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BRT: Killing Downtown, The Final Chapter

Thursday morning, Downtown Vision hosted a meeting between Downtown Stakeholders and JTA officials, concerning Bus Rapid Transit. As predicted, those in attendance got the chance to see some Fourth of July fireworks. Here is a review, in question and answer format, of yesterday's heated discussion.

Published May 25, 2007 in Transit      Digg Digg   Share this article on Facebook Share on Facebook   twitterTweet this!   Open printer friendly version of this article Print Article

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1. Why not State & Union?

Basically, because FDOT said so and they want to get their buses as close to the major office towers as possible.  So instead of following the downtown master plan (yes it addresses mass transit too) or giving the public and downtown property owners as much respect as the FDOT, JTA has cherry picked routes along the most critical commercial and residential oriented streets in downtown’s revitalization process….Adams, Bay & Forsyth.

 

 

2. Why select Adams over Bay/Forsyth?

Evidently, according to JTA, the JEDC does not believe that a bus transit way fits into their concept of the Bay Street Town Center being a stretch lined with restaurants, bars, and clubs.  Instead, the JEDC believes the trolleys would be a better fit for that corridor.

With this in mind, JTA has turned its eyes to Adams.  Unfortunately, planners likely have never taken a walk down Adams Street because one would have to be as blind as Stevie Wonder to notice that the stretch between Ocean and Julia is already lined with the things that everyone wishes were on Bay Street. This only provides more reason to force JTA to abandon the concept of BRT on these three streets and consider alternative options that fulfill the needs of all affected parties.

 

 

3. How does JTA believe BRT will benefit the Adams Street scene?

Consultants admit over half of the current parallel parking spaces along Adams would be lost forever and replaced with an eastbound bus only lane.  However, they claim this would not affect retail because office workers park in the spots anyway and feed the meters all day.  While it’s insane to make a blanket statement like that, a simple minded person would solve this problem with efficient parking enforcement.  Instead, JTA has a better plan… they’ll eliminate the problem by wiping out the parking stalls and putting bus lanes in their place.

 

 

4. How many city buses will run down Adams Street?

During peak hours, up to one bus for every one and a half minutes.  Imagine sitting outside or walking in that type of environment?  In Minneapolis, one of JTA’s “successful transit mall” examples, the city is completely relocating their buses to an alternative street after the pedestrian mall became locally known as the place to eat and inhale bus fumes.  Shouldn’t we be learning from other’s mistakes instead of trying to repeat them?

 


5. Why is JTA ignoring the skyway and existing trolleys in planning this system?

Because people don’t want to transfer, even though the $184 million people mover system’s ultimate success is based off of regional transit systems feeding riders into it.  Instead, planners believe everyone wants to be picked up from their driveway and dropped off at the front door of their workplace.  Unfortunately, in the real world, that’s pretty unrealistic and attempting to do so is about as foolish as it gets.  Even in mass transit oriented cities, like New York, transferring between mass transit systems is a must.  The key is being efficient and timely.

Instead of taking $20 million out of taxpayers pockets to throw at an issue that can’t be solved, why not dig deep, discover and address the reasons why riders hate to transfer locally?  Just a hunch, but it may have something to do with confusing routes with little to no route information at stops and unreliable stop/transfer times that can leave transferee's waiting at shelter-less bus stops next to eight lane highways for over 30 minutes.  Why not address those problems first before attempting to pull a Neil Armstrong and reach the moon?

 

 

6. Why JTA believes BRT is the best mass transit alternative out there?

Planner’s believe BRT enjoys all the benefits of rail with the only difference being that the it has rubber wheels.  It seems like somebody has been enrolled in one of Ricky Williams’ yoga classes.  Ever wonder why homebuilders don’t sell you the same line with laminate and granite countertops?  Simple, because you get what you pay for and one is clearly superior than the other for a valid reason. 

Nevertheless, that’s not what the downtown busway debate is about.  BRT definitely has its place in the region’s overall mass transit network, just not smack dab in the middle of the heart of downtown on Bay, Forsyth, and especially Adams Street.

