Did Wayne Weaver mess up by putting up the tarps?

[Debbie Thompson]

Agree about the FL/GA game. To build the stadium too large just to accommodate that one game seems silly now. But then they didn't know how the NFL team would work out, and FL/GA is a big event and money maker for Jax.  Even when they said Jax got the NFL team, the naysayers were already saying we couldn't keep it, and how many years now have we heard the team is supposedly leaving?  Just about since they got here.  So maybe the City was hedging it's bets on the stadium.

Were the Jags were trying to force up the average ticket prices?  We used to sit in the Family Fun Zone, now covered by tarps.  Our tickets were $200 a year.  And when they discounted them in year 5 or 6, we were in the top 4 rows, and they went to $100 a year.  OK, that's maybe too cheap. But the cheapest seats I can find now are $350 a year, which is $35 a game, without parking, shuttle or refreshments.  I think many average families find it hard to afford that.  Take the tarps off and bring back the Family Fun Zone at $200.  Even if you sold them at $100 a season, you'd make more than covering them up.  But then, isn't the blackout rule contingent on some % of premium seats? Maybe that's why they covered up the cheap seats. To make it easier to hit that percentage of premium seats.

[duvaldude08]

Agree about the FL/GA game. To build the stadium too large just to accommodate that one game seems silly now. But then they didn't know how the NFL team would work out, and FL/GA is a big event and money maker for Jax.  Even when they said Jax got the NFL team, the naysayers were already saying we couldn't keep it, and how many years now have we heard the team is supposedly leaving?  Just about since they got here.  So maybe the City was hedging it's bets on the stadium.

Were the Jags were trying to force up the average ticket prices?  We used to sit in the Family Fun Zone, now covered by tarps.  Our tickets were $200 a year.  And when they discounted them in year 5 or 6, we were in the top 4 rows, and they went to $100 a year.  OK, that's maybe too cheap. But the cheapest seats I can find now are $350 a year, which is $35 a game, without parking, shuttle or refreshments.  I think many average families find it hard to afford that.  Take the tarps off and bring back the Family Fun Zone at $200.  Even if you sold them at $100 a season, you'd make more than covering them up.  But then, isn't the blackout rule contingent on some % of premium seats? Maybe that's why they covered up the cheap seats. To make it easier to hit that percentage of premium seats.

As far as the stadium, I they had to no choice but to accommodate the game. It has been pretty much a tradition here for decades and we were already about to lose the game because of the conditions of the gator bowl.  I wonder, have they approached the FL/GA about reducing the capcity and got their thoughts on it? If we rip out 10,000 seats and add 10,000 additional temporary seating for the game, I don't see what the problem would be. I don't think anyone has ever approached them about it. They DONT own the city nor the stadium.

And there us still a family zone, I cant remember exactly what section it is though. And now childrens tickets are half off.

[Bridges]

But the cheapest seats I can find now are $350 a year, which is $35 a game, without parking, shuttle or refreshments.  I think many average families find it hard to afford that.  Take the tarps off and bring back the Family Fun Zone at $200.  Even if you sold them at $100 a season, you'd make more than covering them up.  But then, isn't the blackout rule contingent on some % of premium seats? Maybe that's why they covered up the cheap seats. To make it easier to hit that percentage of premium seats.

Blackout rules are based on general bowl seating.  That is all seating excluding luxury boxes, terrace suite, and club seats.  In that regard, Jacksonville actually has a very small and marketable size for the blackout seating limits.  They covered those sections to reduce the general bowl size.  We take a lot of heat for the "sellout" number, but that includes club seats and is different than the "blackout" number.  The premium seats are a double edged sword.  The size of the sections helped us get the team and premium seats are where the team makes (or should make) a lot of it's ticket revenue.  I believe premium seat revenue isn't shared, although I might be wrong.  However, they cause us no to be able to "sellout" and are seated right in the camera frame for TV so everyone sees those empty seats. 

I understand that ticket prices seem high, but they are in line (in fact a little below the average) for NFL ticket prices.  I'm sorry to say it, but if we can't afford to hang with the rest of the NFL in ticket price, then it's only a matter of time before they look to relocate.  We have to be able to reach certain payroll limits and that requires that the product is sold at a certain level. 

As for the family fun zone and selling the tarped seats at a discount, I think this is a big no no.  Imagine sitting right next to the section and paying $35 for your season tickets and the guy next to you paid $10.  If you opened up the tarps for this kind of deal, I think you'd see more people just moving sections than new people coming in.

[copperfiend]

"Screw us" is pretty strong. I will say though, they were a bad idea and a black eye for the team and the city. I have a feeling that if he had someone like Mark Lamping working for him at the time  that I doubt we'd have those ugly things. But where Khan has Lamping running the business side of the team, Weaver seemed to do that by himself.

