Print Article Jake M. Godbold City Hall Annex - Downtown
Laura Trio - No construction but there is a contract on the buildings.
The Barnett - no construction but there is a contract on the building
Fuddrucker's in the Jacksonville Landing - Downtown
Duval County Courthouse - Downtown
Lonsor Men's Barbershop in The Carling - Downtown
The Ronco Group - Downtown
Berkman II - Downtown
325 East Bay Street (Restaurant) - Downtown
Bay Street Town Center Streetscape - Phase II - Downtown
Kings Avenue Station - San Marco
Oral Explosions - San Marco
1538 Hendricks Avenue - San Marco
The Lofts on Main - Springfield
2111 Liberty Street - Springfield
The Wine Cellar and Zen Garden at Three Layers - Springfield
John Gorrie Middle School Conversion - Riverside
925 King Street - Riverside
Photo Update by Ennis Davis
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brainstormer
May 05, 2009, 06:31:05 AMWow! If I was the mayor, I wouldn't be so quick to plaster the fence with renderings of the building. Is this honestly the best our city could come up with? It is ugly and unimaginative and certainly does not fit in with the surrounding buildings. I know I am not the only one that was hoping it actually would never be built. And that beautiful parking garage that is about equal in height! Awesome! I think this might be Peyton's Guantanamo Bay
And not to be totally negative, I'm glad there are a number of small projects moving forward. My dad told me that small business would bring us out of a recession and by the looks of it, a lot of people are moving forward on private restaurant, retail and living spaces. I can't wait for 3rd and Main to be completed!
JoeMerchant
May 05, 2009, 08:12:56 AMMan, those signs on Oral Explosions are very imaginative...
tufsu1
May 05, 2009, 08:17:26 AMI am so sick of hearing people whine about the courthouse....first you get annoyed that it had cost overruns and time delays...but then when you don't like the look, you say delay it even more...which is it?
thelakelander
May 05, 2009, 08:26:35 AMIts been delayed so long and the plan is so bad, that at this point, many believe it may be worth it to have a future Mayor deal with it. My personal thinking is that its going to happen and "it is what it is." My hope is that we can do something positive with the left over land surrounding the actual structure.
ChriswUfGator
May 05, 2009, 08:29:51 AM+1
This administration has been so utterly incompetent in its handling of that particular project that, at this point, I'd rather just scrap the whole damned thing and let someone better qualified deal with it at a later date. It's crystal-clear that the more Peyton tries to mess with it, the worse it's going to get.
Doctor_K
May 05, 2009, 08:31:50 AMBoth.
Redesign it, get it right the first time. That means make it more urban of a design so it fits in with the surrounding fabric (what's left of it).
If we'd had collective direction from effective leadership, we'd have the courthouse well under construction. Vertically. Not this absurdity that's not even gotten off the ground yet.
On the other hand, I agree with brainstormer that it's great to see smaller projects moving forward in spite of the downturn. Hooray baby steps!
Springfield Girl
May 05, 2009, 08:40:34 AMAnyone who tags a historic building, or any building that doesn't belong to them for that matter ought to be shot!
Jason
May 05, 2009, 09:02:06 AMNot a bad list of projects. I really like the new annex. The city/developer really pulled out all of the stops with the renovation because that building looks like it was just built from the ground up.
Also, Oral Explosions and Hightide Burrito will be on my radar. I can't wait to give them a try and expect them to do very well.
Ocklawaha
May 05, 2009, 09:02:44 AMI'm with you on this on TUFSU1, I'm sick of the whole project. Just build the damn thing and get over it folks. Yes I think it's ugly (on paper). Like I said, to me, it looks like an explosion in a pillar factory.
But there is a flip side.
Several major projects hinge on getting the Courthouse out of the ground. In fact we referenced 3 M/L major construction projects just a couple of weeks past, all waiting for dirt to move. So what if I think it should have been vertical, it's going to be a BIG catalyst as construction leads to more construction.
Another thing is the appearance from the ground might be stunning. I'm a huge fan of those 14 massive sandstone columns in front of The Jacksonville Terminal, and from ground level this might have the same effect. As Lake has said, "it is what it is". I'm looking forward to this project setting off a chain reaction of new development.
OCKLAWAHA
Deuce
May 05, 2009, 09:05:31 AMI feel the same way about people who litter.