 

 

7. What is the timeline for implementation?

If JTA successfully sticks the machete down downtown’s back, then the Adams Street line should be up and running by 2010.  Construction on ripping up the streets and sidewalks would coincide with the openings of One12, 218 Adams Lofts, and 122 Ocean.  The overall 29 mile system would be operation by 2025 and would be extended to the beaches and Orange Park by 2035.

 

 

8. Are there any successful examples of what JTA is proposing for downtown?

According to consultants, Orlando’s Lymmo, Denver’s 16th Street Mall, and Minneapolis’ Nicollet Mall.  Unfortunately, as mentioned by Metro Jacksonville on numerous occasions, Orlando and Denver’s systems are shuttle buses that are comparable to our downtown trolleys. 

Nicollet Mall is an example of a BRT transit mall, but residents and downtown businesses have finally successfully lobbied to get the diesel fuming buses off the street to restore its ambiance.  At this point, we don’t know what’s worse, the fact that transit planners can’t tell the difference between free shuttle bus loops and real regional bus rapid transitways or that years into the process they can’t find one successful example of what they are proposing.  Either way, it's bad for downtown.

 

 

9. Can JTA dance?

Like Michael Jackson at a choir boy’s convention.  When asked about considering alternative streets between State & Union and Adams, planners responded with doomsday predictions about downtown traffic concurrency and why BRT is needed.

Asked about the estimated BRT cost, planner’s did not know and could not even give a price range (I guess saying $1 billion would end up with a public flogging in Hemming Plaza) but made it clear that expanding the skyway would cost up to $50 million/mile.  When asked if this system was logical, officials made the point of saying that critics said the same thing about JTB and the Dames Point.  Too bad they conveinently left out the skyway.

 

 

10. What happens if the downtown BRT lanes aren’t built?

JTA claims that without mass transit improvements, new growth will not be allowed downtown. 

However, let's be real about this.  The proposed downtown BRT system is simply a consolidation of existing bus routes onto one primary thoroughfare.  All of the half empty buses you see running on downtown’s streets today will all be rerouted down Adams Street at the rate of 1 bus for every 1.5 minutes.  Nobody is fighting the notion that downtown’s mass transit options shouldn’t be improved.  The fallout is over the routes selected and JTA’s stubbornness to compromise by seriously considering alternative options.

 

 

Why should you give this plan, in it’s current state, the middle finger?

Asking a person who wants to live, that they can choose the option of getting in a knife dance with Orenthal "Da Juice" James Simpson or taking on Old Sparky, Ted Bundy-style, is a lose-lose situation.  That’s the predicament JTA has placed downtown advocates, residents, and business owners in.

Both options on the table clearly will have a negative effect on the revitalizing downtown retail scene, the parking situation, and will cost taxpayers $20 million.  All of this is being pushed by planners and consultants whose primary interest is force feeding buses down the same routes they selected years ago.  What makes the situation worse is that many don’t spend a lot of time downtown and continue to refuse to get creative and think outside of the box, which only consists of Adams, Bay and Forsyth.

 

 

Monroe Street as a compromise?  Why not?

JTA BRT proposed route D

Monroe Street is only one block north of Adams and covers the same general area, yet is lined with surface lots, garages and offices, as opposed to street level retail.

 

During the discussion, Oliver Barakat, a member of the Downtown Design Review Committee, suggested that JTA consider a compromise by seriously looking at an alternative east-west street, north of Adams and south of State & Union. 

Monroe Street, one block north of Adams, is one of those streets that could be a viable alternative that pleases both sides.  From JTA’s perspective, they want the buses as close to major places of employment as possible.  Well Monroe runs right through the heart of the city’s government square concept with immediate frontage to the Federal Courthouse, New County Courthouse, City Hall and the new public Library.  Its also only a short two block walk away from the office towers lining Forsyth and ties into the Skyway at Hemming Plaza.


Only one block north of Adams Street, Monroe Street sits completely empty. This street could accommodate bus only lanes in both directions if need be.

