Print Article
GENERAL OBSERVATIONS
1. Despite being pushed as a better, cheaper alternative to light rail, BRT station locations are primarily located in suburban areas, as opposed to serving Jacksonville's densest urban neighborhoods such as Springfield, Riverside, Murray Hill, Durkeeville, etc.
2. Stations sites are not well suited locations for urban infill, promoting walkability between station and neighboring communities.
3. Stations sites are oversized. While all of the earmarked land will not be used for transit, BRT stations will be much larger than those which serve rail.
4. JTA has plans to purchase as many of these properties with Better Jacksonville Plan money as they can. Once the earmarked $100 million is spent, JTA will then figure out how to obtain more funding to connect them with transit routes.
5. Station sites happen to be the most valuable property in each corridor. When JTA purchases these office parks and shopping center sites, they will significantly impact the city's overall budget, as JTA does not pay property tax.
6. Landbanking office complexes and retail centers puts JTA in a position to compete with developers like the Sleiman's and Regency Centers. The problem is JTA should not be in the same business as these developers, they need to stick to mass transit.
2025 BRT SYSTEM AND STATION LOCATIONS
The 2025 BRT system will contain 29 miles of busways with 15 stations. Despite being mentioned as an alternative to light rail, it doesn't take much to notice that this system ignores Jacksonville's densest and most pedestrian friendly and urban oriented neighborhoods. Nevertheless, if it fails it would make a great HOV lane expressway system in and out of downtown to/from the suburbs.
EAST CORRIDOR
The East BRT line will begin at Southside Blvd. and travel along an exclusive busway in the center of the Arlington Expressway. The transitway would be elevated at the Arlington Central and University Stations, before joining mixed traffic over the Matthews Bridge.
Arlington Central Station
*Parcel ID number - Property Owner - Property Acreage - Proposed 2007 property tax amount*
136563 0000 - Cathedral Ventures LLC - 16.92 acres - $45,063.05 (2007 property taxes)
136563 1000 - Cathedral Square THC INC - 0.95 acres - $0.00 (2007 property taxes)
136563 0100 - Cathedral Square of Jax - 0.609 acres - $5,343.23 (2007 property taxes)
136563 0050 - Normandy of Jax LLC - 1.639 acres - $2,589.47 (2007 property taxes)
University Station (Town & Country Shopping Center)
129407 0000 - Town & Country Shopping Center - 19.116 acres - $98,455.77
129407 0100 - Town & Country Shopping Center - 0.38 acres - $3,335.30
129040 0000 - Atlantic Enterprises of Jax - 0.26 acres - $2,615.24
129041 0000 - Bug-Out Service Inc - 0.258 acres - $1,110.26
129042 0000 - Bug-Out Service inc - 0.257 acres - $1,199.42
NORTH CORRIDOR (3 STATIONS)
This line will be two lanes and run on the east side of I-95 from Lem Turner Road to State and Union Streets in Downtown. Elevated sections include all areas where existing interstate interchages, such as the I-95/MLK Parkway cloverleaf.
Lem Turner Road Station
022938 0000 - Williams Joe L Sr - 0.382 acres - $843.57
026790 0000 - Gefen L I - 2.00 acres - $3,174.45
Golfair/Gateway Station
031958 0000 - Safer Eliot J - 0.862 acres - $1,253.34
031956 0010 - Safer Eliot J - 7.133 acres - $14,377.16
031960 0000 - Chang Soon ET AL - 0.376 acres - $2,153.05
031961 0000 - City of Jacksonville - 2.916 acres -
031962 0000 - Safer Eliot J - 0.369 acres - $298.32
032088 0000 - Safer Eliot J - 0.366 acres - $232.24
032092 0000 - Safer Eliot J - 0.165 acres - $29.21
032093 0010 - Safer Eliot J - 0.114 acres - $20.87
032010 0000 - Gefen L I - 0.253 acres - $93.25
030023 0020 - Gefen L I - 2.28 acres - $811.94
Shands Station
054870 0000 - Shands Jacksonville - 1.707 acres - $0.00 (2007 property taxes)
054970 0000 - Walgreens - 1.262 acres - $6,954.99
053206 0000 - Lee Lillie B - 0.12 acres - $0.00
053208 0000 - Simmons Charles III - 0.11 acres - $834.95
053207 0000 - Simmons Charles III - 0.05 acres - $0.00
SOUTHWEST CORRIDOR (4 STATIONS)
JTA hopes to run two semi-exclusive bus lanes on CSX right-of-way from downtown to FCCJ Kent, before moving onto a widened Blanding Blvd. This corridor includes a half mile elevated busway paralleling Roosevelt Blvd from Blanding to just south of Edgewood Blvd.