[Debbie Thompson]

Well, when they did have the Family Fun Zone, that's exactly what happened, Bridges.  And that's because it was in the corner of the stadium.  Our section was 447, top tier, visitor's side.  I actually loved it, because it was above what is now the Bud Zone, so we always got a river breeze, nice in Aug/Sept when the lower seats were in the triple digits and people were getting heat strokes. 

I didn't think the seats were bad. I don't think there's a bad seat there anywhere.  But we were actually behind the goal line, way up in the corner.  (Still, I could read the player's jersey numbers.) And...no alcohol sales, and no cursing allowed.  So the people in the next section over who were drinking 10-12 beers a game and screaming curse words at the players didn't want our cheap seats anyway!  LOL

I think it was a great way to make an NFL game affordable for everyone, and I'm sorry they did away with it.  The single game ticket price was still $40, so the cheap-seat benefit was only to season ticket holders.  And that encouraged season ticket holders for people of modest means.

[duvaldude08]

Well, when they did have the Family Fun Zone, that's exactly what happened, Bridges.  And that's because it was in the corner of the stadium.  Our section was 447, top tier, visitor's side.  I actually loved it, because it was above what is now the Bud Zone, so we always got a river breeze, nice in Aug/Sept when the lower seats were in the triple digits and people were getting heat strokes. 

I didn't think the seats were bad. I don't think there's a bad seat there anywhere.  But we were actually behind the goal line, way up in the corner.  (Still, I could read the player's jersey numbers.) And...no alcohol sales, and no cursing allowed.  So the people in the next section over who were drinking 10-12 beers a game and screaming curse words at the players didn't want our cheap seats anyway!  LOL

I think it was a great way to make an NFL game affordable for everyone, and I'm sorry they did away with it.  The single game ticket price was still $40, so the cheap-seat benefit was only to season ticket holders.  And that encouraged season ticket holders for people of modest means.

Debbie they still have the family fun zone. Its in the 200's near the goal post.

[Tacachale]

Agree about the FL/GA game. To build the stadium too large just to accommodate that one game seems silly now. But then they didn't know how the NFL team would work out, and FL/GA is a big event and money maker for Jax.  Even when they said Jax got the NFL team, the naysayers were already saying we couldn't keep it, and how many years now have we heard the team is supposedly leaving?  Just about since they got here.  So maybe the City was hedging it's bets on the stadium.

Were the Jags were trying to force up the average ticket prices?  We used to sit in the Family Fun Zone, now covered by tarps.  Our tickets were $200 a year.  And when they discounted them in year 5 or 6, we were in the top 4 rows, and they went to $100 a year.  OK, that's maybe too cheap. But the cheapest seats I can find now are $350 a year, which is $35 a game, without parking, shuttle or refreshments.  I think many average families find it hard to afford that.  Take the tarps off and bring back the Family Fun Zone at $200.  Even if you sold them at $100 a season, you'd make more than covering them up.  But then, isn't the blackout rule contingent on some % of premium seats? Maybe that's why they covered up the cheap seats. To make it easier to hit that percentage of premium seats.

As far as the stadium, I they had to no choice but to accommodate the game. It has been pretty much a tradition here for decades and we were already about to lose the game because of the conditions of the gator bowl.  I wonder, have they approached the FL/GA about reducing the capcity and got their thoughts on it? If we rip out 10,000 seats and add 10,000 additional temporary seating for the game, I don't see what the problem would be. I don't think anyone has ever approached them about it. They DONT own the city nor the stadium.

And there us still a family zone, I cant remember exactly what section it is though. And now childrens tickets are half off.

Here's the rub on that: if we didn't have the seats for FL-GA, we'd lose the game. And that one is a pure money maker for the city and local business alike.

Before we built the current incarnation of the stadium, we nearly lost FL-GA to the Citrus Bowl. We very likely would have lost it if we hadn't done the rebuild (though I think we would have done a rebuild even if we hadn't gotten the Jags, though not so extensive). Even since that time, nearly every year some interests at Georgia talk about dropping Jax. In trying to blame their recent losing record on the fact the game is played here, they've openly discussed moving the game to the campuses, or adding Atlanta's smaller, crappy stadium to the schedule. The primary reason the game is kept here is due to the size and quality of the 'Bank which means all involved make more money than they would elsewhere.

The best solution to the predicament would be for the NFL to drop the silly rule that ties blackouts to percentage of tickets rather than tickets sold (we've never hit league bottom in tickets sold, even in 2009; who cares about the percentage of the stadium sold out?) The other extreme would be erecting a smaller stadium that would be expandable to accommodate FL-GA (or losing the game). For the time being, though, the most doable solution is to work with what we've got in terms of pricing, marketing, and smaller-scale refurbishing.

[Debbie Thompson]

Saw where the NFL has gone to 85% sold instead of sold out for the 2012 season. 