From an urbanite’s perspective, the city has already effectively killed any chance of retail happening on that street by bulldozing LaVilla, replacing restaurants with street level office space near Hemming Plaza, and wiping out that section of the Cathedral District with surface parking lots.  A new streetscape down Monroe would also tie in with the new and poorly planned pocket park being constructed on the intersection of Main & Monroe.  With this route in place, JTA would get what they want, both Adams and the Bay Street Town Center would be saved from disaster, and the bus line would begin to better complement the skyway as opposed to competing against it.

 

 

Making a stand

While things can look gloom from time to time when going through this process, public input is essential if we want to see the best mass transit system eventually constructed downtown.  JTA plans to make their final recommendation on route selection this fall.  In the meantime, lets continue to pound their email boxes with letters stating how you feel and what you think should be done to ensure Jacksonville has its cake and eats it too.  They say, united we stand, divided we fall.  Jacksonville has already shot itself in the foot on multiple occasions.  Quite frankly, we’re running out of toes.  Feel free to cut & paste the addresses below and send your response out today. 

John Peyton [removed]">jpeyton@coj.net;

Adam Hollingsworth [removed]">AdamH@coj.net;

Alan Mosley [removed]">Amosley@coj.net;

Ron Barton [removed]">barton@coj.net;

Paul Crawford [removed]">paulc@coj.net;

Suzanne Jenkins [removed]">SuzanneJ@coj.net;

Pat Lockett-Felder [removed]">PFelder@coj.net;

Ronnie Fussell [removed]">RonnieF@coj.net;

Elaine Brown [removed]">ElaineB@coj.net; [removed]">

Amy Harrell Amy@downtownjacksonville.org

Terry Lorince Terry@downtownjacksonville.org

Suraya Teeple [removed]">steeple@jtafla.com;

Winova Hart [removed]">whart@jtafla.com;

 



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» 18 Comments

Mark5

May 25, 2007, 08:11:11 AM

i won't be pleased if they get their way, but to be honest i am very interested to see how it will go....barring it isn't at the expense of downtowners

thelakelander

May 25, 2007, 08:40:26 AM

The only way we can keep this thing from being built at the expense of the downtown community is to apply public pressure to get them to consider alternative routes, instead of force feeding the thing down Bay, Forsyth or Adams.

RG

May 25, 2007, 10:36:42 AM

Monroe Street is certainly a reasonable alternative and is better than the others in that it ties in with the Skyway station already at Hemming Park.  State or Union would obviously be best and would tie into the Skyway too, but I can live with Monroe.  

avonjax

May 25, 2007, 10:46:49 AM

"JTA claims that without mass transit improvements, new growth will not be allowed downtown."
I am confused as to what they mean by that statement.....
Is it a scare tatic for those who don't approve of this idiotic plan?

 

Johnny

May 25, 2007, 10:49:44 AM

This seems insane that the planners are rolling with this with so much facts against them. I know someone's getting paid, but eventually they have to see it's a bad idea.

Is there a way to coordinate a rally that can help educate the non-downtowners, which can also be used to protest this thing?

thelakelander

May 25, 2007, 11:19:42 AM

Quote
"JTA claims that without mass transit improvements, new growth will not be allowed downtown."
I am confused as to what they mean by that statement.....
Is it a scare tatic for those who don't approve of this idiotic plan?


The way it was presented at the meeting was in the form of a scare tatic.  However, it is true that mass transit must be upgraded in downtown to substain future growth, similar to the concurrency system we have in the suburbs for new development.  

Nevertheless, this doesn't mean that the only option for improving downtown's mass transit is the BRT plan currently being pushed, as it was made to seem.  Those future improvements could also be in the form of expanding the skyway, trolley routes, additional regular bus service or even building a streetcar line.  There's a million ways to skin this cat.  Unfortunately, JTA is set on running buses down streets, they have no business even considering.

stephendare

May 25, 2007, 03:31:51 PM

This is all about the ego of Suraya Teeple.

She doesnt' care what the community wants and couldn't be less interested.