The Southwest busway is planned to run through JTA's maintenance yard before going elevated over the nearby railyards and hopping onto CSX "A" Line right-of-way.
FCCJ Kent Station
While it was not mentioned at the public hearing, additional right-of-way will be required when JTA gets around to figuring out how to connect their station sites. Notice the red line in the above image. All of the homes paralleling the rail line will be lost to make room for the elevated busway.
San Juan Station
093784 0000 - Bizi Bee Inc - 0.432 acres - $7,862.38
093783 0000 - Bizi Bee Inc - 0.178 acres - $834.71
093782 0000 - Flash Dancers Inc - 0.152 acres - $4,076.37
093452 0000 - West East Properties LLC - 0.379 acres - $1,648.92
093451 0000 - Gill Bruce S & Cynthia E - 0.53 acres - $5,459.10
093454 0000 - Westside Club Inc. - 0.559 acres - $0.00
093453 0000 - Marisol Group - 0.654 acres - $5,932.88
093670 0000 - Padgett Properties Inc - 0.519 acres - $2,282.51
093673 0000 - Wachovia Bank N A - 0.762 acres - $22,904.53
093676 0000 - Wachovia Bank N A - 0.212 acres - $544.16
093672 0000 - Wachovia Bank N A - 0.181 acres - $396.55
093671 0050 - Wachovia Bank N A - 0.047 acres - $102.45
093674 0000 - Grant Dooley John & Jean - 0.189 acres - $589.61
Wilson Blvd Station (Cedar Hills Shopping Center)
102954 0000 - Cedar Hills Consolidated LLC - 13.02 acres - $68,456.58
102954 0010 - Jacksonville National Bank - 1.63 acres - $12,668.69
102954 0100 - McDonalds Corporation - 1.152 acres - $18,919.62
104713 0000 - Cedar Hills Consolidated LLC - 10.4 acres - $91,441.23
104713 0030 - Cedar Hills Consolidated LLC - 0.2 acres - $9,785.52
104713 0050 - Bland Wil Inc - 1.07 acres - $40,343.28
103rd Street Station
097639 0000 - S S K I B Corporation - 11.23 acres - $53,214.14
SOUTHEAST CORRIDOR (6 STATIONS)
This corridor will run on the east side of I-95 from Baymeadows Road up to Bowden, before heading west to run in mixed traffic on Philips Highway. Just north of Emerson Street, the busway will use FEC's rail corridor to access the Skyway's Kings Avenue Station. Elevated sections along this route will include bridges in the Bowden/I-95 area and over the JTA interchange with I-95.
