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Author Topic: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread  (Read 4287 times)

Ocklawaha

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #120 on: July 30, 2012, 11:50:52 PM »
Come on in boys and girls, $100 bucks and I can deliver a pure water miracle to an indian family...

BTW, I'M SERIOUS! Send me a note, I'll get your filter on the flight to Panama.

OCK
"...“The Secretary of War wants to know how you intend to prosecute the Pacific War?”
“Tell the Secretary I’ve already met with the Japanese, and we’ve decided to divide the Pacific Ocean 50/50, our ships will get the top, their ships will get the bottom."
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ronchamblin

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #121 on: July 31, 2012, 02:18:36 AM »
Nomeus.  Beautiful piece.  So well done.  I wish I had written it.  But wait, I notice that god "did" sign it, right at the bottom.  That's amazing.  Finally, proof that god exists.   

Ock, I forgot.  So yes, I will be happy to do two of those water filters.  People need clean water.  If possible, people must have one of "the" most important necessities for life.  But wait, this might be a trick.  How do I know that you are not sending the money to Joel O'steen, or Ed Young?  These fellows are quite persuasive you know. 

Well... okay, I feel somehow that your association with religion and the spiritual avoids the insane end of the spectrum, and that you aren't going to be persuaded by the TV charlatans, the fellows who offer some of us the occasional comedy show.  They are quite funny to watch.  I really miss the shows of Jimmy Swaggart and Jerry Falwell.  They are so hilarious.     

 
« Last Edit: July 31, 2012, 06:13:35 AM by ronchamblin »

WmNussbaum

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #122 on: July 31, 2012, 08:16:27 AM »
Ron, if you want a Sunday morning giggle, turn on CBS around 8 or 8:30 and watch the Jack Van Impe show, and pay very,very, special attention to his wife - I am not making this up - Rexella. She's a TammyFaye if ever there was one, and she is so damn sincere you will be moved to send in money - really! As if that wasn't enough, they have an announcer with a voice that makes James Earl Jones sound like a castrato.

You'll enjoy it - I promise you. I watch every Sunday for about the last 5 minutes before CBS Sunday Morning comes on. I swear, I'm going to send those folks some money one day. Hey! Here is a good idea: Why don't you send me your money and I'll add it to mine and pass it all along. Salvation will be yours, my friend, and best of all it won't set you back too much.

Noemus: i'm with Ron on your G-d letter.

officerk

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #123 on: August 01, 2012, 02:10:19 AM »
Noemus phenomenal letter!!!!
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Timkin

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #124 on: August 01, 2012, 03:59:24 PM »
Maybe Nomeus is God :o
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wsansewjs

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #125 on: August 01, 2012, 04:07:15 PM »


Also, apply "Ancient Astronaut Theory" along with this, then the shit will hit the fans for the religious folks.

-Josh
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Ocklawaha

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #126 on: August 01, 2012, 09:46:19 PM »
Nomeus.  Beautiful piece.  So well done.  I wish I had written it.  But wait, I notice that god "did" sign it, right at the bottom.  That's amazing.  Finally, proof that god exists.   

Ock, I forgot.  So yes, I will be happy to do two of those water filters.  People need clean water.  If possible, people must have one of "the" most important necessities for life.  But wait, this might be a trick.  How do I know that you are not sending the money to Joel O'steen, or Ed Young?  These fellows are quite persuasive you know. 

Well... okay, I feel somehow that your association with religion and the spiritual avoids the insane end of the spectrum, and that you aren't going to be persuaded by the TV charlatans, the fellows who offer some of us the occasional comedy show.  They are quite funny to watch.  I really miss the shows of Jimmy Swaggart and Jerry Falwell.  They are so hilarious.     

 

I believe your summation of my religious feelings is pretty correct. I once got dragged (almost literally) to a penticostal 'healing meeting' which to my mind looked like a cross between a snake oil sales stand and Ringling Brothers. There were crutches and wheel chairs flying off the stage and people dying 'in the spirit', I just knew some 80 year old lady was going to catch a crutch upside the head, then she'd need real healing.

For me the worst moment came when it dawned on me that this dude 'blows the spirit on people.' Being the crusty old sailor that I am, I decided I needed healing for a permanent erection. As I started to get out of my seat, 3 of my friends grabbed me and pulled me back. 'What are you doing Bob?' 'I just want to go down there, jump up on the stage and tell him to blow this!' Oh well, it was a great thought while it lasted but in the end WWJD?