This month's update seems to be reaching a bit. Photos of the empty lots for the courthouse, int. shots of Fuddruckers that look the same the last time Fuddruckers was included on the monthly update. I don't know about others on the board, but I would rather only see shots of projects that have made significant gains in the previous month or are at least on track (3rd & Main), even if it means only two projects being featured. These monthly updates remind me of a grade-schooler's attempts to hit the mark on a 500 word essay.
e.g. Downtown continues to build many very very very large buildings. I'm am very very very upset that the courthouse looks like a very very very big piece of...
Jason
May 05, 2009, 09:08:08 AMI don't think it's reaching Deuce. These projects still have an impact on the neighborhood level. I'm sure that the folks in San Marco and Springfield are very excited about many of these.
thelakelander
May 05, 2009, 09:36:05 AMAfter years of looking at a grass lot, there has been change over the last week or so. The construction fencing has been installed and it appears surveying is taking place. This will probably be the first month of a three year continuous run of the courthouse project in the monthly DT construction update.
Since work on Fuddruckers started back up, last month was the first that we included of this project after a long period of inaction.
April 2009 Fuddruckers
Work is still slow, but its taking place.
For the most part, that's what we try to cover. However, if significant news comes out about projects, we also try include those updates from time to time (ex. courthouse fencing and surveying taking place).
heights unknown
May 05, 2009, 09:54:36 AMThe Courthouse - Build the damn thing already! Just hope it spurs more development and growth on that end of downtown and on into LaVilla.
City Hall Annex - Pleased that they named it after Jake Godbold; good thing naming it after "Jake the Snake."
Laura Trio - Under Contract; what does this mean?
Barnett Building - Again, under contract; what does this mean?
Does "under contract" mean that someone has bought it and are contemplating developing it into something useful? Or does it also mean that it has been purchased, plans have been drawn, and development is imminent?
You could say from this month's thread that downtown is "snail pacing" ahead, but again, as I always say, something is better than nothing. Can only hope that all of the previous "tall" developments that were proposed and then put on hold because of the economy come out of the closet and get back on the drawing boards to approval and construction.
Heights Unknown
Traveller
May 05, 2009, 10:51:38 AMHeights-
While I know nothing about this particular deal, "under contract" typically means the buyer and seller have signed a purchase & sale agreement, but the actual closing of the sale has not happened and is contingent upon a variety of factors, including but not limited to:
- The seller having good title, free from liens
- The buyer obtaining acceptable financing
- A satisfactory building inspection and environmental report
- Closing happening on or before a certain date
Lunican
May 05, 2009, 11:04:42 AMHere is an email regarding the Courthouse:
Basstacular
May 05, 2009, 11:13:07 AMTake this for what its worth regarding Barnett and the trio. My source who is "in the know", but would not elaborate told me about the pending deal prior to it going public, which he turned out to be right. He also informed me that the buyer was looking to develop the residential component. Again, take it for what it is, but if that is the case, I think every DT supporter will be pleased.
jeh1980
May 05, 2009, 11:21:04 AMTheProfessor
May 05, 2009, 11:33:58 AMThe cheap signs do detract from the architecture of the Oral Explosion project. I suppose it would be costly and there is not much more room for nicer signage.
Basstacular
May 05, 2009, 11:37:04 AMIf you build it.....they will come
tufsu1
May 05, 2009, 11:44:37 AMbtw....for what its worth, it sounds like the new Courthouse itself (not including the land, the garage, or renovations to existing buildings) will come in around $225-$250 million....how does that stack up with some of the other cities (like Charlotte) that have been profiled on this site?
thelakelander
May 05, 2009, 12:10:25 PMI'll have to go back and look into the old sources but I believe these are the total cost numbers for these projects (ex. includes land, design costs, etc....the things "excluded" from our numbers).
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/content/view/648/115/
Mecklenburg County Courthouse
Charlotte (2007) - 568,000sf / $148 million = $261/square foot
Harris County Civil & Criminal Justice Center
Houston (2001 - 2005) - 1,390,000sf / $210.5 million = $151/square foot
Clark County Regional Justice Center
Las Vegas (2004) - 700,000sf / $185 million = $264/square foot
Calgary Courthouse - Calgary, AB
Calgary (2007) - 1,200,000sf / $280 million = $233/square foot
Duval County Courthouse
Jacksonville (n/a) - 800,000sf / $225 - $250 million** = $281 - $313/square foot
thelakelander
May 05, 2009, 12:13:01 PMBtw, since that MJ article was written, the Calgary Courthouse has been completed. Here are a few shots.
http://www.glass3ent.com/images/projects/Ferguson-001_orig.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3048/2905968327_f080610e16.jpg
tufsu1
May 05, 2009, 12:29:35 PMso we're still higher, but not ridiculously out of whack....obviously there are cost savings in going vertical (once you get past 3-4 stories anyway) which Jax. could have done....but I guess that wasn't really considered once all the land had been purchased and cleared.
