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August 7, 2008, 7:55 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Will there be retail at street level? That would be nice Starbucks, small deli. Dunkin Doughnuts maybe????Good coffee.. Bring some life at street level
August 7, 2008, 8:01 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
It seems like a nice addition to the Southbank. I think the new Baptist tower will get rid of more surface parking.
August 7, 2008, 8:16 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Is there a new demand for parking over there?
August 7, 2008, 8:21 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
That's one of the best designed parking garages yet.
August 7, 2008, 8:31 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
OH. My. God. Another parking garage. I think we should do a slide show presentation of all of Jacksonville's Parking Garages and then compare that with all of our regular architectural landmarks and see which is longer. I'm betting on the former rather than the latter.
Though I do agree this is a very well designed garage, and it is a good thing that something is being put in place of a surface parking lot (surface parking lots would be a longer slide show still), it is, afterall, a parking garage! Ugh. There are no words for how monumental of a waste of space that will be especially for such a prominent site on the south bank. Are there no responsible, worthy architects/developers left?
August 7, 2008, 8:52 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
I don't see the basis for critcism. It will have street level retail and it eliminates surface parking. Like Lunican, I question why the demand for parking requires this, but then again San Marco Place was built on an old surface lot.
The design is pretty good for what it is, and far exceeds what is typical for Jax. My only complaint is that they need to add an office or residential tower on top. Given the current market though, it is understandable. Maybe they will reinforce the foundation, so that can be added later.
August 7, 2008, 9:27 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Well it's a start I guess.
August 7, 2008, 9:34 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
I'd prefer the parking garrage if it had office space for businesses on top of it. But then the hotel behind it would protest. So, building a parking garrage in place of a surface parking lot is better than only having an ugly surface parking lot. It still is prime real estate for a mere parking garrage.
August 7, 2008, 9:51 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Archiphreak, I like the comments about the slideshows. Very Funny.
If they sell off the rest of the surface lot for a mid to high rise building of some sort, I will be very satisfied with this and consider it a big step in a better direction.
August 7, 2008, 11:15 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Good question. This proposal certainly is out of the blue.
I do like the design of the garage though. By far the best in Jax. The parcel between the proposed garage and the Main Street Expressway is a great little spot for a midrise office building in the future.
August 7, 2008, 11:18 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/content/view/829/122/
It will only eliminate a few spaces. Hopefully their existing parking garages are large enough to accomodate the expansion or we may be seeing yet another garage proposed.
August 7, 2008, 11:30 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
I personally dont see how this won an award for design but if it eliminates the need for surface lot parking and gets rid of a surface lot while adding in retail, it is a net positive. Also, perhaps this will free up the existing Riverplace garage to be demolished and a new structure built in its place or to have a new structure built on top of it. I have always thought it foolish to have a riverfront parking garage there. Hopefully this is a prelude to a new building then.
August 7, 2008, 12:43 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Absolute net positive, frankly I love the design and would have awarded it too... The reason friend Riverside Gator in my mind is they didn't go and try and design a George Jetson building, to go with a collection of 1960-70 era office and hotel towers. It blends and flows with the "feel of the time". Wonder if we can wear polyester suits, super wide ties, and paisley print dress pants inside? Really though, I think they did just what the area needed and didn't over-reach the assignment.
One HUGE GLARING OMISSION though, why is the Riverplace Skyway station not connected via Skywalk to Crown Plaza Garage and Wachovia via the Garage. Wouldn't this be a rather simple way to encourage ridership? Another elevated link to the Strand, Prudential, Atena and Baptist would make the little train that can't into the motor that drives the Southbank.
LOOK AHEAD! LOOK SOUTH!
LOOK FORWARD! LOOK TO TRANSIT!
OCKLAWAHA
August 7, 2008, 1:05 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Choo! Choo!
Good point about the skyway. Very LEED / Green friendly! Lord knows we're wasting millions on the skyway and no one rides it. Connecting new construction to the skyway would actually make it a viable means of transportation around downtown. I can only hope that more good night life starts to sprawl up around these areas similar to Marks and Dive.
August 7, 2008, 2:31 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Maybe a good idea, but not very LEED. I don't completely understand your proposal Ock, but connections to the buildings would be beneficial. I don't know if the benefits of 'sky walks' would justify the effort to construct them. I may just be unclear on what you are proposing. Maybe something minimal could still establish connection or association with those buildings. It irks me, however, when people spend a lot of time money and energy building something "green", when nothing was needed at all.