Kings Avenue Station
080082 0000 - Flagler Dev Co Land Div - 6.9 acres - $177,016.11
080082 0100 - Flagler Development Company - 4.9 acres - $126,947.91
080088 0000 - Upchurch Sutton Inc. - 0.2 acres - $12,026.17
080086 0000 - Cady & Cady Associates Inc. - 0.11 acres - $16,514.16
080085 0000 - KBWK LLC. - 0.19 acres - $9,835.05
Emerson Street Station
126067 0040 - CD119 Central Park LLC - 18.1 acres - $276,892.17
126073 0020 - Royal Land Trust I - 0.9 acres - $5,830.40
University West Station
152986 0000 - Tillman Edger W Trust ET AL - 2.4 acres - $8,948.44
153009 0000 - Baker William L & Nancy A - 4.5 acres - $23,153.91
153011 0100 - Griffin Franklin G TR - 3.0 acres - $16,554.94
153005 0000 - Sam & Charles LLC - 4.2 acres - $4,947.10
153005 0150 - Bettman Gerald S & Robin A - 0.81 acres - $5,774.54
153005 0005 - Bettman Gerald S & Robin A - 0.06 acres - $2,288.12
Bowden Road Station
152637 0000 - Mussallem Charles S Jr ET AL - 5.07 acres - $56,020.30
152665 0300 - Freeman Terry L - 8.93 acres - $87,260.52
152665 0000 - Browning Transportation Inc - 4.10 acres - $10,435.17
152665 0500 - Vining Stephen E Trust - 0.84 acres - $21,379.12
152596 0000 - Vining Stephen E Trust - 1.1 acres - $8,076.94
JTB Station
152854 0200 - Butler Pointe Operating Associates LP - 8.06 acres - $226,463.46
152776 0000 - FDOT - 2.06 acres - $0.00
152774 0000 - FDOT - 0.54 acres - $0.00
152775 0000 - FDOT - 0.62 acres - $0.00
152846 0000 - FDOT - 0.52 acres - $0.00
Baymeadows Station
148521 0015 - DR Horton Inc - +13 acres - $41,725.51
152699 0600 - R I C Properties LTD. - 0.8 acres - $9,835.05
152699 0250 - Burns Leslie M - 0.7 acres - $8,196.17
152699 0090 - Swanson William F Jr Trust - 0.8 acres - $18,904.09
152699 0070 - Baymeadows Professionaal Complex - 0.3 acres - $6,644.04
152699 0120 - Planogramming Solutions Inc - 0.8 acres - $7,939.15
152699 0100 - I-95 Baymeadows Center - 1.98 acres - $23,814.11
152701 0010 - Baymeadows Professional Building - 0.73 acres - $18,632.06
152701 0020 - Baymeadows Professional - 0.26 acres - $2,924.49
Total combined property tax for the targeted parcels is: $1,773,231.51 per year.
To voice your support or opposition to this plan and have it officially documented on record, contact Winova Hart at 630-3185 or e-mail whart@jtafla.com
Share this article
RSS
hanjin1
October 25, 2007, 08:38:40 AMI swear are these people the dumbest people around? I assume on Arlington Expressway when the elevated routes meet the overpasses they will have to be elevated over that too. That would look so stupid. Jacksonville must be one of those test markets where they try out ridiculous ideas and watch as they fail. The other cities can say, "You don't want to do that or you'll look like Jacksonville!". Is JTA a part owner in some concrete company or something? Damn stupid people!!!!
Jason
October 25, 2007, 08:43:56 AMWhy in God's name do they need all of that property??? I don't care if the JTA decides to lay rail instead of bus lanes, that system will almost surely fail.
Are they planning to integrate the stations into the retail sites they plan to purchace or just level everything for a surface lot and platform?
Steve
October 25, 2007, 08:54:58 AMAt the meetings, they said that they didn't know, but knoew that they needed all of that.
This reminds me of that conversation between father and son....
Son: Dad - Can I have $20 bucks?
Dad: What for?
Son: I don't know!
Except this is not $20, but millions of dollars.
thelakelander
October 25, 2007, 09:22:33 AMTo land bank. For mass transit funding you can get the Federal and State Governments to fund 80% of the system, leaving 20% as the local match. That 20% can include the value of property owned, as well as cash. So purchasing the most expensive office and retail complexes in these areas at today's values and then using them 10-15 years down the road as a part of the local funding, it is assumed that they'll be worth more, thus stretching the $100 million set aside in the BJP.
lindab
October 25, 2007, 09:41:05 AMThat's very interesting. At first I wondered how JTA could afford all this but now I see the pattern. Do you suppose this is a bailout of overbuilt, over-expensive commercial real estate?
thelakelander
October 25, 2007, 09:46:16 AMNo. I doubt most targeted property owners will be willing to sell their parcels. What's the benefit in having JTA as your landlord when you already own the property?