She made up her mind, and thats that, and the rest of us can just go get tallywhackered.

Ocklawaha

May 29, 2007, 02:03:35 PM

I am not going to spend any time whatsoever in attacking the JTA planners. If we complain about the tune, there is no reason to attack the monkey when the organ grinder is present.

With few exceptions BRT cannot be defended. It is simply a Big Oil, Big Highway Lobby attempt to try and stem the floodwaters of LRT, because frankly, LRT numbers are ripping them a new one. Transit malls CAN work, but not with diesel buses, CNG, Electric, Trolley Bus or Fuel Cell would solve the pollution factor. But the stigma of Bus Transit will continue. BTW, if BRT is SO ATTRACTIVE, why is it they are now covering the wheels and giving the BRT buses LRT looks? JTA just doesn't get it, they have NEVER had an original idea in their history.

We are one of only TWO cities in the Country with a highway builder planning and running our transit. What does the rest of America KNOW that we haven't figured out?
I'll be posting numbers on BRT vs LRT over the next few weeks, so hold on to your wallets!


mtraininjax

May 29, 2007, 08:10:33 PM

the old courthouse would have closed the street and there is NO word that it won't happen. We need the new courthouse plans before this issue is laid to rest. JTA could not figure their way out of a paper bag. They live in fantasyland, people want to ride a bus to get to a destination, not ride it because of the gas prices or the smell of the bus or the people inside. People ride to get to somewhere, the airport, the beaches, a mall.....somewhere, buses ride around Jacksonville going nowhere with no one on them. Sort of like most of the JTA officials think, empty!

thelakelander

May 30, 2007, 06:36:08 AM

Mtrain, I agree that JTA needs to better coordinate whatever it wants to do with other city agencies, businesses and residents that will be affected by this thing.  The routes they are pushing represent what's going on today, as opposed to tomorrow.

For example, the proposed routes serve the current courthouse site, but there's a good chance the new courthouse, along Monroe Street, will be open or at least well under construction by the time they potentially screw up Adams, Bay or Forsyth.

Also, the planning of the massive seven block Jacksonville Transportation Center layout doesn't acknowledge the convention center expansion/relocation debate going on right next door.

As for the courthouse design, Peyton mentioned a few months ago, that this go around, Monroe Street would remain open.

Ocklawaha

May 30, 2007, 10:31:12 AM

JTA may look like idiots and talk like idiots but don't let that fool you. They really are idiots. I find few government agencys annoying, and JTA is one of them.

Ross Capon, executive director of the National Association of Rail Passengers, said buses were slower, carried fewer passengers and were sometimes dangerous.

Also, he said, "evidence has proven conclusively" that claims of superior cost-effectiveness of BRTs "have been overstated." Similar preferences were noted in a Government Accountability Office report three years ago to the Senate Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs Committee.

Although GAO official JayEtta Z. Hecker concluded that BRTs offered many advantages in terms of cost and flexibility, she concluded that "bus service has a negative image, particularly when compared with rail service."

She said rail-based plans were often viewed as the mark of "a world-class city" and an image-enhancer that could attract developers.

JTA is an agency without any nice qualities, as far as I can tell.  As a group they have a toxic personality bordering on the radioactive.

Ocklawaha


stjr

December 19, 2009, 02:08:11 PM

After the recent series on Downtown, you would think it would give pause to BRT proponents.  But, once again, a lack of coordination of City leaders, will lead to more waste and steps backwards.

Noisy, diesel spewing buses barreling through Downtown in bus-only lanes will effectively intimidate pedestrians, discourage auto visitors with increased bottlenecks and confusing traffic rules, block cars from the little remaining parallel parking, and make it difficult for auto drivers to "connect" with retail options they are trying to locate as they pass down Downtown streets.

By the way, could someone interpret this quote:


Quote
“This will lead to fewer buses downtown,” Executive Director Michael Blaylock said, explaining that other bus routes would be diverted out of the downtown area when the bus-only lanes open up.