Also, I understand they already add extra seating to the stadium for FL/GA.  Unless the Bud Zone took that space.  They used to bring in extra bleachers in our already huge stadium for that weekend.  :-)

[Tacachale]

Saw where the NFL has gone to 85% sold instead of sold out for the 2012 season. 

Also, I understand they already add extra seating to the stadium for FL/GA.  Unless the Bud Zone took that space.  They used to bring in extra bleachers in our already huge stadium for that weekend.  :-)

Yes, they do that. In a smaller stadium they'd have to add considerably more seats.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

Saw where the NFL has gone to 85% sold instead of sold out for the 2012 season. 

Also, I understand they already add extra seating to the stadium for FL/GA.  Unless the Bud Zone took that space.  They used to bring in extra bleachers in our already huge stadium for that weekend.  :-)

An option of up to 85% - each team gets to choose.  The teams get penalized, finacially, if they sell more tickets than their threshold.

Ex:  The Bills set their B/O at 90% - every seat over the 90% they lose money don't make as much money.  Something to the tune of $.16/dollar - that money then gets shared with the rest of the league that didn't exceed their threshold or didn't apply it at all. 

The Colts owner, Jim Irsay, has already come out and said they would not be reducing the number.  I don't believe that the Jags will either.  The team still has the option to buy their own tickets to meet the B/O number if it's close. 

I don't think we'll have a problem lifting B/Os this year.   

[mtraininjax]

Whatever stadium we have, it is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than what we had with the aluminum seats in the old Gator Bowl.

[Elwood]

If Wayne really wanted to "screw us", he could have sold the team for a hell of a lot more and let 'em "load up the U-hauls" as Sapp so eloquently put it, and move to that blessed football mecca they call LA. You know, that place that can't seem to hang on to a team? I just find it odd that the perception is that Jacksonville doesn't support the Jaguars. That we are just a "college town" that "tricked" the NFL into giving Wayne Weaver a franchise. The reality is that attendance is an issue across the entire league, and has been for the better part of the last decade. The average family has been priced out of the game day experience. And with the vast improvements in televised games with HD, Redzone, Sunday ticket, etc.. many people are choosing to stay at home. Someone at NFL headquarters FINALLY figured that out, and that is the reason they have "modified" the blackout rules. It's easy for the media to poke fun at the Jaguars, but when the "Palace in Dallas" or the "Rusty Razor" are having attendance issues, suddenly it's a matter of dire importance. The Jags will be fine. I feel fairly confident that a businessman like Shad Khan did not buy this team and bring in the staff that he did just to see it fail, or to pack up and move.

[I-10east]

Whatever stadium we have, it is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than what we had with the aluminum seats in the old Gator Bowl.

That's why I never understood why anyone would call it 'Gator Bowl'. That concrete based stadium opened as 'Jacksonville Municipal Stadium' not the 'Gator Bowl'. The people that do call it that set us back twenty years. BTW, no one I know call it 'Gator Bowl', so it's overrated saying 'many people still call it that". Here's the Gator Bowl just in case anyone is confused, it looks nothing like Everbank, even with that little piece of West upper deck superstructure (not an original part of the stadium that was built in the 80's) that was saved.

www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gator_Bowl_Stadium

[Dapperdan]

It was my understanding that it was never called the Gator Bowl. That was just the name of the Bowl game held there for many many years.

[KenFSU]

It was my understanding that it was never called the Gator Bowl. That was just the name of the Bowl game held there for many many years.

Fairfield Stadium was built in 1925 (erroneously reported almost everywhere as 1928). The first Gator Bowl was held in 1946, when Fairfield's capacity was still under 8,000. Fairfield was expanded to 16,000 seats in 1948, and it was at this time that the stadium was officially renamed the Gator Bowl. The name stood until the city was awarded the Jaguars and the rebuilding efforts began. The new stadium was named Jacksonville Municipal Stadium until naming rights could be purchased. There was a loud outcry from a segment of the local population who wanted the stadium to remain known as the Gator Bowl, a situation that the Jaguars (understandably) found absurd. An even larger segment of the population wasn't happy with the Alltel deal, insisting that the word "Jacksonville" remain in the stadium name. I believe the city council even discussed buying naming rights themselves so the city's name remained on the stadium.

As for people still calling it the Gator Bowl, I've got no problem with that. Even as a card carrying Gator hater, I don't think people fully understand just how deep the Gator football tradition runs in this city. When the Jaguars arrived, the Gators had already been playing football in this city for 94 years, Florida-Georgia was going on nearly 70 years, and the Gator Bowl game itself had enjoyed five decades of success. Without Florida football, there would have been no Gator Bowl stadium. And without the Gator Bowl stadium, there would have absolutely been no Jacksonville Jaguars.

Seems goofy to me when people get angry and petty over the Gators fandom in this city, as if it's an affront to the Jaguars, when really, it's one of the city's most important and longest-standing cultural traditions.