KenFSU
October 25, 2007, 12:01:06 PMI could see some of these not going over too well.
Westsider
October 25, 2007, 01:25:00 PMHello, I am a newbie, found out about your website when I attended the BRT public hearing on 10/18/07. Your site is awesome, better than the T-U reporting or our local news channels. I just read an article in today's T-U stating Clay county has the worst commute times. This article also quotes Mike Miler/JTA saying that JTA is studying the light rail and ferry service but the agency is moving forward with plans to build rapid bus corridors.
Since the BRT public hearing for the westside I have talked to a few businesses and neighbors about the acquistion of land/businesses etc for the southwest cooridor. Most of us are voicing the same concerns as posted on this site. Some have emailed JTA with comments, but feel that this won't stop JTA from proceeding.
Can anyone tell me why the T-U or local news stations aren't covering this issue? Is there anything a private citizen can do to get more coverage? If the BRT system does happen, it will effect everyone in Jacksonville for many, many years.
Westside
avonjax
October 25, 2007, 01:34:17 PMThis plan is the biggest waste of money in the HISTORY of Jacksonville...
It's truely appalling and a total waste of valuable land.
I do have a question. On the sites listed, will all the buildings on these sites come down?
thelakelander
October 25, 2007, 01:38:54 PMI read the article as well. The thing about light rail is definately a misquote. JTA has no plans to study light rail and if they did so, there would be no logical reason to spend hundreds of millions on a parallel busway system to serve the same riders that rail would do a better job of serving.
What JTA wants to do is spend as much as they can on busways and then spend more on a long range commuter rail system that will have limited stops in Jacksonville. Instead of getting it right with one decent system, they'll create two bad ones at an astronomical cost.
Sending comments to JTA won't stop them, but they'll will go on public record proving that there is a decent amount of opposition. What will stop them dead in their tracks is all of us getting together, combining our resources and mounting a coordinated drive to save our tax dollars, neighborhoods and our property values from this boondoggle.
Johnny
October 25, 2007, 01:42:05 PMIt's kind of sad, the more I read this stuff, the more I'm convinced that I will be leaving Jacksonville soon. I've been here for a long time and have always loved the city, but more and more lately, I feel the need to move on. I just hope I can sell my house in Springfield when I go, without losing $.
thelakelander
October 25, 2007, 01:42:39 PMSome will, some won't. We don't know because JTA does not know. There's no engineered plan or station designs. They don't even know how much this thing will truly cost, although from looking at similar systems the ultimate price range will be around $1 billion.
archiphreak
October 25, 2007, 01:59:34 PMThe initial cost of implementing the system could be around $1Billion, but the overall financial impact that it will have on the Downtown Core and the surrounding neighborhoods will skyrocket to the 10's of Billions in lost tax revenues from property taxes and sales taxes from businesses that will be forced out to make way for a bus route.
I agree that it is getting time to assemble a formal group of not only concerned citizens and taxpayers but also local business men and women and city officials sympathetic to the cause for Rail. Our voices need to be heard on a louder more public stage than we have currently.
brooklyn-ite
October 25, 2007, 02:06:17 PMUNbelievable ... how they will ever get the thru is beyond me. But , wait ... look at everything else they already got thru city council ! We need the media to question this **** . That is the only way to bring the light to the masses. I can't get out of Jax fast enough !
Steve
October 25, 2007, 02:22:32 PMWell, we've met with the Times-Union on a couple of occasions, and they are well aware of the issue. Based on the responses that myself and others have received, I think one of two things is going on.
1. They don't care at all.
2. They are planning a whole bunch of stuff around this (both on the new side and the editorial side), and are waiting to get all of the resources together.
I sure hope it's number 2, but when it comes to this plan, nothing would surprise me at this point.