Does this mean I take a neighborhood bus to a BRT line, a BRT line to DT, and a DT bus loop to my destination?  It seems to make this quote accurate, we have to run fewer buses from the burbs to DT.  Most people would say we already run too few I believe.  What's the game plan here?

And this silly quote is my favorite:

Quote
Except for Jefferson and Broad, the bus-only lanes follow the same route as the Skyway, which hasn’t come close to meeting the ridership estimates anticipated when it was being built.

Teeple said the two systems serve different people. The Skyway was designed for people who drive downtown and then get on the people mover to get closer to where they work,she said, and people using the new lanes will take a bus into the downtown and then transfer over to one of the downtown buses.

So, the $ky-high-way is for commuters, now, not people trying to get around Downtown.  It's official so let's not have any more MJ posters suggest we need to expand the $ky-high-way to take us to Riverside, San Marco, or the Stadium.  It's only for AUTO (not BUS) commuters headed to work, and then, only if the job is directly at a $ky-high-way stop.  That may offer us just one more reason why the thing has no riders.

I guess JTA figures that AUTO commuters wouldn't be interested in literally lowering themselves into taking a street level Downtown bus from their parking lot along with the BUS commuters from the burbs.  No, we need a separate system that literally elevates them to segregate everyone and duplicate services.

In the end, the only good the BRT may do is to finally kill the $ky-high-way for good.  But, it is going to (1) be very expensive as we duplicate operating losses and (2) just replace the $ky-high-way with another system that won't stand the test of time and have to also be killed off when we bring in commuter rail and streetcars.

As Ock says above, idiots are in charge! Huh



Quote
JTA considering bus-only lanes downtown
The project would speed ride times, and ease traffic congestion.


    * By Larry Hannan
    * Story updated at 4:00 AM on Saturday, Dec. 19, 2009

Bus-only lanes similar to those now on Blanding Boulevard on Jacksonville’s Westside will be coming to downtown within the next two years.

The Jacksonville Transportation Authority is moving forward with plans for bus-only lanes on downtown roads, a $12 million project that is the first phase of a long-term plan designed to create the lanes throughout Jacksonville.

JTA expects to advertise for a design contractor in January, hire a contractor a few months later and begin construction in 2011. Neil Nance,  JTA design project manager, said the lanes would open sometime in 2012 on portions of Jefferson, Broad, Forsyth and Bay streets north of the Acosta Bridge and on parts of Prudential Drive, Riverplace Boulevard and Kings Avenue on the Southside.

The idea is to make it easier for buses to travel in the congested downtown and at the same time help ease that congestion and provide better service for the bulk of JTA’s customers.

“This will lead to fewer buses downtown,” Executive Director Michael Blaylock said, explaining that other bus routes would be diverted out of the downtown area when the bus-only lanes open up.

“About 80 percent of our bus passengers travel into the downtown area,” said Suraya Teeple,  JTA transportation planning manager. “It’s important that we get better infrastructure into the downtown.”

The routes will allow passengers to get out at the new courthouse, a planned Jacksonville Regional Transportation Center at the Prime Osborn Convention Center and a proposed San Marco Riverwalk. Hemming Plaza and the San Marco Square will also be within easy walking distance.

About 80 percent of the downtown project is being paid for by the federal government as part of the Federal Transit Administration’s “small starts” process that pays for start-up transit services, said Scott Clem,  JTA planning and research director. JTA is paying the rest.

Bus-only lanes are on Blanding, between Morse Avenue and 103rd Street. Future phases would include them on other sections of Blanding and on portions of Lem Turner Road, Arlington Expressway, Beach Boulevard and Philips Highway, all from downtown to the city’s outer reaches.

JTA wants to accomplish all of this within the next 10 years but doesn’t know yet how much it will cost or how it will be paid for.

Unlike Blanding’s 24-hour bus-only lanes, the downtown lanes will be bus-only during rush hour and other busy traffic times. Cars will be allowed during slower traffic times.

Clem said the Blanding lanes, installed early this year, were a test case designed to see how the community would respond.