I have no problem looking at science or history and feel that any Christian that runs from the same isn't very well positioned in his faith. Even the idea's that Nomeus was tossing out about various miracles being mere quirks of nature explain them however you want, it was pretty darn cool that the volcanic gas that likely killed the first born of Egypt appeared on demand and that the Jewish servants would not have been in the rooms where the gas settled and killed. The Red Sea? Volcano's. If it turns out to be the Reed Sea, no big deal, the Jew's escaped and the Egyptians didn't. Jericho?  Earthquake took it out, conveniently, when Joshua's army marched around it... 'Those 'chosen people?' A minimum of 250 years before Christ it was predicted that the Jewish nation would be defeated, and it's people scattered across the world, but then, oddly, after 1,900 years, they'd retake their homeland and rise again as a center of the worlds attention. Bearing that in mind, we can look at what the Bible says. It is known that the Septuagint translation of the Old Testament into Greek was in existence at least 250 years before the Romans destroyed Jerusalem in AD 70. So there is no possibility that the Old Testament predictions were written down after the events.Imagine 1,900 years from now, a Confederate flag is flying over Richmond... Yeah well...

I know that you know, I'm not collecting money for  Joel O'steen, or Ed Young. I'm umbilically connected to the temperate zone. I've seen war and hunger up close and personal, even had a dinner on a balcony with leaders of M-19 / FARC boys and girls (which after being yanked out of a car by the army, feeling the cold steel of the barrel of a machine gun against my head and angrily searched while pressed hard against a car, probably wasn't the smartest meal I ever ordered). Bottom line, my heart breaks when I see these little children hungry, poor, and cursed to remain that way probably for life. Others might want to donate to this cause, and if you'd like I'll get photos of YOUR FILTER and an invoice AND a photo of the family or families they go to.

Filters are $100 dollars each. They last 10 years +/- You can see the details here: http://www.sawyer.com/sawyersaves//
Send me a PM or write bob@metrojacksonville.com and I'll hook you up with this trip to Panama.

OCKLAWAHA
(Which means MUDDY WATER btw)

« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 09:48:52 PM by Ocklawaha »
"...“The Secretary of War wants to know how you intend to prosecute the Pacific War?”
“Tell the Secretary I’ve already met with the Japanese, and we’ve decided to divide the Pacific Ocean 50/50, our ships will get the top, their ships will get the bottom."
Admiral Halsey - 1942

BridgeTroll

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #127 on: August 07, 2012, 07:56:00 AM »
Interesting take on this discussion topic...

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2012/08/06/god_and_the_ivory_tower?page=0,0

Excerpts...

Quote
The era of world struggle between the great secular ideological -isms that began with the French Revolution and lasted through the Cold War (republicanism, anarchism, socialism, fascism, communism, liberalism) is passing on to a religious stage. Across the Middle East and North Africa, religious movements are gaining social and political ground, with election victories by avowedly Islamic parties in Turkey, Palestine, Egypt, Tunisia, and Morocco. As Israel's National Security Council chief, Gen. Yaakov Amidror (a religious man himself), told me on the eve of Tunisia's elections last October, "We expect Islamist parties to soon dominate all governments in the region, from Afghanistan to Morocco, except for Israel."

Quote
To test this hypothesis, anthropologist Richard Sosis and his colleagues studied 200 communes founded in the United States in the 19th century. If shared religious beliefs really did foster loyalty, they reasoned, then communes formed out of religious conviction should survive longer than those motivated by secular ideologies such as socialism. Their findings were striking: Just 6 percent of the secular communes were still functioning 20 years after their founding, compared with 39 percent of the religious communes.

Quote
If these things are worth knowing, why do scientists still shun religion?

Part of the reason is that most scientists are staunchly nonreligious. If you look at the prestigious U.S. National Academy of Sciences or Britain's Royal Society, well over 90 percent of members are non-religious. That may help explain why some of the bestselling books by scientists about religion aren't about the science of religion as much as the reasons that it's no longer necessary to believe. "New Atheists" have aggressively sought to discredit religion as the chief cause of much human misery, militating for its demise. They contend that science has now answered questions about humans' origins and place in the world that only religion sought to answer in the days before evolutionary science, and that humankind no longer needs the broken crutch of faith.

Quote
Moreover, the chief complaint against religion -- that it is history's prime instigator of intergroup conflict -- does not withstand scrutiny. Religious issues motivate only a small minority of recorded wars. The Encyclopedia of Wars surveyed 1,763 violent conflicts across history; only 123 (7 percent) were religious. A BBC-sponsored "God and War" audit, which evaluated major conflicts over 3,500 years and rated them on a 0-to-5 scale for religious motivation (Punic Wars = 0, Crusades = 5), found that more than 60 percent had no religious motivation. Less than 7 percent earned a rating greater than 3. There was little religious motivation for the internecine Russian and Chinese conflicts or the world wars responsible for history's most lethal century of international bloodshed.
In a boat at sea one of the men began to bore a hole in the bottom of the boat. On being remonstrating with, he answered, "I am only boring under my own seat." "Yes," said his companions, "but when the sea rushes in we shall all be drowned with you."

ben says

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #128 on: September 02, 2012, 10:13:17 AM »

stephendare

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #129 on: September 02, 2012, 10:14:57 AM »
http://cosmiclog.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/09/01/13611231-9000-year-old-charms-found-in-israel?lite

But the earth is only 2,000 years old!!! Right?