Lunican
October 25, 2007, 02:33:38 PMWell, this is the newspaper that congratulated the city on the "complete motorization" of Jacksonville when the last trolley was ripped up to be replaced with buses.
There was a big celebration and everyone was so proud of themselves.
Ocklawaha
October 25, 2007, 02:47:00 PMTransit Oriented Development Comrades? Well it WOULD make one wonder... Let's hope the City Council thinks so too...
JTA has taken a page from Stalins book "How to build Transit and Force The People To Love You!" Transit Oriented Development was done under Stalin, by selection of a parcel of land, pointing in that direction and saying, "THAT IS A TOD!" and POOF! It was... The State owned it, the state developed it, and the state staffed and somewhat stocked it... The STATE...THE STATE... THE STATE!
Moscow Metro Stations, the most beautiful that surrendering your rights can buy!
Hardly how it is done in the free market of the West... Yet JTA has this idea, that they can buy an old plaza like Arlington, or Cedar Hills, then dictate..."POOF!" Instant TOD! This is simply WRONG! In the miltary one of the first things you learn is to "orient yourself" left, forward, reverse, right, etc... JTA has re-written those rules, now if your transit faces left, and your front door faces right...you are still a transit ORIENTED development. Does your building face a parking lot in the middle of the street? Don't worry, your taxes will soar with your new trumped up valuation at being named Transit ORIENTED. Folks, when one looks into a mirror, you are ORIENTED toward the mirror... Show the mirror your back side and according to JTA you are STILL oriented toward that mirror. Perhaps that is the trouble, JTA has spoken from the wrong end for so long, they don't know the back side from the front?
Good Transit Oriented Development is not a building near transit...It is a building that becomes PART of the transit experience, like walking down the stairs and into the door of a shop, or into a plaza of 100's of shops. The Transit stop itself becomes part of the destination itself, if not THE destination. It's not a Transit Stop at Gateway or the Avenues, but a stop that INCLUDES Gateway or the Avenues. THAT IS A TOD, or Rail Oriented Development or ROD. Calling the new dull building by Rosa Parks a TOD, when it faces an internal parking lot and has NOTHING for the transit rider to relate to, is the same as going to a car wash and calling yourself a Chevy!
Nice store in Moscow, just like JTA want's us to have, JTA Transit Oriented Development...By Supreme Decree!
So we have three things here to study. The American Way, which almost always depends on fixed guideway transit, Trolleys, Interurbans, LRT, Skyway and Commuter Rail. Only 7% ANYWHERE have anything to do with BRT or buses, and even these are challenged in Transit Journals. So with BRT, if we build it, THEY WON'T COME! Item two, is our Skyway, Rail, streetcars or similar plans, where Cities have enjoyed over $1,200 dollars in BOOMING DEVELOPMENT for every dollar invested, much of this in true TOD/ROD development. Lastly, there is Comrade Stalin and JTA, We'll just buy the land, call everything within a few blocks a BRT-TOD and hope the Federal Transit Administration ever comes snooping around... HEY? Why Not? It worked for Uncle Joe Stalin!
Ocklawaha
Bostech
October 25, 2007, 03:24:49 PMWell looks nice,big enough for future expansion for alien landing spots too.
Is there a stop for future courthouse?
hanjin1
October 25, 2007, 03:50:47 PMI doubt we would need one for the "future" courthouse, since we will probably never get one. You know they might as well use that empty land and build a transit station there. At least we can get the homeless to congregate away from Hemming Plaza
avonjax
October 25, 2007, 06:09:33 PMI'm not even bothered by the billion dollar price tag. Although from all the fine information that has been provided by the sensible people who post here, seems to support a much better mass transit system can be built for less.
I'm more concerned about a system that will be useful for "everyone," not just those who have no choice but to use public transportation.
If the right system is implemented now, I think more people will make mass transit a first choice, especially during the work week.
But again as I have said here before, I don't believe people with a choice will park their car to ride a bus.