“It’s been a great success,” Clem said. “Cars are not getting into the lanes and our bus drivers love it because it makes it so much easier to travel that area.”

 Except for Jefferson and Broad, the bus-only lanes follow the same route as the Skyway, which hasn’t come close to meeting the ridership estimates anticipated when it was being built.

Teeple said the two systems serve different people. The Skyway was designed for people who drive downtown and then get on the people mover to get closer to where they work, she said, and people using the new lanes will take a bus into the downtown and then transfer over to one of the downtown buses.

JTA’s focus on bus-only lanes has frustrated supporters of commuter rail who believe the city would be better off focusing on that as the main way to move people around more efficiently. The agency is also looking at rail and a streetcar system.

Robert Mann, a retired transportation consultant and long-time supporter of commuter rail, wants to see a light rail system or actual trolley system, instead of buses made up to look like trolleys.

“It won’t be popular because it’s still a bus,” Mann said. The lanes “would be a good complement to commuter rail, but it shouldn’t be the major system of transportation in Jacksonville.”

http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/2009-12-18/story/jta_considering_bus_only_lanes_downtown

Charles Hunter

December 19, 2009, 02:35:35 PM

Not sure, but I think the "fewer buses downtown" means that many of the routes that now loop thru DT will be over on Broad/Jefferson.  Same number of buses, just not in the core of DT.  As much of the Broad/Jefferson corridor is vacant land (and the Court House), it can develop around the bus stops - maybe with businesses catering to bus riders.

CS Foltz

December 19, 2009, 03:09:25 PM

BRT is something that I am not comfortable with.......just with a single lane bus dedicated! Downtown may work but outside of that area...........using valuable lane space for something that I have never seen with more than a dozen riders at any one time! Not a real efficient use by my standards, not to mention contributing to CO2 and emissions! Rail would be much more efficient and cost effective!

tufsu1

December 19, 2009, 08:13:44 PM

CS...as of now, the lanes proposed for downtown are bus only just during the peak hours....obviously this is when congestion is worst and when the loss of a lane will affect people the most....seems like a pretty good test to me of whether people in Jax. who have a choice will ride the bus!

stjr

December 20, 2009, 12:53:17 AM

....seems like a pretty good test to me of whether people in Jax. who have a choice will ride the bus!

Tufsu, one problem.  JTA never "tests" anything.  Once they initiate a project, they take irrefutable ownership of it and their twin weaknesses of bureaucratic pride and greed for federal money take over.  This leads them to stubbornly cling to whatever the subject project is, attributes of success and community impact be damned.  I expect the same here. 

Once BRT gets a toehold (it may have already), JTA will never give up on it.  Admitting a failure isn't in their playbook.

Ocklawaha

December 20, 2009, 12:58:43 AM

BRT is something that I am not comfortable with.......just with a single lane bus dedicated! Downtown may work but outside of that area...........using valuable lane space for something that I have never seen with more than a dozen riders at any one time! Not a real efficient use by my standards, not to mention contributing to CO2 and emissions! Rail would be much more efficient and cost effective!


Credit where it is due here guys, as I said in the article, BRT as the primary transit mode is a huge mistake. As stjr pointed out, it WILL BE another $kyway (Did you like that stjr?), if they continue to overbuild for buses. The idea of rush hours only, is actually a good use of the transit dollars, you automatically balance the per lane rider usage between cars and transit by restricting cars in peak hours. In Colombia we instituted a "ban" day/hours, something like our water restrictions and based on your tag number. But then Medellin has mass transit SERVICE and we don't.

As for the buses running empty. Not really, certainly not in rush hours. Keeping in mind that all buses operate without the expectation of being full at any given point in the route. The purpose of having 43 - 60 seats, is the flexibility of being able to provide a comfortable accommodation to anyone in need of a ride. Naturally one will come a lot closer to 50 people for 50 seats during the rush hour, but that doesn't mean those 50 seats are consistently full throughout the trip. Keep in mind that 50 seats doesn't mean a particular route Carry's 50 passengers. In fact a 50 seat bus on a single route, might carry 500+ people during the trek through it's route.

stjr, I'd completely disagree with some of your conclusions on ridership, skyway, bus stop etc... but I think all of you are on the right general track (pun intended). For example would the elevated route of the $kyway, be any less a pain in the ass if LIGHT RAIL VEHICLES were running on it? What about the much heavier ridership in Atlanta, Miami, Washington and Medellin Metros? These systems are almost all elevated or subway and all with much more use then our buses or Skyway.