That Calgray one looks pretty cool...of course it would never fly here....that said, there is something to be said for neo-classical design...after all, the current courthouse definitely fit with the design tend of the 1960's but now it looks pretty awful.
Jason
May 05, 2009, 12:36:32 PMThe one thing I like about our proposal is that it looks like a courthouse. The buildings shown above could pass for just about anything.
thelakelander
May 05, 2009, 12:54:02 PMYes, the Calgary Courthouse would never fly here. Unfortunately, not much that does not copy design of 100 years ago with cheaper mass produced materials will. It will be interesting to see how future generations view the architecture of this era. I imagine, if Klutho had just come down in 2001, his prairie school style ideas would have quickly been shut down in favor or copying styles from past generations.
As for the courthouse itself, I care more about how it meets the street, then the structure itself. That's the major downfall of the design, imo. From a money standpoint, I'm also not crazy about the one story piece causing the relocation of Monroe Street. It would seem to be cheaper to take the main structure up an extra floor or two, thus eliminating the need to relocate Monroe Street and the utilities under it. After all, we're already paying for the elevators, stairwells and the structural system. Because we refused to work with the surrounding context and in a vertical nature we're going to kill the redevelopment potential of two full blocks and pay a few extra million to relocate a two block stretch of street.
Anyway, as mentioned earlier "it is what it is". Now its time to focus on getting the best use out of the carved up land surrounding the structure. If we can do this, it will have a greater positive impact on the downtown environment.
heights unknown
May 05, 2009, 01:56:20 PMThanks Traveller, that answers my question(s); so it has nothing to do with a possible "intended use" based on the acquisition of the property, but basically the administrative aspect of the sale and purchase of the property by a buyer or prospective buyer...and of course closure of the deal.
Heights Unknown
heights unknown
May 05, 2009, 01:58:57 PMSo based on what I've just read (and it's dated April 30th), construction of the Courthouse is a sure go and is imminent.
Heights Unknown
heights unknown
May 05, 2009, 02:03:21 PMYeah, especially if "they" have committed a crime and get arrested.
Heights Unknown
heights unknown
May 05, 2009, 02:06:40 PMLooking at the prices of all the other Courthouses that "Lake" listed along with their photos, our Courthouse seems to be not that big, is not vertical/tall, and comes out with a much bigger price tag versus the Courthouses in these photos in which some or most are talls and come in with a much leaner, lesser price tag.
We didn't do our homework folks and I won't beat a dead horse, but I have to say that our City Leaders really "dropped the ball" on this one. But being that it's getting ready to be built, I'll take it with no whining. Again, something is better than nothing, and maybe this thing will be a catalyst for that portion of downtown (got to look at the positives to forget the many negatives).
Heights Unknown
Ocklawaha
May 05, 2009, 06:19:08 PMY'all know that once they get to digging, this would be an exceptional time to lay streetcar tracks in either Duval or Monore... It would be like money in the bank.
OCKLAWAHA
thelakelander
May 05, 2009, 10:39:35 PMYou might want to start pushing that idea. It would be a great opportunity that would save money in the long run.
riverside_mail
May 05, 2009, 11:34:42 PMi talked to the construction super at the Gorrie site today. Current plans are for 56 condos to be finished early 2011.
thelakelander
May 05, 2009, 11:37:45 PMSounds good.
thelakelander
May 06, 2009, 12:55:19 AMCourthouse ground breaking is planned within the next two weeks.
http://www.jacksonville.com/interact/blog/tia_mitchell/2009-05-05/city_council_courthouse_budget_update
I-10east
May 06, 2009, 03:18:08 AMSomeone oughta send an "Oral Explosions" pic to Jay Leno's 'Headlines" segment on Mondays. I guess the posh and elite are used the restaurant names like that; Whatever floats their boats.