Westsider
October 26, 2007, 07:43:15 AMHas anyone contacted city council members, churches, businesess for the effected areas of land being aquired by JTA? Has anyone looked at how many business/churches/community centers will be closed or land lost when this whole system is completed? What if a group of citizens/businesses/organizations purchased a 1/2 page or full page ad in the T-U letting the public know how our tax dollars are buying up all this land, how it will effect the economy in each area, tax base, employment, traffic etc. List the email addresses, phone numbers of people to contact to voice their opinions. I haven't lost faith in the Jacksonville citizens. I truly feel if all the information was shown the public outcry to the COJ/JTA would be over whelming. Have any of the area TV stations shown any interest?
Westsider
Ocklawaha
October 29, 2007, 07:24:13 AMI contend it is time for our own 501-C-3 Corporation.
An action company of like minded individuals that can promote and build rail at the very least the downtown "Streetcar/Museum" aspect of it.
A group that does more then collect old stories and photos
A bunch of activists that can present alternative plans, models, drawings at important meetings
A legal citizen built cartel beyond reproach with a true NOT FOR PROFIT status
(No! Not for profit, does NOT mean you can't be paid for services rendered or time invested, but we could talk about that aspect and which way we want it to go...)
A herd doesn't have a leader, but a well organized mob DOES, add the magic word INC. to the end and we'll get the attention to support other worthy causes
It's time for a change of heart here, we need to incorporate, and seek our 501-C-3 status with the IRS. I have already done this a couple of times, and am willing to lead the civilian charge...Any legal eagles and number crunchers want to join me??? OUR CITY NEEDS YOU!!!
Ocklawaha
For information on another 501-C-3 see:
http://www.geocities.com/fcphs/
Your welcome to join us here too!
rwolfe618
November 28, 2007, 12:28:08 PMWhen I first heard about the idea of a rapid transit system in Jacksonville, I thought, "FINALLY!" And then I found out they were referring to a bus rapid transit system, and my whole attitude changed.
We had the project manager for the BRT and the director of external affairs for JTA speak at a neighborhood meeting Monday night. We're near the proposed San Juan location, and they told us that our property values would increase after the terminal was built because profitable companies are very eager to locate near public transit terminals. But seriously, how much land is going to be left for any company to move in after they take up the only available blocks in the area with the terminal? AND, it really doesn't seem like they're thinking about what the locations will be like in 20 to 25 years when the project is supposedly going to be complete.
Commuter rail would make so much more sense, and it would be completed in a much shorter timeline based on purchasing the parallel tracks throughout the city from CSX. Their reasoning for not looking into this is supposedly due to the two Asian shipping companies building terminals at JaxPort. There's going to be a lot more rail traffic going out of Jacksonville in the next (Mitsui and Hanjin) few years. But let's face it, there won't be nearly as much rail traffic as there will be street traffic between the increased number of truckers leaving the port and the ever-increasing Jacksonville population. Rail is definitely the lesser of the two evils.
Does anyone know if there is an active petition going around against the BRT system? I know quite a few people who would be interested in signing it, including myself.
thelakelander
November 28, 2007, 12:47:17 PMThey are, just not at bus stops.
That's definately another fatal flaw of this system. Its being sold as a substitute for rail, yet it does not even serve the densest urban neighborhoods it goes through.
Is that the new line these days? The S-Line has nothing to do with CSX or the port because its owned by the city and there are no tracks on it. The CSX A (down Roosevelt) will see a reduction in freight traffic due to the Orlando commuter rail deal. Those alone combine for over 20 miles of rail right-of-way from Orange Park to downtown and the Northside that have very little to do with the port. Combined, they also eliminate the need for two poorly concieved legs of BRT....the North and SW corridors. Also, is track capacity is an issue, its still cheaper to build a parallel line of major routes (like the FEC line), then it is to take people's homes and businesses to build a bus super highway all over town.
In this case, like most, rail is a positive if we have to dibble and dabble with mass transit.
Right now there's not one, but we definately need to start one up.