The failure in our Skyway, our bus system, our express buses and our soon-to-screw-up-BRT, is found in our government.

Someone explain to me why the Skyway was turned at the last minute from running on the recommended Courthouse/Hyatt station, or BOA to Modis, to Hogan, and hence to FCCJ? Why
was this ACCEPTED PLAN changed? Why in the end did we miss EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THOSE PASSENGER GENERATOR SITES? We won't expand the system to the Stadium, where we could easily catalog over 50 - 100 events a year, but we built it to the Prime Osbourne "Convention Booth," which has a least 10 gun and monster truck shows each year? Why did our order for 6 new MCI motor coaches get the axe? Why was the demonstration of those coaches sabotaged without a single news item? How did those coaches cut their own electrical cables? kill their own batteries? flatten their own tires? One of the good ol' boys didn't get his payola? Why did we accept delivery on only 3? Why are they not restroom, coffee bar, footrest, wifi, music, TV equipped? WHY? Why did JTA's own Light Rail proponent suddenly change his mind to read, "Light Rail is not a good fit in Jacksonville? Regionally why is our Commuter Rail system not looking at St. Augustines perfect condition, EXISTING FEC STATION? Why are we going to "invent" a whole new stop on regional, State and Amtrak funds? Why are we planning to run a train to Yulee, population uh? Huh? when we could just as easily roll right to the foot of Centre Street in Fernandina Beach? WHY? Gainesville by rail? Hasn't even been mentioned by the rocket scientists in charge. Let's see, we have SHANDS JACKSONVILLE, and the UF Dental College, UF Nursing, VA Medical Clinic, as well as UNF, FSC, JU, and a dozen other colleges and universities of various sizes. Gainesville has THE UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA medical college, Santa Fe State, etc., no freeway connection, a single Greyhound schedule 4 days a week, and an underused rail line between us. In Jacksonville Transportation mathematics that equals...  NOTHING! No thought! No PLAN! Nada! nada nunca! Nil! Zip! WHY?

So this brings me to the stupid plan to build the BRT line UNDER the $kyway. UNDER IT! No kidding! It would be funny if it wasn't so expectantly true. Dummkopf's!

Running it below the $kyway through the entire length of the Southbank line, then excusing it with Surya's, "$kyway is for Auto users and BRT is for Transit users..." fairytale is irresponsible and courting another mass transit disaster. Work with DOT on the overland bridge project and seize Gary Street for use as a BRT ONLY corridor across the Southbank. Buses could come and go from the Acosta Bridge to Palm Avenue, which runs just east of the Baptist Hospital complex ducking under I-95 at the foot of the Fuller Warren Bridge, where it intersects Gary Street. Gary Street runs east on and off (it's no longer in regular use and has some sections removed) all the way to Kings Avenue. In my design the buses would cross Kings and swing under I-95 bridge turning northward into the Kings Avenue Station. From Kings Avenue Station, the buses would loop around and head south on Kings or Hendricks, dispersing to many parts of the city's Southside.

The $kyway would serve the Southbank on the North and East, and BRT would serve it via the Gary St. Busway, on the West (Palm) and South (Gary). Maybe this is just to easy for the crew at JTA? Could it be they just can't read "Flying Monkey Script?"


OCKLAWAHA

CS Foltz

December 20, 2009, 07:57:21 AM

Since when can "Flying Monkeys" read Ock? JTA is more interested in protecting its turf instead of presenting viable cost effective mass transit! Concrete is their only solution to congestion issue and less bus's.....no vision but lots of ineffective expensive plans! Sounds like the current Administration to me!
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