August 7, 2008, 3:03 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
The skywalk concept was once a part of the downtown plan. In a simple form it could be like the Kings Avenue Station walk under I-95 to the Garage. Just a simple over the road, open air sidewalk with a roof.
The original plans called for AC and the only ones really built can be seen at FIRST BAPTIST CHURCH, downtown. These are nice, have carpet and AC, but still tend to roast in the summer heat, in the cold of winter the greenhouse effect keeps them toasty. The ultimate version is only found in Florida (correct me if anyone knows of an example) at our airports. These are broad "airport like" concourses, that even have room for restrooms, custodian room, guard and kiosks for Starbucks like businesses. Failing a SKYWAY connection over the Acosta, the San Marco Station - Baptist "Skywalk" should perhaps be of this type. The others could be quite simple.
OCKLAWAHA
August 7, 2008, 3:16 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Something along these lines?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minneapolis_Skyway_System
The system forms a network of climate-controlled, pedestrian walkways that link sixty-nine full city blocks over seven miles (11 km). However the skyways do close during off business hours. The skyways are owned by individual buildings in Minneapolis, and as such they do not have uniform opening and closing times.
August 7, 2008, 3:29 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Those are pretty neat. I went through a system like this in Charlotte called the Overstreet Mall. It was mostly shut down because it was a weekend, but this idea was cool. I don't know that the southbank has the density to support this without some stinkin' long walkways.
August 7, 2008, 3:35 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Yeah a lot of northern cities have them to stay warm during winter shopping. We don't have that problem down here.
August 7, 2008, 3:40 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
No down here we all get excercise and a steam bath for free, just for walking outside most of the year. This COULD take the edge off. Remember, such a "System" doesn't have to have a grid. The streets and walks, parks and buildings pretty much do that along with the Skyway and JTA buses. Just add these as "needed" to give that long Southbank "STRIP" some flash and comfort, and jump start the broken Skyway with SKYWALKS.
BTW, right on target Doctor K, only our system was to be called the "Skywalks".
OCKLAWAHA
August 7, 2008, 4:12 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
In that area, people work all day in AC'd towers/buildings and live in nearby riverfront condos/apts. I'd prefer money spent on things to do outside. (Sidewalk cafeterias, plazas, parks).
The biggest hurdle though is, aside from RCBrew, maybe a hotel or two, is that whole area is a primarily a business district, not an evening hangout spot except for special events maybe (fireworks).
August 7, 2008, 5:22 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Charlotte's Overstreet mall has been widely criticized for taking pedestrians off the street. It hasn't been dismantled, but the city and business community regret having done it.
August 7, 2008, 6:54 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
As parking garages go, this one is definitely more pleasing to the eye than most. I'm hoping there is another part of the plan we just don't know about yet. Perhaps they will use the other half of the surface lot for something different. A small office building with more retail on the bottom or turning it into green space would all be good with me. Any time a surface parking lot disappears, I'm happy.
The skywalks are a pretty great idea as well. Something simple like duplicating the walk from Kings Avenue to the parking garage would probably be the best for that area.
August 7, 2008, 8:10 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Skywalks in an urban setting are generally bad - they take the sense of place and pedestrian activity off the road. If people are that desperate to stay dry when it rains, then develop a good awning system (I've yet to see one downtown).
As far as the garage goes, not bad - I've seen better here, but I've also seen much worse here. Parking is a bit tight over there; I was in the Riverplace garage two weeks ago, and I had to park on the roof, where there were about 30 spaces free. That isn't much for a large tower.
August 7, 2008, 9:42 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
That's all we need; another parking garage; however, I guess the demand is there and it will at least put something on that dirt/grass/cement lot; better than nothing I guess, but please put some retail on the ground floor and not just an empty shell.
Heights Unknown
August 8, 2008, 1:30 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Great idea
August 8, 2008, 8:36 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
As far as the garage goes, not bad - I've seen better here, but I've also seen much worse here. Parking is a bit tight over there; I was in the Riverplace garage two weeks ago, and I had to park on the roof, where there were about 30 spaces free. That isn't much for a large tower.
What have you seen better than that in Jax? Aside from say Independent Square or other scrapers with integrated garages.
August 8, 2008, 8:57 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Wishful thinking regarding the "possible high rise project;" we'll believe it and accept it when we see it.
Heights Unknown
August 8, 2008, 10:19 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
As far as the garage goes, not bad - I've seen better here, but I've also seen much worse here. Parking is a bit tight over there; I was in the Riverplace garage two weeks ago, and I had to park on the roof, where there were about 30 spaces free. That isn't much for a large tower.