Hurricane
May 06, 2009, 07:03:38 AMI certainly wish we had a better design for the courthouse, but I am going to try my best not to complain and just be happy that something is getting built. It is very true - big construction brings lots of other construction. I'm guessing everyone reading this is somehow in the field in the design, supply, or contracting. Let's just be happy about the potential for projects to spawn up around this.
If the Laura Street Trio turns into living units, more people will be living downtown - which means more restaurants and night life will come right behind that, then more living units, groceries, rail system...
PS - Whomever was involved with putting the jail downtown with a river view should be shot immediately. That was the dumbest idea known to mankind. The fact that a criminal has a better view than I do is disturbing and is destroying the potential of our city.
billy
May 06, 2009, 07:12:00 AMI though Gorrie was going to be workforce rental.
heights unknown
May 06, 2009, 07:40:50 AMI agree wholeheartedly "Hurricane" regarding the jail should not be on the river and criminals should not have a better view than we do; don't think they should be shot though.
Heights Unknown
heights unknown
May 06, 2009, 07:42:16 AMIt's about time..."Hello Hooray!"
Heights Unknown
stjr
May 07, 2009, 01:28:30 AMAs a resident and taxpayer of the City of Jacksonville, I feel I have every right to express my opinion on the courthouse project and not apologize for it.
It is bad for Downtown aesthetically, space-wise, street-wise, traffic-wise, and future development-wise, and it's a bad deal for the taxpayers because we are paying a bloated price for it (especially since ours is being built while construction prices are substantially depressed versus just a year or two ago).
I do not agree that we should build it WRONG just to get it done. That's another $200+ million down the rat hole and is the stupidest reason to justify anything (i.e a cop out for NOT taking the effort to do something right. Sounds like something a teenage kid would say to get out of doing the responsible things in life!).
I proudly reserve the right to "whine" about this fiasco and monument to gross incompetence and typical Jacksonville failed city planning as long as that building stands.
I certainly would support naming it the John Peyton Courthouse so that no one forgets who brought this idiot project to fruition!
P.S. That Ronco Group building is about as "blah ugly" as you can get. No personality or character whatsoever. Another blight on Downtown. How do people come up with this stuff? It doesn't have to cost a fortune to do something imaginative and interesting.
mtraininjax
May 07, 2009, 01:49:13 AMWhy monroe? The idiots at 117W Duval are just going to close the street and sit the darn thing in the middle of it, after the state spent all that money to build the off-ramp from i-95. Idiots at 117 West Duval, just plain idiots!
Coolyfett
May 07, 2009, 06:17:32 AMQuestions.
Is Kings Avenue one building with 2 different names? Or 2 different buildings?
City Hall Annex, Isnt there one on Bay Street in a white building. This Jake Godbold is across from Main Library?
The Restuarant on Bay is between Marks and TSI?? Is that the location?
Whats up with the old laundry mat on Kings Street?
Whats up with the school on College Street?
The Lofts on Main look nice man!!! Good to see Godbold gets his name on a building, dude had love for Jax. I remember getting my oil changed and a tune up at the Ronco Building lol...what the heck is it now?
brainstormer
May 07, 2009, 06:20:55 AMI wholeheartedly agree stjr. I'll get some cheese and we can "wine" together. We are spending too much money on a mess and from what I hear we have a lot of other whiners out there. People either think we shouldn't be building it at all, or they disagree with the design, placement, price tag etc.
Coolyfett
May 07, 2009, 06:45:23 AMThere is no St. Johns River "view", The Jail has 6 floors 1 for short terms, 2 for long terms, 1 for juveniles, 1 for women & 1 for feds. None of the floors have outside views. The windows you see from outside are the rec room vents, you can see light from outside, but that is it. Inmates do not have a St. Johns River view.
CMG22
May 07, 2009, 02:27:48 PMCooly, then put it another way. Those criminals should not be residing on land that costs more per square foot than the land on which my humble, (mostly) law abiding behind resides. A riverfront jail... only in Jacksonville!
tufsu1
May 07, 2009, 02:36:46 PMmaybe you should compare it to what the buildng looked like before the renovation!
thelakelander
May 07, 2009, 02:48:36 PMThe Ronco Group building is an improvement over what it was. However, the small windows are what kill the project's overall design. The scale of those things are completely out of whack with the typical downtown building window size characteristics. Change the window sizes (its too late now), and that building looks completely different and compatible with typical downtown buildings that size. I'll have to go back and look, but I thought the downtown master plan mentioned something about storefront window dimensions. If it does, I assume the DDRB gave them a variance of some sort.