Ocklawaha
November 28, 2007, 06:21:18 PMUniversity of Michigan (Pretty close to Detroit) Planning Handbook for BRT:
This does not mean that Bus Rapid Transit is equal to rail transit as an economic development tool. Economic development is a broad term that has been defined as ?progress towards a community?s economic goals, including increased productivity, employment, business activity, investment and redevelopment? (Litman 2004). For example, the General Accounting Office has noted that there are at least two possible economic development advantages of light rail over BRT. First, light rail allows a city to project an image of itself as a world class city, thereby attracting investment based on the city?s prestige. Second, according to the GAO, light rail, unlike BRT, defines corridors of development, thus spurring – or at least attracting – new development of real estate in those areas. (GAO 2001: 31).
In fact, it may be true that rail transit is, overall, a better economic development tool. Although Bus Rapid Transit is able to overcome some of the image problems suffered by standard bus transit, it is unlikely to ever be fully as prestigious as rail transit. Bus Rapid Transit may also not have the same congestion or pollution reduction effects as rail transit. These are extremely important factors that communities should consider as they decide what form of mass transit is right for them, and that seem to weigh in on the side of rail transit.
QuoteTCRP Report 102, Transit-Oriented Development in the United States: Experiences, Challenges, and Prospects, synthesizes and analyzes the results of an extensive survey on TOD activity. The 145 agencies responding to the survey identified TOD projects and the type of associated transit service, with just under eight percent identified as associated with bus service of any kind. The report’s Los Angeles area case study includes a brief discussion of TOD and BRT, and reports that in Los Angeles no TOD projects had broken ground or were in the planning stages as of the time the survey was completed.
Check this out, this is the ONLY area where any expansion would be needed, and even that is remote as we are only talking about 1 mile or so. The line over the Trout River (in red). Otherwise, the other two red segments are, Union Station, which OF COURSE would need some track, and the FEC RofW which would also need an extra track. As for the PORT LINE and JTA? Why is it our "Transportation Authority" can't read a map?
From "Evergreen Politics" BRT in Seattle:
But, taking that anti light rail perspective misses the long-term benefit of creating a regional rail system. Comparing the benefits of BRT and light rail is comparing apples and oranges. Building a light rail system through the center of Seattle that will eventually connect with other parts of the metro area is a critical long- term investment. I would venture to say that it is more than a shame that most of the funding for this long-term investment comes for the regional tax base (Sound Transit RTA district) and not from the state and federal government. However, that does not mean that we should abandon our long-term plans for rail. Rail offers the very best system to create a rapid transit system.
From the Kansas City Star, RE: City Council OVERTURNS Light Rail Vote!
Thursday was the deadline for the council to get the petition initiative, organized in part by business tycoon James Nutter Sr., on the ballot.
“We got pushed into a corner by the Nutter proposal after we got pushed in another corner by the Chastain proposal,” Funkhouser said.
One council member said the decision to repeal a voter-approved plan was “gut-wrenching.” The three dissenters were Beth Gottstein, John Sharp and Cathy Jolly.
Gottstein said the council’s repeal will “kill momentum” in favor of light rail because voters will be angry at their will being overturned.
While they were divided on the repeal and when to hold the next light-rail election, council members emphasized that light rail in Kansas City is a matter of when, not if.
“Our community is ready for light rail,” Councilwoman Jan Marcason said.
Chastain had hoped to persuade council members not to repeal his plan. Instead, he wanted to have revisions made to his plan and presented to voters in February. But he didn’t get a chance to address the council.
After the vote to repeal his plan, Chastain said that 73,998 voters supported his plan last November and that the council was thumbing its collective nose at those voters.
“Today the City Council did a bad thing,” he said. “They slapped democracy in the face.”
PETITION ANYONE? Maybe it's time we start pushing some folks into corners ourselves? I don't mind if I do
Ocklawaha
second_pancake
December 20, 2007, 02:43:22 PMWhere's the petition???
gatorback
December 27, 2007, 08:17:28 PMLooks like the JTA is just going to take out whatever it feels is undesirable...sound familiar?
ricker
October 06, 2010, 10:20:20 AMgeneral autonomy? yup sounds familiar.