8 thousand according to seriously fundamentalist evangelical literalists.
And now abide faith, hope and love; these three, but the greatest of these is love

ronchamblin

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #130 on: September 02, 2012, 06:07:40 PM »
http://cosmiclog.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/09/01/13611231-9000-year-old-charms-found-in-israel?lite

But the earth is only 2,000 years old!!! Right?

8 thousand according to seriously fundamentalist evangelical literalists.

I thought that most biblical scholars suggest that the earth was created by the big dude in 4,004 B.C.   If so, this would make the earth a little over 6,000 years old; that is, according to the biblical story. 

ronchamblin

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #131 on: September 03, 2012, 12:29:18 AM »
I recently read an interesting idea that there might be an innate predisposition, or genetic pressure, to be religious, to believe in the existence of a god, to believe the teachings of a religion.  The writer suggested that perhaps from several million years ago to only tens of thousands of years ago there were survival benefits to the tribes or populations which were bound together by a religious belief in some kind of god, and therefore the genetic message was transmitted more often to offspring, resulting in further genetically implanted "religious" genes into the human population.  For example, a people bound by a common religious belief might fight the enemy with greater effort than would a tribe without the belief system, thus more of the former would survive the battles, and would pass along their "religion or god" genes.
 
The writer suggested that, just as language ability is genetically embedded in the infant by way of brain structures, so too is the religious tendency.  If very early humans were prepared genetically for learning language as a consequence of it being beneficial to survival as a species, I suppose it possible too regarding the belief in a god.
 
Therefore, individuals who in these modern times believe in a god might be better understood, and forgiven for this tendency to avoid being completely rational, if one accepted the possibility of this genetic pressure.  I’ve always thought that the decision or state of believing in a god or religion by moderns is a result perhaps of a great need to do so, and perhaps also as a consequence of being taught by parents, and persuaded by the preachers and peers. 

The idea that the genetic pressure to believe might be within all humans allows many of us, if we accept the idea, to better understand how so many individuals in our society can actually believe, in spite of all the reasons to not believe.   

Even though all humans might have the genes which prepare or urge us ever so slightly to believe in a god, some of us don’t believe perhaps because we are open to other pressures or understandings which urge us to not believe.  Perhaps it is as if all humans are pressured from both the genetic and environmental conditions to make a final religious decision, which is simply a consequence of balancing the components offering the best argument, or the most pressure.

In a way, I am comforted by the possibility of the genetic influence on the human tendencies to believe in the existence of a god, or to fully engage a religion, as this allows me to be more tolerant of the believers, whom I formerly might have considered to be lacking in some necessary intelligence.  The genetic idea, if it has a basis in fact, helps explain why so many moderns are religious, and in fact do believe in the existence of a god, in spite of all the reasons, according to my perspective, to avoid doing so.     

   
« Last Edit: September 03, 2012, 01:07:04 PM by ronchamblin »

ronchamblin

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #132 on: September 08, 2012, 02:38:01 AM »
BT.  I missed this, your post 127, wherein you excerpted this article:

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2012/08/06/god_and_the_ivory_tower?page=0,0

It was a good and interesting read.  I love articles which make me feel as though I've learned something.  This is rare, since I know so much.  ;D

Thank you for the link.


BackinJax05

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #133 on: September 08, 2012, 06:45:14 PM »
MY views are right  ::)
                                           
Everyone else here is WRONG, and headed straight to HELL!  >:(

Looks like I'm gonna be all alone in Heaven  ;)

(But thats ok with me, I dont like crowds anyway)

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Re: World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread
« Reply #134 on: September 09, 2012, 06:16:28 AM »
BT.  I missed this, your post 127, wherein you excerpted this article:

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2012/08/06/god_and_the_ivory_tower?page=0,0

It was a good and interesting read.  I love articles which make me feel as though I've learned something.  This is rare, since I know so much.  ;D

Thank you for the link.



I try to be helpful...
In a boat at sea one of the men began to bore a hole in the bottom of the boat. On being remonstrating with, he answered, "I am only boring under my own seat." "Yes," said his companions, "but when the sea rushes in we shall all be drowned with you."