What have you seen better than that in Jax? Aside from say Independent Square or other scrapers with integrated garages.
Yes, that was my thought - particularly the above ground parkign garage at BOA - most don't even know it's a garage, which is good. The common misconception is that garae is underground, but it's actually floors 2 through 9
August 8, 2008, 3:53 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
The design is good and I agree it works well with the existing buildings. Does anyone know if the observation area is still at the top of riverplace tower? Back in the olden days when it was 'Gulf Life' and was Florida's tallest building there was an observation area.
August 9, 2008, 3:51 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
How do we define "wishful thinking"
August 9, 2008, 7:09 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
agreed. this is nothing but good b/c it is parking and retail. a step in the right direction.
August 9, 2008, 8:04 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
According to 904 Magazine, this garage will be constructed this fall. It will be 179,000 square feet with 470 spaces. The garage will house retail space and allow for future high-rise development.
August 9, 2008, 10:18 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
It will be constructed to allow for future high-rise development on the lot or on top of the garage itself?
August 9, 2008, 10:29 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Sounds good to me. Hopefully, it will not be in the distant future for vertical expansion. Look at the BCBS Tower in Chicago everyone, now THAT is vertical expansion.
It'd be nice if 904 got it right about BOA Tower. It is tallest between Atlanta and Miami, NOT ATL AND ORLANDO!
August 10, 2008, 11:32 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Cool, I'm thinking something medium, not too obvious, maybe 80 floors or so...
WITH SKY-WALKS.
OCKLAWAHA
August 10, 2008, 11:43 am
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
No skywalks please or at least evaluate them on a case-by-case basis. They compete with the idea of getting pedestrians to walk at street level. This makes it more difficult to lease street level retail spaces. A compromise would be having street retail with a good canopy system. This way pedestrians can use the sidewalks at street level and still be protected from the natural elements.
August 10, 2008, 12:09 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
I agree with Lake. While skywalks have some merit and appear futuristic, they clearly take away from street life.
August 10, 2008, 12:13 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Lake, I'm not big on the SKY-WALK system of downtown circa 1980, all I'm pushing for is some connections to the Skyway Stations from some of our mega-venues. The Hotels, and any major buildings the walk happens to pass are good example of doing what we both want. Skyway connection for commuters and below, a sheltered, covered walk, vendors, performers etc.. These should IMO, only be used in cases like the current Kings Avenue Station. We have similar situations on the Southbank WEST of San Marco Station, that could walk-over the Acosta Freeway, FEC RR and a maze of parking to bring commuters into Atena, Pru and Baptist.
The three level Skyway stations are naturals for this conneciton and for vendor spaces.
BTW did any of you see the New York Summer Street program? COOL JAX IDEA, memories of Godbold at his "Boss Hogg Best".
OCKLAWAHA
August 10, 2008, 12:19 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
A skywalk from the San Marco Station over FEC's tracks, in the direction of Baptist and Aetna makes a lot of sense. However, skywalks from Riverplace Tower, Crowne Plaza Hotel, MOSH, etc. would compete with the idea of replacing surface parking lots on Riverplace Blvd with buildings featuring retail and dining spaces at street level.
August 10, 2008, 2:05 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
I think the only current 3-level Skyway station is the San Marco station, next to the Prudential tower. A pedestrian bridge over the Acosta and FECRR to Aetna / Baptist / the eventual residential tower makes sense.
August 10, 2008, 3:36 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
I believe you are right Charles, though there must be some way to access that other two or three stations where this idea would work. Riverplace just seems to be SO EMPTY of life. Like Jefferson Street without the mud park.
BTW, any word on when DOT plans the rebuild of Atlantic/Beach/95? I hear it's on the way. Wonder if we could lower some of it, or at LEAST pull some ramps to and from Atlantic. Perhaps Atlantic SB, both on and off, and Hendricks or Kings NB, both on and off. That would make the JTA garage make a lot more sense.
I'd love to see flyovers from midway between this and Emerson, head up into the old JEA lot, and pick up Prudential at street level. Perhaps a precursor to some future bridge at Randolph, for streetcars, pedestrians and limited auto traffic..
Dreams are cheap.
BTW: O(C)klawaha is spelled with a "C" but FDOT doesn't know it. Smile.
OCKLAWAHA
August 16, 2008, 5:38 pm
Re: Riverplace Tower West Parking Garage Proposed
Is there any mention of future potential for vertical expansion.
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