occasional country stores, small but having good variety.  They all smelled the same, an interesting mix of clothes, hardware, snacks, sodas, tobacco, and damp wood floors.  To buy something substantial, one had to go downtown. 


Apparently Cooper sold to Gunning sometime in the sixties, and Gunning built a new spot, and moved across the street.  I recall that upon selling to Gunning, one or two of the Cooper fellows bought land in Brazil, to farm or something.  But something happened in Brazil, perhaps the government at the time took what the Coopers had so they fled the chaos, moving to Middleburg.   


Many of the people moving into the area in the forties and fifies were building houses themselves, as we did on the south end of Firestone Road.  Our first winter in Jax was in a partially completed house my father built.  I don’t recall any building inspections back then.  Everybody used the black four volume Audel builders set for carpentry and other building help.  My father’s co-workers at the shipyards would help with the electrical work.  Apparently my father got no help on plumbing because in the eighties I found a sink where he used a 1/2"  iron pipe for the drain.  It always clogged.  Everything was iron pipe.  There was no PVC, copper, plywood, or sheetrock.  The 4’ x 8’ wall panels were a kind of brown fiber material, which one could easily tear with hands, of about ½” thick, with a thin white painting surface.  All lumber was cut and drilled by hand.  No electric saws or drills.         


For about a year, we had a roof, but no walls.  On the outside we had the occasional wood cross member to strengthen the entire structure.  For wind and blowing rain protection we had surplus military canvas on the outside walls, which flapped in the wind.  We had a small potbelly wood stove which would glow red.  We huddled around the potbelly that first winter.  After about a year of canvas, we had siding in the way of tar paper or felt covering the outside 1 x 6 lumber.  We were somewhat poor, but we kids didn’t really feel it.  We had plenty to eat, having a good garden and chickens and other animals.  Most others on Firestone were like us, although some seemed to approach rich persons, having the occasional new auto, and a brick house.  Our first TV was about 1953.  It was of course black and white, and always rolled and fluttered just when you were watching something interesting.  We didn’t have Internet.   


Ricker Road was dirt south of Morse Ave until the early sixties.  Morse Ave was dirt from Firestone to Jammes until the early sixties.  Seems like Ricker was dirt from 103rd north to Old Middleburg until the late fifties.  What am I saying.  At some point they were all dirt.   
« Last Edit: July 07, 2012, 01:42:54 AM by ronchamblin »

BackinJax05

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #145 on: July 08, 2012, 01:02:12 AM »
Yeah, and when I was in school (JEB Stuart - Today) we had Pritchett's Kitchen right at the Cedar River Bridge, and Lum's hotdogs, boiled in beer... The first time I ever saw what would later be called 'N' scale trains, was at the old Pic-N-Save on Blanding. My best friend in school, Matt Skeins father owned the House of Bargains stores and they had a big one on Blanding. Do you remember Coopers Hardware?

I LOVED Lum's hot dogs. There used to be one on Merrill Road, near Cesery. Back then both roads were 2 lanes. Pizza Butt (hut) was next door. Merrill Road Center was (& still is) across the street. It had an Eckerd Drug Store & Winn Dixie as anchors.

The closest Pic-N-Save was at Town-N-Country, next to Pantry Pride, which was next to the theatre, which was across from Waltz Restaurant. ;D Years later, Pic-N-Save moved to a larger store in the strip. Pantry Pride remained for a few more years.

Today all of it is gone. Merrill Road Center and Town and Country remain, empty shells of what they once were.

WmNussbaum

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #146 on: July 08, 2012, 01:21:08 PM »
I'm posting this mostly for my own benefit as a record. Page 7, photo 41 is the Clark Building which had one of the last open cage elevators in town as far as I know. It was not air-conditioned. The owner also owned Oriental Gardens  just south of San Marco on the Southside.

The storefront right on the corner - Gus Panos produce - was later occupied by Lowe's Cut Rate Drugs.

The building was torn down in the mid- to late 60's.

WmNussbaum

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #147 on: July 08, 2012, 01:33:37 PM »
Many posts to this forum and others on MJ bemoan the loss of the old buildings. But I think many of the posters who rail against the demolitions also favor the growth of the City. I think the two views are at least somewhat inconsistent. Take the courthouse for example - not that the old one is exactly an architectural masterpiece. It served well for 50+ years, but now the city has grown and needs something considerably to serve for the next half century or so. Given its size, structure, and location, for what can it be used? If it is torn down, will its loss be decried 25 years later?

So it is with many of the buildings that were demolished - certainly the government buildings and all the small buildings. The only way for the downtown to grow was either to take down the old and build the new, or, if the old were left in place, to spread out geographically. A larger downtown area, in my opinion, would not be a good idea - it's too big as is.   

ben says

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #148 on: July 08, 2012, 01:36:32 PM »
I'm posting this mostly for my own benefit as a record. Page 7, photo 41 is the Clark Building which had one of the last open cage elevators in town as far as I know. It was not air-conditioned. The owner also owned Oriental Gardens  just south of San Marco on the Southside.

The storefront right on the corner - Gus Panos produce - was later occupied by Lowe's Cut Rate Drugs.

The building was torn down in the mid- to late 60's.

Does anyone know where to find some history on Oriental Gardens? I was born and raised there--lived there for over 20 years--but outside of a few phrases like "this road used to be Oriental gardens" and "some guy owned this land and tourists came here"--can't find anything.

thelakelander

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Re: Lost Jacksonville
« Reply #149 on: July 08, 2012, 02:43:58 PM »
I'm using my cell to make this reply, so I can't cut & paste the link. Type "Oriental Gardens" in the MJ search engine (I swear it works for paste front page articles).
« Last Edit: July 08, 2012, 02:48:23 PM by thelakelander »