Keith-N-Jax
October 06, 2010, 12:01:28 PMI am glad to see I am the not the only one feeling this way.
uptowngirl
October 06, 2010, 01:02:25 PMFor a city in a budget crunch this is a lot of revenue to lose!
tufsu1
October 06, 2010, 02:30:31 PMdiscounting the fact that JTA is a state agency...anmd therefore separate from the City's budget
duvaldude08
October 06, 2010, 03:50:44 PMLooking at it, I dont think there are trying to buy the entire property. For example, the station Maybe located in Town and country parking (kinda like the mini station looked in Gateway Mall.) Im sure they are not going to but that much property just for a bus station.
thelakelander
October 06, 2010, 04:23:37 PMThis whole plan is up in smoke. The $100 million from the BJP that would have been spent on this is helping fund the over budget Duval County Courthouse project.
arb
October 06, 2010, 04:25:48 PMUnfortunately, I feel the same. Jax is becoming a hopeless case, not only with the transportation infastructure, but the schools, crime, preservation, cleanliness, etc. And speaking of problems, whats up with NE Florida and all the child abductions. I was watching some TV today and there was another damn amber alert :\
ChriswUfGator
October 06, 2010, 04:35:50 PMAsk RedneckWestsider. Someone probably forgot to pay their $75 "Anti-Abduction Fee"...
stephendare
October 06, 2010, 04:36:49 PMroflol, Chris.
uptowngirl
October 06, 2010, 08:50:52 PMWTH? The property taxes beign paid go to the city, if JTA purchases the properties they are exempt. That would mean a loss of a revenue to the city correct?
tufsu1
October 07, 2010, 08:54:01 AMbut JTA didn't purchase any of these properties
ricker
October 11, 2010, 04:31:16 PMcan anyone here assist in sourcing the details of the Hamilton St., Shirley Ave. fccj elevated busway project which may have oneday crossed the ditch behind those modular homes on Hamilton which sit straddling the little creek?
I hear (from a woman who has lived on Tunis since it was 51st street) that St'Mathew's school had a bit to do with shelving it (for now) due to the reconfiguraton (elimination) of theire athletics program if r.o.w. was encroached upon (subject to condemnation).
Just interested to see what may have been.
not really for or against it.
Hamilton could stand a central turnlane at St.John's Ave at least.
It's a stretch of road which carries traffic circulating around parked trains at times. accessing any of 3 inner arterials_Cassat, Blanding, 17. not to mention Park St. under the RR and Blanding/Park connector over as well as busy busy SanJuan.
Improving the Hamilton and Blanding intersections at St'John's Ave needs to happen. on the cheap.
nothing fancy. just signals declaring who has the right to move their vehicle and when.
Non-RedNeck Westsider
October 11, 2010, 04:46:00 PMBlanding has right of way through St. John's & St. John's has right of way through Hamilton. Not to sound too snarky, but the stop-signs declare who gets to go and who doesn't.
ricker
December 16, 2010, 03:48:18 PMheard.
have you ever tried to turn south onto Blanding from St.John'sAve westbound?
This intersection is within what was and should have remained a SCHOOL ZONE.
snarkiness notwithstanding.
Non-RedNeck Westsider
December 16, 2010, 11:00:54 PMI do all the time, usually with a nice take-out of wings, and there's never been a real issue. The lights at Park and Blanding (for southbound) and at the gymnastics place (for northbound traffic) seem to hold traffic enough for me to make a left without much issue.
With regards to the school zone, they really need to mark it a little better, I catch myself not slowing down until it's way too late when I travel Hamilton. If there was ever a JSO watching that area, I would be paying a hefty ticket. The funny thing is, I know it's there, but since there's only the sign (partially behind some oleanders) I seem to forget more mornings than I remember.