JoeMerchant
May 07, 2009, 03:22:07 PMSo as long as it's a marginal improvement, then everyone should be fine with it?
The amount of money that they spent on renovating that building could have actually gotten them something pretty nice. Someone, not sure if it was the owner or the designer, did not put much effort in making that particular area a better place with the final product.
Coolyfett
May 07, 2009, 05:55:50 PMI think the location is bad, I think it should be downtown, but not where it is. IMO it should be between La Villa and Union Terminal or North of FCCJ, the JSO main building should move with it. I don't mean the exact land that should be used for JTC but a lil further northwest. I mean the courthouse is moving, does JSO having any plans of moving? The only time Id LIKE to see inmates near the river, is when they are cleaning the edges of it. But to say they have a great view is funny, cause they have no view, just thick glass & steal.
Coolyfett
May 07, 2009, 05:59:24 PMMan it was an auto repair shop, what more could they do there? Are you just seeing the Ronco thing? I mean they were posting the process of that location for a while on here. You would have to ask lake the original pics man. It was called Jaguar Ugly....the Ugly part was correct.
urbanlibertarian
May 07, 2009, 08:50:59 PMIMO, the choice now is between building this courthouse now for this price or not having one built in my lifetime. Let's move forward already!
Charles Hunter
May 09, 2009, 10:04:26 PMGatorShane
May 15, 2009, 08:22:49 PMThe 925 King street project is another great infill for that part of King Street. If that area could get another infill such as the refurbished but still empty space at King St and College St. it could turn into another quaint district. As far as the courthouse it is a done deal, so we should just get over it and move on.
Captain Zissou
May 15, 2009, 09:43:40 PMJust an update.....High Tide Burrito is now open for business. Looked to be pretty busy on Thursday evening.
JoeMerchant
May 18, 2009, 10:41:56 AMYes, drove by it nearly everyday for a long time, and the entire corner (the main entry) is new construction - so yes, it's an improvement from what was there, but that's just not saying very much.
5PointsGuy
May 19, 2009, 11:18:04 AM325 Bay St. is between Mark's and Dive Bar. There is no room for it between TSI and Dive. I work at the courthouse and I'm glad to finally see something happening to that location. I've looked in the window often and that space is much bigger than the pictures indicate. Additionally, there seems to be stairs right by the entrance for a second story. Perhaps an upscale taps bar/restaurant and serves late into the evening in order to cater more to the young professional crowd that frequents Ivy's and Mark's?
Also, although I won't be working for the court system much longer, the idea of a new courthouse being completely sooner rather than later is extremely good news. Unless you have worked in the courthouse and seems its gross deficiencies, you wouldn't have a real feel for the urgency of replacing this dilapidated, outdated building (not to mention all of the prime realestate that is being wasted...
Steve
May 22, 2009, 10:36:46 AMLooks like things at the landing are moving along at a lightning quick pace:
According to a Landing representative, a formal agreement with Peterbrooke to put a chocolate factory and store in the riverfront mall hasn’t been reached yet. Also, don’t expect the long-planned Fuddruckers to happen any time soon. The developers say they are “waiting for the money” before completing the first-floor restaurant.
barberofdeville
May 26, 2009, 03:52:12 AMAnyone have any info on the The Men'sbarber shop? Im moving to Jax and looking for a nice barber shop to work and it looks right up my alley. Any contact info would be much appreciated.
mtraininjax
May 27, 2009, 04:51:21 AMFuddruckers is a joke. Take down the signs, they are the classic bait and switch. We might as well just have a Krystals open up there to feed late night appetities. Furddruckers will never come to pass.
Coolyfett
May 29, 2009, 12:33:45 PMWhat is going at 325 East Bay Street? Isn't the Barnett Building suppose to be condos?
thelakelander
May 29, 2009, 12:39:48 PMA restaurant is going into 325 East Bay and the Barnett condo project died with Cameron Kuhn's financial empire.
TREE4309
June 09, 2009, 03:33:00 PMI talked to both the Fuddrucker's franchisee as well as a purchasing rep for Peterbrooke this week. Fuddrucker's is a green light and is expected to be complete in approx. 12 weeks. As of today Peterbrooke is not moving to the Landing, although there may still be a plan in the works for that in the near future.